FU 2 Campus Girls

[Marty]

Sunday was not a bad day, I opened 4 girls and got 2 phone numbers. One responded to an icebreaker text, following a group opening, no less. At my stage of development, that's a pretty good haul.

Saturday, however, was another matter altogether. Two firm rejections after what had seemed like pleasant approach invitations.

After being unexpectedly rejected by my date for the morning, I decided to spend the afternoon on-campus at a private university just outside the city limits. Saturday is a little quiet there, admittedly; but while I have a reasonable and understanding employer, I don't think it'd go down too well if I skipped off of work regularly on the afternoons to do campus day-game for several hours. I squeeze enough street work into my lunch-break already

The campus bookstore was practically empty; after a trawl of the section with academic buildings that yielded nothing, I headed into the park that contains the President's residence. A number of girls were there; some were with boyfriends, some were in groups and looked satisfied with each other's company and I didn't like to impose. But after looping the lake, I saw a very young girl bounding down the hill, 18-19, petite and with long, dark brown hair, sweating profusely in her minimalist running kit and flushed in all visible places with her exertions Her legs were a little on the chubby side, but her youth made up for it, even to the point of being endearing—chaps nearer my age will know what I mean

As she passed, she actually looked me up and down and smiled. "Well hello!" I called, but she was past. She turned and took a steep uphill forest path. I snickered as I watched her struggle with it, then give up and start walking, clearly unaccustomed to this level of self-discipline. She could really lose a few pounds from those thighs... but I'd rather she held on to the extra weight just for the next couple years

I turned back and took a look at a map displayed for the convenience of the public. "Forest Trail—1.3 miles; Lake Loop—.8 miles". Okay, 2.1 miles total... hmmm, should keep her occupied for a bit, rate she's going. I sat and keyed out an email reply to my father on my iPhone. 15-20 minutes later, along she came, predictably huffing and puffing! (At twice her age, I could have done it in half that time.)

• Marty: Why don't you stop and take a rest?
  
  PlumpLegs: I ... (breathless) I'm running...
  
  Marty: No no, I can see you're struggling. Stop and walk for a bit, talk with me.
  
  PlumpLegs: Okay. (Breaks stride)
  
  Marty: What's your name?
  
  PlumpLegs: PlumpLegs.
  
  Marty: Hey PlumpLegs, I'm Marty. (Take her hand)
  
  PlumpLegs: It was nice to meet you! Well, I'd better—
  
  Marty: No no no. I saw you trying to get up that hill path a while back. You're not used to this, you need to take it easy.
  
  PlumpLegs: I'm trying to build up stamina.
  
  Marty: Haha! So what are you studying?
  
  PlumpLegs: Creative Writing.
  
  Marty: I take it you're an undergraduate at the university here...
  
  PlumpLegs: That's right.
  
  Marty: Creative Writing! My goodness. So how many pages of prose have you cumulatively turned out, since you began your course?
  
  PlumpLegs: I only just started, I'm in my freshman year actually. Let me see... 50 or so.
  
  Marty: 50! ...and what genre of fiction do you write? Who are your most inspirational authors?
  
  PlumpLegs: (noncommittal response)
  
  Marty: It's very competitive, but a good life if you make it... churning out bestsellers and living wherever you want.
  
  PlumpLegs: Yeah, maybe I'll write the next Harry Potter... but it's very tough. My parents were against it.

Obviously, this leads to a deep-dive for a few minutes on her family background and personal aspirations. I also compliment her on her golden eye-shadow which matches the highlights in her otherwise-dark hair. Very classy, actually. Then:

• 
  PlumpLegs: Well, I'd better press on with my running.
  
  Marty: We should grab a coffee soon, when you're not in the middle of your workout.
  
  PlumpLegs: Yes, I'm sure I'll see you around at the park!
  
  Marty: I doubt that very much. You'd better leave me your cell phone number.
  
  PlumpLegs: I don't think so...
  
  Marty: Why not? Are you not attracted to me?
  
  PlumpLegs: I'm dating someone...
  
  Marty: Dating someone! Well, it needn't be anything serious. We can just see how things go!
  
  PlumpLegs: Yeah, I'm sure I'll see you around!
  
  Marty: It would be easier if you left me your contact details.
  
  PlumpLegs: No, I'll see you next time at the park!
  
  Marty: Very unlikely. Nice talking with you anyway! (She trudges off at a pace scarcely above a fast walk, youthful ass bobbling attractively.)

Clearly a brush-off, but could I have better built upon the initial indication of interest?

20 minutes later, I was walking back through the main campus when I noticed a girl sitting studying at an outdoor table. I turned onto the little path that took me right past where she was sitting; she closed a textbook emblazoned with CHEMISTRY on the cover, and looked up at me with alluring brown eyes, sparkling with amusement... Once. Twice. Three times—and with smile!

• 
  NaturalScientist: Is there something I can help you find?
  
  Marty: I don't need any help, but may I take a seat?

I sat, we introduced ourselves, and she tells me about her studies. Chemistry is for her apparently a "feeder course"—I asked what that means, and she explained that it was basic knowledge required for a more specialized scientific study in the later part of her degree. She asked me what brought me to the university, and I explained that I had visited the bookstore and park. Then she gathered her belongings as if to leave.

• 
  Marty: Are you in a hurry somewhere?
  
  NaturalScientist: Well, I was actually... but what did you have in mind exactly?
  
  Marty: I don't want to keep you when you're in a hurry... Would you like to have coffee with me some time when you're not in such a rush?
  
  NaturalScientist: I think I'm good. But thank you!

Yet again I acted on very obvious eye-contact initiated by the girl, yet was slapped down.

Does anyone understand what is going on in these scenarios? Thank you!

-Marty

 

[Teparus]

PlumpLegs: I'm trying to build up stamina.
Marty: Haha! So what are you studying?

This was definitely a bad point. It doesn't follow, seems kind of graspy. It's like your head isn't in the conversation. My biggest recommendation? More social momentum.

If you spend a lot of time in your head, this can be a big problem -- it's definitely something I've been guilty of for a long time. It did eventually get you to a deep dive, but the roundabout path to get there probably left a weird taste in her mouth.

Marty: Why not? Are you not attracted to me?
PlumpLegs: I'm dating someone...

I winced. Don't ask that. If you have to ask her if she's not attracted to you, you are going to beat her attraction to you to a pulp. I'd even say, "Don't ask women why not," at least usually. Predict their fears and assuage them.

I can't, however, tell you what I'd do in that situation and expect it to succeed. I think that a better response would be something like, "I'd like to see you again, but I probably never will, unless we exchange contact information."

She might turn you down in that case, and chase recently put up an article about "parting shots" -- I'd deliver mine, then. However, those sorts of things only work when you've established some rapport.

I will make another guess: If she's running in the park, and you were, say, stationary and talked to her both times she came by...well, it seems kind of like you're a thirsty male who is hiding the banana, as it were.

Overall? Focus on:
1. Maintain conversational threads, don't ignore what she says and jump topics.
2. Assume attraction, take risks, etc -- but don't get flustered and beg.
3. Have some reason for being where you are. It will make everything seem more natural.



I have some good news on the second one, though -- she was initially very into you...but she needed you to try harder/be more persistent, is all.

When you got to this part:

NaturalScientist: Well, I was actually... but what did you have in mind exactly?

This sounds like a girl who is hooked. You have a lot more sway over her. You could go one of two routes:
1. Tell her to stay with you and talk more. Say you're enjoying your time with her, she is too, etc. The fact that she asked what you have in mind means she's still quite interested.
2. Be more persistent in cases like this. Once you're at the point where a girl is clearly interested in your offers, she'll often be amenable to something more, but needs to feel like it wasn't too easy.

I think Chase put it this way, once:
If a strapping young man is courting an fair maiden, and he says to her:
"My beautiful darling! Won't you please come down from your father's balcony and have a walk by the riverside with me?"
And she were to say:
"I cannot! It would be amiss! My father is away and has told me to stay at home, and I hardly know you!"
He would NOT say:
"Oh, okay."
He would ALSO not say:
"Aren't you attracted to me?"
But he MIGHT say:
"I love your company so! Come down and join me! The waterfront is as beautiful as you are, the night is young, and life so short! Come enjoy this wonderful evening with me!"

In modern times, I'd say it'd go more like this:
You: "Come get coffee with me."
Her: "I don't know...I think I'm good."
You: "I want you to get coffee with me. I've loved this conversation and I think I'd like more of it." (I will often include in this a physical gesture to draw her in: taking her hands and guiding her to something, smiling really big, moving towards her...some sort of injection of physical presence and gentle dominance)
Her: "I don't know...I hardly know you!"
You: "You'll never get to know me if you don't join me. And I know a great cafe not far from campus..."
Her: "Well..."
You: "I insist. Here's my phone. Put yourself in. What does your schedule look like over the next few days? Surely you have a free hour or two."
Her: "I guess I have some time, and I did like talking to you. Sure. I'm free yadda yadda blah blah..."

The key here? Persistence. It's pretty rare that women require *no* persistence from a guy, and honestly, not anywhere near as fun.

So, your lesson from your second approach: Once you have them hooked, persist harder. I am about 90% certain you could have at least gotten coffee with that second girl if you'd pushed a bit harder / addressed her underlying concerns.

 

[Marty]

Hey Haraklus!

Welcome (I see that you're relatively new) and thank you for commenting on my fuck-up report. I read your post on the board-game girl, good stuff. I'm sure I can learn a lot from you.

I'd even say, "Don't ask women why not," at least usually.

You mean asking for feedback after a failed date is also inadvisable? Just in order to learn for future encounters (with others)...

"I cannot! It would be amiss! My father is away and has told me to stay at home, and I hardly know you!"
He would NOT say:
"Oh, okay."

This is an excellent point, and thank you for reminding me that I need to work on this.

well, it seems kind of like you're a thirsty male who is hiding the banana, as it were.

I'll be honest: I'm struggling to see how—

• Cold-approaching a girl in broad daylight
• Gaining compliance for her to walk with me when she was running before
• Deep-diving her with some success
• Complimenting her upon her appearance
• And asking outright for a date

—can possibly be interpreted as "hiding the banana".

I must admit, though, campus game is harder than I'd imagined. I've gotten a few numbers, but never a date off of a campus approach. Intuitively, I supposed that the logical sequence was something like Girls are younger → Less experienced → Easier to reel in, but it doesn't seem to work that way: they're surprisingly resistant.

Maybe it's because they figure they have plenty of time yet to find a suitable gentleman, while once they're into their careers, their time is practically running out already.

-Marty

 

[Teparus]

Regarding the hiding the banana point:
I missed the eye shadow compliment the first time I read it. Banana hiding comment retracted.

I think that the #1 thing you need to work on is persistence in situations where she's clearly into you, such as girl #2. If you get persistence right, you will pull with very little else changing, I suspect. I saw this in another FU of yours, as well -- you seemed to have her, but just didn't persist. Women don't want to look or feel easy.

I'm going to give you a phrase that I heard somewhere and memorized that's helped me:
She resists, he persists.

Burn that into your mind whenever a girl seems charmed and taken in but resists your advances. It gives you your script. She just resisted, and now it's your job to persist until she either gives in or cools off.

Secondary to that would be somewhat more natural conversation threading, but that isn't really killing your interactions, whereas the lack of persistence has cost you at least two dates/possible pulls in just 3 reports of yours I read.

You mean asking for feedback after a failed date is also inadvisable? Just in order to learn for future encounters (with others)...

With regards to this point...as a rule, asking her what she liked or what she didn't is different from asking her why not. I'm catching up with the material on this site, but I recently read something by Chase that I agree with, and it goes like this -- if you ask a girl why she can't do something, you force her to stop and solidify those reasons in her mind. You draw attention to the reasons she doesn't want to do something. You want to reasons for her to join you to be on her mind, not reasons for her not to join you.

Often, if you just insist that she join you for coffee or a drink or walk with you, she'll name an unconscious objection or two that you can then disarm, but she won't force herself to conjure up new ones.

 

[Marty]

Hey Haraklus,

You are opening new vistas to me

She just resisted, and now it's your job to persist until she either gives in or cools off ... the lack of persistence has cost you at least two dates/possible pulls in just 3 reports of yours I read.

Often, if you just insist that she join you for coffee or a drink or walk with you, she'll name an unconscious objection or two that you can then disarm, but she won't force herself to conjure up new ones.

I guess I was feeling, why keep pestering an uninterested girl to do something, and get on her nerves, when I can always go out tomorrow and open a new girl?

I still don't really understand it, but like so many other aspects of this subject I'll have to take it on trust. It's odd: I never change my mind about things like that. An unattractive girl could never convince me to like her, nor could an attractive one put me off liking her no matter how rude and cold she was. I guess I must be right in the center of that gray area between attractive and unattractive for girls to be so on-the-fence about me.

-Marty