Hey guys, recently I've done something and just upped how women perceive me. I mean my fundamentals are on point and the girls are just coming like moths. At the same time I feel like with the image being presented is higher than my current level of game. Have any of you guys experienced this where you feel like women are expecting you to approach perfectly because of your fundamentals but you are not. What did you do? Any tips?
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I agree with you. That's likely a case of your strong, tight fundamentals being of a higher quality/caliber than the approach/opener/convo part of your game. So in your case, and I would say in mine, is the perfect image and fundamentals you've crafted may not be fitting what the actual product is (perception vs reality). My fundamentals are tight and get loads of IOIs but when I talk I realize I have a gap between fundamentals and jive talking so I take the less is more approach and exit convos early (by that I mean I initiate the convo ending and no girl ever gives me the "why are we still talking I thought the convo died like 5 min ago?!" vibe) and I don't use 20 words when only 10 are needed...in general I try to have a "leave her wanting more" mindset.
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Damn! I'd love to know what sort of things you think upped your fundamentals to the next level as I have the opposite problem 
Specific books, articles even people in movies?
Specific books, articles even people in movies?- Joined
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For me it was all girlschase.com. Read all the articles about non-verbals. Because of this site I'm always aware of:
- my body language. Am I projecting weak body language or dominant? I'm always conscious to stand with dominant posture, taking up space.
- eye contact. When a girl looks at me I hold the gaze until she looks away.
- walk. My walk is a cross between a male models walk and a walk as if I'm going to attack you. It's very determined. I also visualize - and this gonna sound real stupid but it works - me walking away from explosions or something exploding behind me like in every action movie. Where the hero throws a grenade at something and turns to walk away from it without looking at it and then it explodes and it's always in slow motion. Well I visualize that every time I walk. It helps to increase your dominant mindset.
- wardrobe. I'm normally dressed with a nice style.
But keep reading the articles here you'll pick up lots of good stuff.
- my body language. Am I projecting weak body language or dominant? I'm always conscious to stand with dominant posture, taking up space.
- eye contact. When a girl looks at me I hold the gaze until she looks away.
- walk. My walk is a cross between a male models walk and a walk as if I'm going to attack you. It's very determined. I also visualize - and this gonna sound real stupid but it works - me walking away from explosions or something exploding behind me like in every action movie. Where the hero throws a grenade at something and turns to walk away from it without looking at it and then it explodes and it's always in slow motion. Well I visualize that every time I walk. It helps to increase your dominant mindset.
- wardrobe. I'm normally dressed with a nice style.
But keep reading the articles here you'll pick up lots of good stuff.
Congruency... You appear better than you are. If a guy puts expensive business clothes on, polished shoes, watches and tie on and start working for a law firm, most people will expect that he is a successful lawyer. However, the second he opens his mouth everybody realizes that he has no clue about law. That's usually the moment when sort of disappointment comes, people were expecting more than they got because he appears like an attorney, but he is not... So they ask, why is he faking his appearance? Why is he pretending to be someone else when he is not...? They expected too much from him based on his appearance, yet he can't deliver any of that expectation...
Some people are very good at reading body language, they can read very quickly through personalities...
Similarly, you don't want to overshoot your appearance with girls. If you project strong and dominant body language while you are really not that dominant guy, there is sort of disappointment. She realizes that you are not who you are pretending to be. Some girls are VERY FAST in reading body language and recognizing congruence. They usually give you one quick window pretty much right at the beginning of your interaction, and if you don't start moving forward right away there they know you are faking, or they at least DOWNGRADE you to less dominant guy in their mind (which is still sort of disappointment)... They know you are projecting too much of a great lover, yet can't deliver even perhaps half...
You want to BE that guy, you don't want to pretend to be... A better way is downgrade your appearance and dominance first, just enough to level than she notices you... Then you show dominance with your actions (rather than appearance), this way she didn't expect much from interaction with you at first, but because of your dominant actions she now has to UPGRADE you to more of a lover in her mind, as you actually do things that only confident men can do...
Some people are very good at reading body language, they can read very quickly through personalities...
Similarly, you don't want to overshoot your appearance with girls. If you project strong and dominant body language while you are really not that dominant guy, there is sort of disappointment. She realizes that you are not who you are pretending to be. Some girls are VERY FAST in reading body language and recognizing congruence. They usually give you one quick window pretty much right at the beginning of your interaction, and if you don't start moving forward right away there they know you are faking, or they at least DOWNGRADE you to less dominant guy in their mind (which is still sort of disappointment)... They know you are projecting too much of a great lover, yet can't deliver even perhaps half...
You want to BE that guy, you don't want to pretend to be... A better way is downgrade your appearance and dominance first, just enough to level than she notices you... Then you show dominance with your actions (rather than appearance), this way she didn't expect much from interaction with you at first, but because of your dominant actions she now has to UPGRADE you to more of a lover in her mind, as you actually do things that only confident men can do...
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That's true and not true Drck. Attraction starts with appearance first and foremost. So you want the outward appearance to be on point so as to attract the largest number of prospects possible. You won't even get your foot in the door slouching, avoiding eye contact and looking away at the moment your eyes meet and dressed like a bum. It just won't happen. It's not a matter of faking it or pretending to be something you're not - it's putting your best foot forward and sharpening up your nonverbals so that attraction and interest start from across the room instead of having to do a song and dance to get w girl to start digging you. Attraction for me starts from the moment I walk into the room. What do you think is easier - cold approaching a girl hurriedly walking to wherever she's going or getting an IOI from a girl across the bar because you stand out as a man among boys? It's easier to approach the girl who gave you the IOI (at least it is for me). I don't think I or the OP is saying we mumble and fart once we approach lol. I know I eject early rather than linger (I hate lingerers myself), I leave positive impressions and to do that you need to have a good feel for when the convo is slowing down and eject.
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For the record Drck you're one of the posters in this forum who's posts I look forward to reading, this is probably one of those neither one of us is right or wrong. But I love reading your stuff and I've picked up a lot from your posts.
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Yeah...
Women want me to approach them and fuck them, but i can't fuck them right on the spot. If you ever hang out with me and you see this, you see the polarizing reaction where women want you to approach them and then if you don't do anything, her response to you just go out flat cold.
Doesn't matter in social circles or work or not. So much for "equality". -.- It is more like i want penis NOW!
p.s: I can't figure the flat cold response. Logically, no. Dating knowledge, yes i know why.
Zac
Women want me to approach them and fuck them, but i can't fuck them right on the spot. If you ever hang out with me and you see this, you see the polarizing reaction where women want you to approach them and then if you don't do anything, her response to you just go out flat cold.
Doesn't matter in social circles or work or not. So much for "equality". -.- It is more like i want penis NOW!
p.s: I can't figure the flat cold response. Logically, no. Dating knowledge, yes i know why.
Zac
Yea, it is all relative. Sometimes it is like playing cards, you don't want to show the others all the cards at once, you sort of have to build up upon the initial expectation that you have good cards in your hands...
If she sees sexy and attractive guy who shows some interest in her, she sort of wants to discover how far and how fast is he is willing to go. He then sort of have to live up to his appearance, because if she expects that he sleeps with lots of girls yet he is having hard time to ask her for a phone number, well, the magic is simply gone...
If she sees sexy and attractive guy who shows some interest in her, she sort of wants to discover how far and how fast is he is willing to go. He then sort of have to live up to his appearance, because if she expects that he sleeps with lots of girls yet he is having hard time to ask her for a phone number, well, the magic is simply gone...
Zack kind of hit the nail on this. My intended meaning was misunderstood. I meant that, when you approach and the girls want you to fuck them right then and there. Most of the time I can't because I'd be on my way doing something else. Lol that's what I meant.
About the clothing part I'd be wearing shit clothes that I don't like but my body language would be good.
About the clothing part I'd be wearing shit clothes that I don't like but my body language would be good.
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Raqimus-
Yeah, that was me all through high school and college. I was pretty down about it at one point since I had zero ability with women yet all these people thought I was a player. I took my first bootcamp after discovering pickup and my instructor was pretty shocked I wasn't already doing well with women.
It's a good problem to have though - what I discovered was it's mainly about letting go of the fear and just plunging in. Try to take big leaps forward with girls and see what happens. Polarize. You'll get plenty of grimaces / disappointed reactions from girls who thought you were going to walk up and be Mr. Smooth, but as you go along you'll start to get things right and get fewer and fewer of those negative reactions. And eventually your game catches up with your appearance.
Just put this into your head: bold moves and big leaps. She isn't expecting someone shy, nervous, or tentative, so go for gold right out of the gate and see what happens. You'll be rough around the edges and less refined than women are expecting at first, but those edges will smooth out as you get better at anticipating what sort of jumps you need to make.
Eventually it turns into your regular approach with girls and it stops being leaps and jumps for the most part, and you just go in fully leveraging your fundamentals and pulling off quicker pickups with less deliberation on the girl's part.
Chase
Yeah, that was me all through high school and college. I was pretty down about it at one point since I had zero ability with women yet all these people thought I was a player. I took my first bootcamp after discovering pickup and my instructor was pretty shocked I wasn't already doing well with women.
It's a good problem to have though - what I discovered was it's mainly about letting go of the fear and just plunging in. Try to take big leaps forward with girls and see what happens. Polarize. You'll get plenty of grimaces / disappointed reactions from girls who thought you were going to walk up and be Mr. Smooth, but as you go along you'll start to get things right and get fewer and fewer of those negative reactions. And eventually your game catches up with your appearance.
Just put this into your head: bold moves and big leaps. She isn't expecting someone shy, nervous, or tentative, so go for gold right out of the gate and see what happens. You'll be rough around the edges and less refined than women are expecting at first, but those edges will smooth out as you get better at anticipating what sort of jumps you need to make.
Eventually it turns into your regular approach with girls and it stops being leaps and jumps for the most part, and you just go in fully leveraging your fundamentals and pulling off quicker pickups with less deliberation on the girl's part.
Chase
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BUMP
Chase has great stuff here.
Chase has great stuff here.