Handling situations where the girl messes up

[Bifrost]

This has happened to me a few times now where at some point the girl has done something incongruent that seems to derail the seduction. I'd like to know if there's a general approach to apply when this happens to stop the seduction tanking for both of you as a result. I'm not talking about tests/resistance, but literally situations where you look back in an analytical way and think "huh, that was really weird of her".

I recall there was an article where Chase mentioned he'd number closed a girl in a club and agreed to meet with her later, but then she came back and asked something along the lines of "Do you know where we can get some weed?"; his thoughts at that moment being "Dang it, she's coming back again and now she's going to mess everything up". Don't remember the name of the article.
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For TL;DR, see the paragraph with italics below.

My most recent example from this past week: There's a new girl at work who I've gotten to know over the past couple of months on the bus ride in. She seems very introverted, but has always lit up whenever she sees me and has been super open in our conversations. She'll come sit next to me on the bus whenever she sees me as she gets on. If she doesn't (she's usually wearing headphones and looking at her phone when she gets on), she'll come bounding up as soon as we both get off - seeing that I was actually on the bus - to complete the walk into the office.

My schedule has been super cluttered since the start of the year and so I haven't had a chance to ask her out. Finally, now that my schedule had opened up this past week, I had planned to ask her out. The plan was: 1) She sits next to me on the bus -> longer chat into asking her for a cafe visit+walk; 2) If she only sees me once we both get off (we have ~2 min before getting into the office, so I need to be quick), I'd instead propose a coffee break in the office -> at the coffee break, ask her out a la cafe visit+walk. Option 2 is what ended up happening, to which she enthusiastically agreed.

I put a short slot in our calendars for the afternoon of the same day when we both had plenty of time. About 20 min before, she flaked with a message saying "Hey, Bifrost. I'm so sorry, but I won't be able to make our coffee session. My workload just got really heavy. Let's plan for another time soon!" I responded with a chill message, essentially telling her it was no big deal and we'd find another slot at some point.

The next morning, I took the same bus again. I saw her get on, but she was enthralled in her phone and was chatting to it and so went upstairs on the bus instead. When I got off, after walking for a bit, I realized she hadn't caught up yet. I looked back over my shoulder and saw she was very far back - like deliberately hanging back where the bus stop was and almost only shuffling forward - still looking at and chatting to her phone. I thought "huh, strange", but not too much else. So, a couple of hours after I got in, I rescheduled the coffee catch-up in our calendars and also sent her a message saying "Hey I've rescheduled our session for XX time tomorrow. Let me know if this is good or another slot works better for you." The slot rolls around and she flakes again about 10 min before, with no message this time.

It was very weird behaviour on her part and so I'm left scratching my head a bit. I'm probably just going to leave it for a couple weeks at the moment, but I'm not really sure what to make of the situation or how to re-engage.

 

[Will_V]

This has happened to me a few times now where at some point the girl has done something incongruent that seems to derail the seduction. I'd like to know if there's a general approach to apply when this happens to stop the seduction tanking for both of you as a result. I'm not talking about tests/resistance, but literally situations where you look back in an analytical way and think "huh, that was really weird of her".

I recall there was an article where Chase mentioned he'd number closed a girl in a club and agreed to meet with her later, but then she came back and asked something along the lines of "Do you know where we can get some weed?"; his thoughts at that moment being "Dang it, she's coming back again and now she's going to mess everything up". Don't remember the name of the article.
_____
For TL;DR, see the paragraph with italics below.

My most recent example from this past week: There's a new girl at work who I've gotten to know over the past couple of months on the bus ride in. She seems very introverted, but has always lit up whenever she sees me and has been super open in our conversations. She'll come sit next to me on the bus whenever she sees me as she gets on. If she doesn't (she's usually wearing headphones and looking at her phone when she gets on), she'll come bounding up as soon as we both get off - seeing that I was actually on the bus - to complete the walk into the office.

My schedule has been super cluttered since the start of the year and so I haven't had a chance to ask her out. Finally, now that my schedule had opened up this past week, I had planned to ask her out. The plan was: 1) She sits next to me on the bus -> longer chat into asking her for a cafe visit+walk; 2) If she only sees me once we both get off (we have ~2 min before getting into the office, so I need to be quick), I'd instead propose a coffee break in the office -> at the coffee break, ask her out a la cafe visit+walk. Option 2 is what ended up happening, to which she enthusiastically agreed.

I put a short slot in our calendars for the afternoon of the same day when we both had plenty of time. About 20 min before, she flaked with a message saying "Hey, Bifrost. I'm so sorry, but I won't be able to make our coffee session. My workload just got really heavy. Let's plan for another time soon!" I responded with a chill message, essentially telling her it was no big deal and we'd find another slot at some point.

The next morning, I took the same bus again. I saw her get on, but she was enthralled in her phone and was chatting to it and so went upstairs on the bus instead. When I got off, after walking for a bit, I realized she hadn't caught up yet. I looked back over my shoulder and saw she was very far back - like deliberately hanging back where the bus stop was and almost only shuffling forward - still looking at and chatting to her phone. I thought "huh, strange", but not too much else. So, a couple of hours after I got in, I rescheduled the coffee catch-up in our calendars and also sent her a message saying "Hey I've rescheduled our session for XX time tomorrow. Let me know if this is good or another slot works better for you." The slot rolls around and she flakes again about 10 min before, with no message this time.

It was very weird behaviour on her part and so I'm left scratching my head a bit. I'm probably just going to leave it for a couple weeks at the moment, but I'm not really sure what to make of the situation or how to re-engage.

This doesn't sound like her messing up, it sounds like her behavior toward you changed after you asked her out.

Are you her manager, or up the totem pole relative to her? If so, this makes things tricky for a few reasons:

1. Girls tend to show attention/enthusiasm to guys in positions of authority around them which can be mistaken for attraction, or, if she is attracted, that attraction can be easy to overestimate.

2. She knows that if things turn sour between you, she's in a vulnerable position in terms of her career.

3. She also knows that for as long as you want her, she has the upper hand and can benefit from that greatly, but if you lose interest (or get everything you want from her) that advantage disappears.

This means women tend to cultivate platonic relationships with guys in immediate positions of authority, where he likes her and gives her favors, and she in turn makes him feel good and look good to everyone by being all sweet and enthusiastic with him, but often nothing eventuates.

It's why a lot of guys who try to use power and authority to get women end up frustrated - it seems like it would be easy to get her, and she seems interested, but he can't move the needle.

And it's why seduction is usually a lot easier when everything is incognito - you are a mysterious stranger, she's a tourist somewhere, things get hot real fast and you both have your fun, and then everyone goes back to playing the long game in their respective social circles.

My main suggestion for you in these situations is to keep everything as casual and lowkey as possible. The message you want to give her is "all this is just fun and chemistry, and has no bearing on anything. I don't take it seriously". Almost as if you're just giving her some space to show you what she wants, rather than you showing her that you want her.

Slotting out time on a calendar sounds very formal - you're essentially rearranging your and her schedule for the date. That makes it seem very serious and officious, and puts pressure on her - what do you expect from her in return?

Probably better would be to just ask her if she's got twenty minutes for a coffee after work, or something like that.

As for what to do now, do NOT chase her and do NOT show disappointment. You gotta treat it like 'eh this girl was all sweet before, now she's not, maybe she'll be sweet tomorrow, maybe not, whatever!' like a cat that loves you one day, hates you the next day, and is ambivalent toward you the day after that.

If my read on the situation so far is correct, then she's the one who will have to make moves to re-establish the relationship she wants, because she remains in a position where she wants to have your good graces (and whatever else she wants with you). But if you get reactive to her behavior, not only is it going to be bad for her attraction toward you, she'll know that she's already got you in a position that's advantageous for her.

 

[Chad Tyrone]

This has happened to me a few times now where at some point the girl has done something incongruent that seems to derail the seduction. I'd like to know if there's a general approach to apply when this happens to stop the seduction tanking for both of you as a result.

Girls may do things that throw a wrench in the seduction ,at times .That happens but you've got to know how to turn things around and move things forward again which comes down to your game. There is really not a general approach to it .It's just a a matter of figuring out what's derailing the seduction and coming up with ways to move it forward.

A couple mentalities to have:

What Role Should Women Play in the Mating Game?

Commenting on “What to Do When a Girl Won’t Go Home with You”, Blogster asks about what women’s responsibilities are in the mating game and where a man must “draw the line” when it comes to trying to make a girl his: “Do take your point on this one. However, at what point does all the game...

www.girlschase.com

https://www.girlschase.com/content/girls-silly-and-cute

Other articles that will help-

10 Glaring Signs When You've Blown It on a Date

If you can't tell when you've blown it, it's very hard to fix mistakes. Look for these 10 signs to always be able to tell when you've lost a girl (and why). Over the years of coaching men to do well with women, I've spotted many key differences between the men who learn fast and the men who...

www.girlschase.com

Cracking Tough Cases

Every now and again, a guy will meet a girl who seems really great, but despite his best efforts, he just can’t make anything happen with her. It can be very frustrating – especially when it’s a girl he knows well and cares about, and with whom he has a great connection, and whom he maybe even...

www.girlschase.com

I recall there was an article where Chase mentioned he'd number closed a girl in a club and agreed to meet with her later, but then she came back and asked something along the lines of "Do you know where we can get some weed?"; his thoughts at that moment being "Dang it, she's coming back again and now she's going to mess everything up". Don't remember the name of the article.

But that was really about getting a one second chance rather than the girl "messing" it up

You Only Get One Second Chance

Talk’s over and she’s gone away. Then there she is: she re-approaches you. Get the re-approach right and she’s yours. But mess up, and, well... Cold approach is hard. You get a brief moment with a stranger, and if you do well she gives you some windows. Sometimes things reach a natural end...

www.girlschase.com

My most recent example from this past week: There's a new girl at work who I've gotten to know over the past couple of months on the bus ride in. She seems very introverted, but has always lit up whenever she sees me and has been super open in our conversations. She'll come sit next to me on the bus whenever she sees me as she gets on. If she doesn't (she's usually wearing headphones and looking at her phone when she gets on), she'll come bounding up as soon as we both get off - seeing that I was actually on the bus - to complete the walk into the office.

I'll say this girls tend to slow game or friend zone you when you've become a fixture in their lives.

And reactions don't mean much. I've seen girls all bubbly and snuggly with acquaintances of mine ...heck call each other babes yet they'd never go to bed with these guys.

Sorry if that came off as me knocking on you.

So, a couple of hours after I got in, I rescheduled the coffee catch-up in our calendars and also sent her a message saying "Hey I've rescheduled our session for XX time tomorrow. Let me know if this is good or another slot works better for you." The slot rolls around and she flakes again about 10 min before, with no message this time.

You still have got to figure out what time she's free before setting up a date,even when rescheduling

It was very weird behaviour on her part and so I'm left scratching my head a bit. I'm probably just going to leave it for a couple weeks at the moment, but I'm not really sure what to make of the situation or how to re-engage.

Tactics Tuesdays: Running Into Girls Who Ghosted You

How should you act when you meet a girl who ghosted you? Avoid her? Hold her feet to the fire? No... you must be COOLER than this. Sometimes, a girl will ghost you. Happens to everyone. Nothing to be ashamed about. She was excited when you met her. Maybe she agreed to a date. Then when you got...

www.girlschase.com

That may help.

I will agree with @Will_V though that seduction is better when incognito.It's easy to chase girls in tricky situations when you don't know what you are doing.

Anyway ,my two cents...bigger-picture wise

Chad Tyrone

 

[Bifrost]

This doesn't sound like her messing up, it sounds like her behavior toward you changed after you asked her out.

That is the other thing I was thinking, but the hanging back thing still seemed incredibly weird - a real 180.

Are you her manager, or up the totem pole relative to her? If so, this makes things tricky for a few reasons:

1. Girls tend to show attention/enthusiasm to guys in positions of authority around them which can be mistaken for attraction, or, if she is attracted, that attraction can be easy to overestimate.

2. She knows that if things turn sour between you, she's in a vulnerable position in terms of her career.

3. She also knows that for as long as you want her, she has the upper hand and can benefit from that greatly, but if you lose interest (or get everything you want from her) that advantage disappears.

Not her manager or in her team, but could be seen as higher up the totem pole. Essentially, there’s a junior rotational scheme at the company which has an intake every year. This is the scheme she’s doing now and I did it myself a few years ago before becoming a permanent employee. Additionally, one of her friends on the intake this year is one of my (female) friends who did an internship in my team over a year ago (this mutual friend is now in a different team, but doesn't sit too far from me).

1) Yes, certainly, though I wouldn’t say I was overestimating in this case. A coffee chat in the office (during working hours – looks like I missed that detail in my first message) is a very normal, harmless thing for anyone at my company to do, regardless of who the two parties are. It definitely doesn’t or shouldn’t give off date vibes and I’m pretty sure I didn’t come off that way.

2) For sure, but given the context, I would say this is unlikely. Though, this is me speaking and not her.

3) Understandable, but not relevant in this situation as she’s in a different team and department and we would never cross paths normally.

With regards to the slotting the time out, this is the default way people set up informal chats at the office as it is quick and low effort. Messaging people with the chat system and asking when they’re free is usually only done if you can’t see when they have gaps in their calendar. You can also ask for spontaneous meetup via chat messages, but that is usually very hit and miss since people’s workloads are variable.

I would have definitely asked her for a café + walk outside of work instead had she sat next to me on the bus that morning and we would’ve had a bit more time to chat.

Knowing what I know about her personality, I have a feeling that maybe she saw the slot and started psyching herself out in the lead-up to it. So, to avoid getting too nervous about it, the easiest thing to do was to just cancel the slot in the first place to put a brake on whatever she was feeling, but this is just a hunch on my part. Still seems odd though that she would then go so far out of her way the next day to avoid talking for even a couple of minutes.

As for what to do now, do NOT chase her and do NOT show disappointment. You gotta treat it like 'eh this girl was all sweet before, now she's not, maybe she'll be sweet tomorrow, maybe not, whatever!' like a cat that loves you one day, hates you the next day, and is ambivalent toward you the day after that.

Good advice, and this is what I was planning. I have a bit of trouble holding myself together in the moment when it seems a girl’s interest has tanked (even though logically it doesn’t actually bug me much anymore) and I’m speaking to the girl again, but it’s just a matter of me keeping my cool and not taking anything too seriously.

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But that was really about getting a one second chance rather than the girl "messing" it up

Ah, that was it! Just gave the article another read through. It’s a bit of a different situation since the article focuses on cold approach whereas mine is more extended social circle, but the tips in there still have relevance to this situation.

I’ll read the other mentality article suggestions too as I could probably do with a refresher there.

And reactions don't mean much. I've seen girls all bubbly and snuggly with acquaintances of mine ...heck call each other babes yet they'd never go to bed with these guys.

Sorry if that came off as me knocking on you.

Very true and no, definitely not a knock as a lot of guys still can’t get past that and they need reminding. Though, I’m quite confident in my instincts now when it comes to gauging girls’ attraction.

You still have got to figure out what time she's free before setting up a date,even when rescheduling

Also true, and something I would do normally had it been texting to set up something outside of work. As I mention earlier in this reply, it is quicker and lower effort to just drop/change a slot in someone’s calendar at the company. Both times I put the slot in (an afternoon), her calendar was completely free and the first time (when she verbally agreed) she accepted that I'd find a slot when she didn't have any meetings. Of course, I could've still maybe messaged to figure out what time was good before picking a slot, but with changeable work schedules, things can come up on short notice (for either party) anyway and so as you get closer to the planned slot the probability of it being a successful time ends up being the same.

Perhaps I still could have asked her schedule in advance (both times) via chat message. The worst result is that she just wouldn’t have replied to the message. My feeling though is that that type of message exchange would have given off more datey vibes rather than those for just a chill chat, which I was not going for with a catch-up in the office. It was meant to be a bridge to the ask out above.

Thank you very much for the quick and thorough replies!