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FR++  HB7 Needy to non-needy, pull, LMR, Failed escalation

Tyme2k

Cro-Magnon Man
Cro-Magnon Man
Joined
Feb 9, 2013
Messages
386
A little background: Met this girl at a bar with a few RSD PUA guys. They were all gaming I was more so socializing. Opened a girl they had been talking to who at the time I thought was cute. We connected right off the bat, but I didn't do anything to lead besides verbally directing the conversation where I wanted it to go. A new friend of mine that I met that night was gaming her friend and they since went on multiple dates. Last I heard he too did not get passed 3rd base. I number closed my girl who this night was the hottest of the two.

I sent her multiple "Inviting" texts looking back it was WAY too much. My friend told me his girl told him my girl would hang out with me if I didn't text so much. I had already laid off the texting by this point, but it did make me look back at how it may have appeared. The funny part about it all is each time I wasn't asking for a "date" but just inviting her out. Reading the texts though it's not how it seems. I remember what was going through my head at the time, I wanted to secure a 3rb solid FB. In a sense I was coming from a scarcity mindset and coming accross needy since I wanted something from her. I should have been thinking about what I was going to give her instead. Here's the texts for reference so noobies can learn exactly how NOT to text:

Me 3/13 2:37a - (Name)! Save my number, kickin it soon - Tyler Mazininbed(told her I would text her something funny to save my name as)

Me 3/15 11:48a - Hey gurl, what u got going tonight?
Her 2:25p - Hey how are you? Tonight I have a BBQ in (town) that I'm going to.
Me 2:59p - I was just about to text u I'm busy tonight. Sunday, St. Patty's day tho, gonna be hella fun, lets meet up.(set up a date with FB after she didnt respond I believe)
Her 5:52p - Alright. Sounds fun

Me 3/16 6:31p - We're starting at (bar) tomorrow, my buddy is djing from 1-5. What r u up to tonight?
Her 6:39p - I'm working until 11. I had a pretty shitty day I might just be lame and go home.
Me 6:43p - Which job? If ur close come have abeer, unless ur hearts set on going home jilling off :p lol
Her 8:18p - I'm at (job), I'll let you know if I somehow feel significantly more interesting as a human.
Me 8:26p - Interesting choice of verbage, deep.. Hopefully ur day gets better
Her 8:36p - Haha thanks

Me 3/17 2:21p (ST. Patrick's day) - U work today?
Her 3/17 2:51p - Yea. I'm on my way now
Me 3:55p - Ooo what time u off?
Her 4:48p - At 11
Me 5:11p - :(
Her 6:37p - I know. Welcome to my life.
Me 7:28p - 7days. Gettin ur shit done tho :p, I'm at (bar) right now lol close to u

Me 3/18 1:29p - (Name)! Hey girl, hope ur good. U working late again? We should meet up tonight..
Me 3:28p - Actually can't tonight, ill be at (bar) tomorrow if u come thru there.(I think I sensed I was needy and dead air so I pointed out my time is valuable)
Her 6:17p - I'm sorry I'm just getting back to you I'll let you know about tomorrow. i hope you have a good night.

Me 3/19 8:20p - Hey! what u up to girlie? Wanted to go out but its rainin..still hungry tho we should go eat
Her 8:45p - On my way to the gym. Text you when I'm done.
me 10:01p - K
Her 12:26a - Hey I know it's super late but (friend) and I jsut came to (bar) if you wanted to join (I passed out lol)

Me 3/20 11:04a - 12 isn't usually late for me, been workin early this week tho. What u up to today?(OMG I'm coming accross soooo needy to this girl it's making me sick!)
her 11:14a - Work from now until 11 today and tomorrow.
Me 3:05p - Sucks, well ill be out tonight and tomorrow, let me know if u want to meet up
Her 6:14p - I will for sure.

Me 3/21 3:46p - Ey! So this weekend my buddy is doing stand up in (town) Saturday night, I think I can get free tickets if u and emily want to join. U workin late that night?
Me 3:55p - Shows at 1030 saturday
Her 5:10p - I totally want to!!! But my life is lame and I work until 12. What are you doing on Tuesday night? Let's hang out
Me 9:24 - Idk.. not sure if my life has any room for lame ppl ;p Lol what's ur schedule like Tuesday?(Finally I became back to me dropping the needy bullshit!)
Her 10:01p - Im off work at 10.

Me 3/22 11:14a - After 10 is perfect, I'm off wed so I won't pass out lol.
Her 2:27 - Cool. Sounds good.

Me 3/27 12:58p - Hey what's up? Didn't get to chill last night. U working late tonight?(the biggest time gap since we met, I met up with an FB instead anyway lol)
Her 2:27p - I do. Do you want to do something tomorrow night?
Me 3:42 - Like what time?
Her 4:13p - Is 11:15 too late?
Me 4:30p - When was the last time u saw the sun? Poor girl lol.. That's not too late. Lets meet at my place then walk somewhere
Her 5:00p - I wish I was outside right now! It's so beautiful. Text me your address and I'll meet you tomorrow.
Me 8:44p - (Address)

Me 3/28 9:20p - We still on for tonight?
Her 9:31p - For sure!! See you in a bit.( I grabbed some beer, since I was gonna just try and escalate at my place. Left my friends to head home for my "date")
Her 11:28p - Hey do you want to meet me at (bar)?
Me 11:33p - Where's that?
Her 11:33p - It's on (cross streets)
Me 11:39p - That's a bit far, meet closer?
Her 11:52p - Sure I'm going to have a drink here because it's my friends first night bar tending. Where do you want to meet.
Me 12:05a - (Bar) or you can come by when ur done.
Her 12:13a - Cool. I'll text you when I'm on my way.
Me 12:16a - K my place?

Me 3/30 5:37p - My friend has a booth tomorrow at(club). Come join us it will be carayzy! Just give me names for guest list (mass text sent to most of my girls I wanted to see)
Her 5:47p - That sounds fun. I would like to go. My roomate is having an art show at our house tonight. If you're not doing anything you should totally come.

Me 3/31 11:48a - Happy Easter! U gonna join tonight?
Her 12:14p - Hi! I think so just(Names for guest list)
Me 1:29p - K text me when ur almost there ill come out and get u past the line
Her 5:53p - Is it possible to add (names)? or is it too late?
Me 5:59p - Got them
Her 5:59p - Thank you so much!

Now this brings us to Easter Sunday at the club. This night was insanity for me, there was tons of alcohol and looooot's of drama with my main girl Asian Ink and I. It all started in the day when I told her some girls I've been interested in and girls that like me will be there. Everyone shows up and boy is it gonna be a shit show. I try to pawn this girl off to my friend, hes drunk and starts giving off creepy vibes. I'm doing damage control on Asian Ink and her friend most of the night, plus Asian Ink is one of the hottest girls in the club so I'm definitely enjoying the arm candy. This girl knows I'm with her at this point I'm sure, we were extremely touchy feely, making out etc. Another girl I banged before noticed and sent me a text saying "hi bla bla, not trying to interrupt bla bla". Anyway I get a few texts from this girl cause she obviously sees I am a bad ass mofo, tons of social proof, awesome friends, and I know lots of women. I would also break away every so often and get in her space, I easily could have made out with her multiple times. I was trying to give her to my friend, but he kept fucking up and when I would come in I was like prince charming. I was warm and sexy she was melting. Here's the texts she sent while I was in the club:

Her 12:23a - Help me
Her 1:34 a - Hey
Her 1:50a - Hope you had a good night.

At this point the tables completely turned, she has become the chaser. My argument with Asian Ink stemmed from me pointing this girl out. She got so mad since looks wise this girl isn't even close to her level, she was like "that girl is not hot why would you get with her over this!" She is right, this girl is no where near her level..

I text her the next day, on no sleep..

Me 4/1 3:07p - Hey my bad bout last night I got caught up with drunk ppl drama.. hope u at least had a little fun
Her 6:01p - I did it was nice to see you.
Me 10:50p - Come to (bar)
Her 11:19p - I'm tempted but I had a long workday, and I look like shit. Probably just going to pour a glass of wine and call it a night.
me 11:21p - U look fine, I don't judge. Just come. Are u home?
her 11:21p - Yea I'm home
me 11:23p - Ah. Yea I won't be here long either.
me 11:23p - Night
Her 11:25p - Goodnight

me 4/2 9:21p - How was the fam?(she told me her schedule in the club I was bored and wanted to be social)
Her 9:47p - They'er great! How did you know?
Me 9:52p - Lucky guess? I listen, rarely.. lol (clearly I listen)
Her 9:53p- That's pretty good. How are you?
Me 9:56p - I'm great :) bout to head out
Her 9:58p - Where are you going?
Me 10:25p - (Bar)
Her 10:28p - Maybe I'll see you
Me 10:32p - If u want to, I'm sure u will
Her 10:34p - Interesting.

I head to the bar solo. I pretty much did the same thing as the night before chillin by myself. Again a girl opens me asks if I'm by myself. I use this to open conversation. It's pretty funny how good I'm getting and conversing, but I'm still wary to approach especially after almost 60 days of going out, it's crazy. I guess I know why because I always use a crutch, friends, alcohol, but nights I free myself and approach I have amazing stories. This hopefully within the next few weeks will be the driving force that makes me get to the next level.

I run into some peeps chat for a bit make a new friend or two. I see this girl come in, but I don't think it's her. I meander outside and just stand there sipping a beer. She spots me and comes out, turns out the girl I thought WAS her. I pull her in and turn on my good game. We chat I lead finish my beer invite her to leave for another. I don't tell her where we're going. We walk to my place. When we get there, she says "oh I thought you were taking me to a bar." Bla bla take her inside.

Get inside everything goes smooth and I pull Franco's romantic kiss. It goes flawless. Problem is I have these thoughts in my head, "do i want this?" "Is she hot enough?" "Is she worth bringing into my life?" I keep answering these questions no, but I want the reference experience. I stop kissing and resume talking, mind you its great deep diving, but still no escalation. We talk for waaaaay too long now and I don't try escalating again til she says shes gonna leave. She puts on one shoe I grab her and pull her to my bed. Resume escalation. I move very slow with this for some reason. I am getting zero resistance, but I still don't push. I think it was truly because I didn't want it. I get her top unbuttoned, bra unclipped, belt off, take my shirt off.. Finally get her pants unbuttoned and comes her ASD line that I was not willing to push through,"I don't get with people I don't know" In my head I'm thinking you stupid bitch, you are not hot enough for this, I am high value, I've spent so much time with you it's ridiculous, we know each other better than most of my regular fuck buddies! All I say is, "what makes you "Know" someone?" she says, "thats for me to decide."

???? wow..

I pretty much give up on verbal and continue to physically escalate. I tell her to leave but continue to be physical. I try to get my hand down her pants but each time she moves it and pulls away. I gave up, I didn't want it and was not going to WORK for it. I walk her to her car, which was pretty quiet and awkward, the only thoughts in my mind were sex so it was hard to start logical/interesting conversation.

I learned an important lesson to bust LMR in the future. This girl KNEW me, more than she knows. This was her defense which I wanted to call her on, but I didn't care. In the future while physically escalating I MUST throw in objective statements to keep her logical mind occupied for example,"I barely know you" "I never do this with girls I barely know" "Why are you doing this to me" "I'm on my period, so we aren't having sex" Funny part is I've done this before and busted LMR. Biggest difference between the two girls is I did not REALLY WANT this girl. I was putting forth little effort to close, I will not expend any more than this on a 7, not happening.

Peace
 

Sly

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Jan 9, 2013
Messages
39
Re: FR++ HB7 Needy to non-needy, pull, LMR, Failed escalatio

I'm no expert but before I begin with some constructive criticism I want to congratulate you on the pull. After so much effort of trying to get this girl, you finally managed to get her in bed. Persistance definitely pays off. Good job!

Speaking of which, persistance is where I'd like to start. Chase has a perfect post on PERSISTANCE.

https://www.girlschase.com/content/why-c ... tence-does

Here, he outlines the difference between persistance and neediness/chasing women. Definitely worth a read. In my mind, persistance is when you want a woman and make it clear you do, but at the same time display you have other options and are willing to walk away from her at anytime. This is very attractive to women. On the other side of the spectrum, constantly initiating contact and messaging women, only drives them away as you seem to be investing to much time and effort into a single person. You want to come off as a high valued person who is being chased by many, while not doing any chasing for yourself.

Obviously, you have been introspective and outlined you made some mistakes with your attempt. That is definitely a process. But for future reference I have some advice on your text game. Firstly, you initiated every single text conversation with her! Do not do this! Have some patience and wait. If she is interested, she will contact you. By contacting her like you did, basically day after day, you displayed to her too much investment. I do understand when you meet someone you are interested in, you want to have the most contact as you can, but it's just counter productive and lowers your value!

Next, I realized that often you responded to her texts immediately after receiving a message. Again, WAIT! Make her wonder what you're doing and why you aren't answering. By messaging her back right away, you're displaying you're enthusiasm for having received a message from her. It seems like you were waiting by your phone waiting for it to vibrate. If she responds after 20 mins, you at least wait the same amount of time or longer! I know it seems childish to play these games but until you have a real connection with a women, this is a must!

As well, avoid messaging women twice in a row
Heres an example:

Tyme2k said:
Me 3/18 1:29p - (Name)! Hey girl, hope ur good. U working late again? We should meet up tonight..
Me 3:28p - Actually can't tonight, ill be at (bar) tomorrow if u come thru there.(I think I sensed I was needy and dead air so I pointed out my time is valuable)
Her 6:17p - I'm sorry I'm just getting back to you I'll let you know about tomorrow. i hope you have a good night.

Even though you realized you couldn't hang out you should have waited for her response and then cancelled accordingly. Maybe she would have been down to hang out and you could have apologized and said you wanted to a raincheck. By cancelling on her before she even responded, you showed you were waiting for her response. It may have come off as bullshit to her as well. She wasn't responding, so you decided to cancel to seem cool! (not saying that's what happened, but could have gone through her mind).

Otherwise, when you finally saw her out you played it like a champ. She saw you with other women and this just built up your image. Just lay off the messaging a bit and always be ready to walk away!

If I have time, I'll post a report, where persistance matched with patience definitely paid off. Hope I was helpful!

Cheers,
SLY
 

Tyme2k

Cro-Magnon Man
Cro-Magnon Man
Joined
Feb 9, 2013
Messages
386
Re: FR++ HB7 Needy to non-needy, pull, LMR, Failed escalatio

Sly,

Advice is always appreciated and I know where each and every mistake was. Funny thing is it's always ok to calibrate after the fact. I have done everything you stated before which you can read my other LR's here:

Asian ink HB9(changed her number from 8 to 9 as of recent due to her being subjectly gorgeous in the eyes of many, she was only an 8 due to age and two children which both you would never guess looking at her)

Cute asian HB8

That said when I think they are worthy having on point game I do a better job. I was able to be persistent without seeming needy and able to close both like a champ. I could have closed last night if I REALLY wanted to, but I was having an internal argument... meh I have saved her name as "Zero (name)" which means she never gets another chance unless it takes Zero effort on my part.

Thanks again for the advice hope to see your LR up here soon.
 

MonsieurLabrie

Tribal Elder
Tribal Elder
Joined
Oct 15, 2012
Messages
33
Re: FR++ HB7 Needy to non-needy, pull, LMR, Failed escalatio

Tyme2k said:
Asian ink HB9[/url](changed her number from 8 to 9 as of recent due to her being subjectly gorgeous in the eyes of many, she was only an 8 due to age and two children which both you would never guess looking at her)

Cute asian HB8

Don't do this. If you said 8 first, its 8. Don't bump her to a 9 because she says she's hot and it seems tons of guys are after her. If you would study these guys carefully, all of them would probably be betas. Single moms in their thirties can't be above 8. Yes Asians look young, but young Asians look younger and hotter. In America they're goddesses among whales, but in Asia they would be very ordinary.

Tyme2k said:
That said when I think they are worthy having on point game I do a better job. I was able to be persistent without seeming needy and able to close both like a champ. I could have closed last night if I REALLY wanted to, but I was having an internal argument... meh I have saved her name as "Zero (name)" which means she never gets another chance unless it takes Zero effort on my part.

Welcome to the Land of female self-delusion. When you don't come across like a total bad boy or when you're a little too nice to average looking women, they believe you're a normal beta. Because you texted this one so much, she believed she was equal or higher value. I've had girls try to LJBF me before or tell me they didn't have enough time for a relationship when I never even remotely considered anything besides NSA sex with them because they were not nearly hot enough. I know the feeling of wanting to slap some sense into them, but its pointless. The right thing to do is just abandon them in the land of delusion and maybe, on the way out, throw a little advice on how they could improve their looks.
 

Vash

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Feb 12, 2013
Messages
45
Re: FR++ HB7 Needy to non-needy, pull, LMR, Failed escalatio

When you put it that way Labrie, no offense, but you'll kind of come across as a dick, don't you think?
 
the right date makes getting her back home a piece of cake

MonsieurLabrie

Tribal Elder
Tribal Elder
Joined
Oct 15, 2012
Messages
33
Re: FR++ HB7 Needy to non-needy, pull, LMR, Failed escalatio

Vash said:
When you put it that way Labrie, no offense, but you'll kind of come across as a dick, don't you think?

I've never actually done it, lol, I just thought about it before. What I usually do is just smile and chuckle a bit before leaving, while saying "Sure, sure, we can hang out as friends." (and proceed to never see her again)

It's just a little mindgame I'd like to play one day where I'd just say something like "Too bad, if you'd just be a bit slimmer, I would definitely date you," and then walk off.

I've always accepted responsibility when I didn't convince the girl that I'm awesome, but I ain't a zen buddhist monk. Sometimes my mind has these little fantasies to have women realize how off their judgement was.

That's it :D

But you're right, average-looking girls don't deserve it. Solitude and bad lovers is punishment enough.
 

Tyme2k

Cro-Magnon Man
Cro-Magnon Man
Joined
Feb 9, 2013
Messages
386
Re: FR++ HB7 Needy to non-needy, pull, LMR, Failed escalatio

MonsieurLabrie said:
I've always accepted responsibility when I didn't convince the girl that I'm awesome, but I ain't a zen buddhist monk. Sometimes my mind has these little fantasies to have women realize how off their judgement was.

That's it :D

But you're right, average-looking girls don't deserve it. Solitude and bad lovers is punishment enough.

Definitely aggree with you, I know it was my fault I didn't hold my frame, I felt I could get anyway with anything cause this girl seemed far below my league. I conveyed myself as inferior, but I truly didn't give a fuck and probably suconciously was sabatoging it.

MonsieurLabrie said:
Don't do this. If you said 8 first, its 8. Don't bump her to a 9 because she says she's hot and it seems tons of guys are after her. If you would study these guys carefully, all of them would probably be betas. Single moms in their thirties can't be above 8. Yes Asians look young, but young Asians look younger and hotter. In America they're goddesses among whales, but in Asia they would be very ordinary.

You seem very judgemental, this woman is not a typical single mom. A womans ranking can be affected by her value she brings to the table. In this case her value is the highest I've ever seen in a woman so far gaming, incredible physique, drive, passion, spirituality, inteligence(phychology major), owned two businesses, owns a home, captivates audiences socially, purely higher value than any girl I've met so far.

Don't forget she left her ex husband for a professional Skater.
 

MonsieurLabrie

Tribal Elder
Tribal Elder
Joined
Oct 15, 2012
Messages
33
Re: FR++ HB7 Needy to non-needy, pull, LMR, Failed escalatio

Tyme2k said:
You seem very judgemental, this woman is not a typical single mom. A womans ranking can be affected by her value she brings to the table. In this case her value is the highest I've ever seen in a woman so far gaming, incredible physique, drive, passion, spirituality, inteligence(phychology major), owned two businesses, owns a home, captivates audiences socially, purely higher value than any girl I've met so far.

Don't forget she left her ex husband for a professional Skater.

I'm sorry that came out so wrong. I didn't mean to rain on their parade. I guess I was projecting a bit of my own issues.

You see, I'm dating a Korean with an incredible physique as well, with some other great qualities as well. Mine is always very critical of other women and says they're not good-looking, even when they're cute but not perfect. Over time, theres a risk of being kinda brainwashed into thinking she's the best I can do out there. I always remember not to overvalue her at the expense of others. My girl is always putting down the earlier women in my life or the ones I used to be interested in. Although I can accept her point with a grain of salt and it helps raise my standards, I remember that exclusivity is a great sacrifice, even with a very high value girl. (that's the point I was trying to formulate)

I also got into unending arguments about going for girls that were not as good looking at the same time I was sleeping with my Asian girl. She doesn't understand at all because she looks at it with a female mind and women don't really get the male's need for variety over quality. Anyways. Hope that clears it up.
 

Marty

Cro-Magnon Man
Cro-Magnon Man
Joined
Jul 17, 2013
Messages
1,525
Re: FR++ HB7 Needy to non-needy, pull, LMR, Failed escalation

MonsieurLabrie said:
Mine is always very critical of other women and says they're not good-looking, even when they're cute but not perfect. Over time, theres a risk of being kinda brainwashed into thinking she's the best I can do out there.
MonsieurLabrie said:
I remember that exclusivity is a great sacrifice, even with a very high value girl.
MonsieurLabrie said:
She doesn't understand at all because she looks at it with a female mind and women don't really get the male's need for variety over quality.
Just found this. OMG he took the words right out of my mouth. So pleased to see confirmation of this from a Tribal Elder!
 

Whizzy

Cro-Magnon Man
Cro-Magnon Man
Joined
Jan 8, 2013
Messages
676
Re: FR++ HB7 Needy to non-needy, pull, LMR, Failed escalation

A lot of girls do this "brainwashing" even if its purely accidental. Woman tend to be in it for the long run and every little bit counts in their mind, slow but steady lol
 
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