How to help someone exit MLM/pyramid-scheme networks?

[Lover]

The title is pretty self-explanatory. I'm honestly not sure where to go with this exact question because I'm hoping to handle this in a way that doesn't involve someone retaliating and pushing people away

This person I want to help has been part of an MLM/pyramid-scheme network for some months now. I never heard about networks like this and no one ever tried to recruit me lol. So I didn't think too much about it. That is, until someone from the team was quitting, and I saw cult-like talks to make the quitter stay. I just happened to be nearby to observe this. Now I have had time to look into it, and yeah... things are starting to add up. Definitely a scam

I'm a bit lost. I have tried to think of ways to help them quit. But now that this person is down the rabbithole, it's like I can only hope they eventually crash and realize being caught in a never-ending scheme with no profit

I have a hunch this person will retaliate big time if I harshly criticize the network being a scam. But I don't think doing nothing will help either. How can I, at least, speed up the process to get this person leaving this shit behind?

Your help is much appreciated

Lover

 

[ulrich]

Who is this person to you?

Unless he/she is a close relative, this is usually not worth the effort.
MLM have strong cultish practices that make it harder to get out.

 

[DarkKnight]

I agree with @ulrich. I guess first thing to wonder is how enmeshed is this guy with this MLM. A MLM guy really went out of his way some time ago to get me as a customer or victim, whatever you want to call it. Guy first went out of his way to befriend me and then finesse his way in, I had to boot him and even then he was annoyingly persistent and tried to use tricks to come at me very polite and friendly to make it harder to publicly rebuke him. Kind of reminded me of an overly persistent PUA. Finally got rid of by complaining with the staff of the establishment about his antics. These people use scripts to manipulate you. They gaslight themselves and you.

Anyway lots of manipulation going on, you are not only fighting the MLM but also the involved person if you are not careful so as Ulrich is saying,

who is he/she to you? In other words is it worth the effort.
2. How enmeshed is this person

 

[Lover]

@ulrich, @DarkKnight

Its a pretty close relative on the younger end. Travels around the continent couple of times a year and more often domestically, participating in motivational "conferences", all self paid. Is part of different teams. Spends almost all day on zoom calls. The product the company is selling is hardly the main target, and recruitment tactics seem to take up most of their calls

Thankfully, this relative hasn't tried to recruit me. Talks openly about the business and how it's about being in it in the long run. I haven't heard of any significant increases in "income". And I think I will exploit this angle from time to time to seed this downside into their mind. But I'm open to suggestions ofc

 

[DarkKnight]

Thankfully, this relative hasn't tried to recruit me. Talks openly about the business and how it's about being in it in the long run. I haven't heard of any significant increases in "income". And I think I will exploit this angle from time to time to seed this downside into their mind. But I'm open to suggestions ofc

show him the numbers of how many people really end up making a profit from those schemes, it shut the annoying MLM guy up for a while. Hard to counter atrocious returns on investment, if at all

 

[Chase]

Some guy came to my college freshman year pushing an MLM scheme.

I heard about it from a couple of the guys on my dorm building floor. They were super excited, talking about how they were going to make all this money. I tried telling them it was bullshit but they just went on about how this guy was a self-made multimillionaire and they were going to get rich by doing this thing too. IIRC it was cold-calling people and having them switch over to a different telephone provider (this was in the early 2000s).

So they had another meeting with this MLM recruiter guy, in the basement of one of the dorm buildings. I went along with the guys to check out this "multimillionaire." He was in really drab clothes and beat-up old shoes, driving this beat up old car. I kept hassling him with questions about his millionaire lifestyle, why he dressed down so much despite being a millionaire, why he drove around an old beater -- didn't he think if he wanted to convince people he ought to flash it around a little bit more? Why was he meeting a handful of guys in some dim basement room... why didn't he book a proper room to speak with us and make it more professional? Asked him a slew of critical questions about the business model. I just trolled him a bunch on everything. Finally he told me, "Look man, if you're not interested in the program, you can just leave." I told my buddies I was out and left the meeting.

One of the guys from my floor sought me out later that night trying to convince me it was really legit. He was going to have to fork over $800 for the setup cost to buy a bunch of telephone company subscriptions (or whatever it was) he could then resell but he'd be at $2K profit within the first month, he said. I could tell he really, really needed me to agree it was a good idea though... I think I shook him enough with my roasting of the "millionaire" guy that he was having doubts. But nothing I said got through.

So finally I told him I'd bet him $200 he wouldn't even make back his $800 in the first month, let alone $2K profit. He got REALLY bug-eyed about this, and was like, "No, no... I can't take that bet."

I was like, "Come on, man. It's a really good deal. You're going to make $2000 of profit! Easy! What's a $200 bet? Heck, if you just make $1000 profit... if you even make $1 of profit! You get $200! It's a pretty damn good bet, RIGHT? I mean, you REALLY think you're going to make that money back, AT LEAST, right??"

He tried to be like he couldn't take my money, but I was like don't worry about it, I've been working for the past year, I've got plenty of savings. I don't care about $200. So come on. If he's really sure he can make that money, take the bet. Then I said you know what, we'll make the deal even sweeter... I'll give you TWO months to make that $800 back. You can do THAT right? Two months to hit breakeven?

He got really uncomfortable and left my dorm room to confer with the other guy who was thinking about doing it. Ultimately they both backed out, then came and told me they realized I was right, that guy didn't look or act like a millionaire at all.

If he'd have taken the bet, btw, there's no way I would've collected on it if/when he failed to make his money back.

I was doing that purely as a device to shake him out of that and realize the stakes -- and that I was so sure it was a scam that I was willing to put down money on it.

Seemed to work.

But of course, these were friends of mine and I got them BEFORE they got in. Also helped that I got to go and call the recruiter out a bunch. That guy was just straight up BS'ing.

The other kid -- the one I wasn't as close with -- dropped out of school the next semester. His grades were poor and he didn't have the money to continue paying for school. He said he was going to go work for a while and save up money to return to school. I didn't stay in touch. I wonder if he ever did go back to school. Can't even remember his name now. I felt sad for that kid. He had this whole air about him like his life just wasn't working out.

At least he didn't get suckered by that shitty pyramid scheme though.

Who knows what he would've done with all those telephone company subscriptions or whatever the heck that recruiter guy was having them buy from him.

Chase

 

[Lover]

@DarkKnight

show him the numbers of how many people really end up making a profit from those schemes, it shut the annoying MLM guy up for a while. Hard to counter atrocious returns on investment, if at all

I found an income disclaimer by the site, and I mean... it is just like a pyramid setup. 80% of US members get under 500$ a year. 10% get up to 1,500$ a year. My relative is already earning way more than that.

But hell, the fuckers are even honest afterwards, disclaiming that the income is without calculating fees for subscription, flight, hotel, products etc. and that profits are not guaranteed. How many young people actually calculate the actual income and actual fees to see if/when they will get a profit from being in this business? How many read the disclaimer? I guess very, very few.

I read some statistics elsewhere claiming that 99% will lose money from joining an MLM, and 95% will quit within 10 years. Very optismic odds lol...

If he would be honest with me about his actual income and fees, I wouldn't mind betting with him like @Chase did with his friend. But this relative has low moral when it comes to money and would most likely cheat to get his way. And to save his face, he would stick to his frame instead of admitting defeat, and we would probably not be on speaking terms for a great while.

I will be talking to him again about the numbers when I see him or call him. But I honestly think that if I started a business myself instead and it became a financial success, I could be an inspiration to him.

Thanks for your inputs, fellas!

Lover

 

[DarkKnight]

How many read the disclaimer? I guess very, very few.

this. they are already indoctrinated

I read some statistics elsewhere claiming that 99% will lose money from joining an MLM, and 95% will quit within 10 years. Very optismic odds lol...

this is what I wanted you to find because I came across to something similar