Is holding hands a good way to test the girl's comfort level with you?

[Yaxir]

So, as you might know, i am quite new to cold approaching and dating

and very, very shy about escalation (cultural conditioning that i am undoing and have undone to quite an extent at the time of writing).

Right now, even though i do get horny from time to time or can get sexual urges, i feel there's no overwhelming need to have sex.

Spoiler: a few exceptions

Although there was a time when i was very, very aroused while texting with a curvy girl i met through cold approach, who ticked all the boxes of my ideal body type in a woman and i was all over the place mentally that week due to being extremely sexually aroused - she stopped texting sadly. There was another time when i got the number of a nurse who was much older than me, so basically a MILF and that had me feeling very sexually excited within, she also didn't respond to my messages.

but that's about it.

My basic question is, how can i hold the hands of a girl on first or second date? what steps should i take? or should i say something?

I absolutely cherish the feeling when i hold hands with a girl ( i am not sure if this goes against the ethos of game and seduction )

and i think holding hands makes for an easier, gentler slope to escalate further with her

I am, at times, very confident (my fellow gamers have remarked this) and other times, i can be quite nervous. Starting to hold hands with a girl makes me quite nervous, but once i am there i think i will be ok and carry on confidently.

I am just really, really nervous about how the girl will react if i try to hold her hands. so any low-pressure method to invite her to hold hands would be considered a good starting point!

Any guidance is greatly and respectfully appreciated!

 

[Tryst]

Your thinking is good! You understand that it is much easier to escalate to sex not as one huge jump from no physical contact, but from a place of established mutual physical intimacy. You see that it is easier to move to sex after having already established some lesser physical intimacy. Let's take it further, and see that it is easier to move into hand-holding after some smaller physical intimacy.

Having no contact, and then asking to hold hands with a girl makes the hand-holding into a big deal, something that can be noticed and rejected. But the physical intimacy need not jump straight to hand holding. It can start with a touch on the shoulder as you look away, a brush of the arm, your arm around her as you point something out, your arm around her waist as you guide her somewhere, her body against yours as you sit beside each other... and suddenly the hand holding seems natural. You would just take her hand and it would be no big deal.
.
Physical escalation is not discrete jumps: nothing - hand-holding - sex. Rather, it is a smooth continuum: nothing, minor touches, greater touches, touching her hair, and-holding, kissing, making-out, touching her neck, her face, the rest of her body, foreplay, sex. There is never any big move, because it all takes place quite smoothly.

In pickup jargon, any physical touch of this nature is kino. Increasing the level of kino is kino escalation.

Read a little about kino escalation and try to do it in your next sets. Meet a girl and, within the first few minutes of conversation, touch her shoulder on a high point. Have her take your arm as you sit next to her. Try these little steps first, and you'll see that it's much less scary to take a girl's hand.

My advice is that it is good to be a touchy guy in general, not just with the girls you like. When I meet a group, I touch the guys a lot and I physically play with the ugly girls. When I begin to kino escalate on my target... Well, he's just a touchy guy! It's okay!

Also, little reframe for your question: do not ask how to hold a girl's hand on the first or second date. Ask how to hold a girl's hand in general. A minute after you meet her. If you can do that, it will get a lot easier on the date as well. Women are women, on the date, on the street, or in the club.

- Tryst

I touched her arm, I took her hand,
I thought I'd have to wait a week,
We slowed, she stopped, and turned around
To plant a kiss upon my cheek!

 

[Yaxir]

Well, he's just a touchy guy! It's okay!

How can i make this normal? in my head at least

i fear some girls will be put off or repulsed if i am touchy with them during cold approach

 

[Will_V]

So, as you might know, i am quite new to cold approaching and dating

and very, very shy about escalation (cultural conditioning that i am undoing and have undone to quite an extent at the time of writing).

Right now, even though i do get horny from time to time or can get sexual urges, i feel there's no overwhelming need to have sex.

Spoiler: a few exceptions

Although there was a time when i was very, very aroused while texting with a curvy girl i met through cold approach, who ticked all the boxes of my ideal body type in a woman and i was all over the place mentally that week due to being extremely sexually aroused - she stopped texting sadly. There was another time when i got the number of a nurse who was much older than me, so basically a MILF and that had me feeling very sexually excited within, she also didn't respond to my messages.

but that's about it.

My basic question is, how can i hold the hands of a girl on first or second date? what steps should i take? or should i say something?

I absolutely cherish the feeling when i hold hands with a girl ( i am not sure if this goes against the ethos of game and seduction )

and i think holding hands makes for an easier, gentler slope to escalate further with her

I am, at times, very confident (my fellow gamers have remarked this) and other times, i can be quite nervous. Starting to hold hands with a girl makes me quite nervous, but once i am there i think i will be ok and carry on confidently.

I am just really, really nervous about how the girl will react if i try to hold her hands. so any low-pressure method to invite her to hold hands would be considered a good starting point!

Any guidance is greatly and respectfully appreciated!

Holding hands for extended periods of time is not ideal at all for seduction. There are many reasons:

- She's used to holding hands with boyfriends, so you automatically become framed that way
- Your touch quickly becomes something ordinary, ever-present, and not attention-worthy
- It's harder to use your touch as a reward, or to escalate
- It's intimate but not exciting - which basically describes a low quality relationship

It sounds unintuitive, but a girl who is sexually excited typically finds too much intimacy uncomfortable - if her pussy is aching and she's sitting there holding hands, she's going to feel weird. And vice versa - if she's too comfortable and feels like your girlfriend and not your lover, creating sexual excitement is harder.

Also, for many girls, they want to keep casual stuff separate from relationships. That's why some girls who are ready to bang don't want to kiss - or hold hands, or other things they have 'reserved' as signifiers of relationship status. So you holding hands might inadvertently make her very uncomfortable if she was looking for some fun.

The only time I hold a girls hand is when I'm right in front of her and looking her in the eyes, I like to do the handshake that turns into a 'invitation to dance' type of thing. But other than brief things like that, I do not recommend it as a way to escalate.

 

[gameboy]

I think you will find this article useful: https://www.girlschase.com/article/tactics-tuesdays-sexual-escalation-script

 

[Tryst]

How can i make this normal? in my head at least

i fear some girls will be put off or repulsed if i am touchy with them during cold approach

In your head? I don't know.

But to other people? Read about proper kino escalation, and watch how guys kino other guys. Start just being a touchy person, and touching everyone, then when it comes time to kino your target, it won't be weird for you.

 

[Yaxir]

Hi Will! i remember you from when i was a new member here

her pussy is aching

this is what i want to frequently do to girls, in a good way ofcourse

 

[Yaxir]

Holding hands for extended periods of time is not ideal at all for seduction. There are many reasons:

- She's used to holding hands with boyfriends, so you automatically become framed that way
- Your touch quickly becomes something ordinary, ever-present, and not attention-worthy
- It's harder to use your touch as a reward, or to escalate
- It's intimate but not exciting - which basically describes a low quality relationship

It sounds unintuitive, but a girl who is sexually excited typically finds too much intimacy uncomfortable - if her pussy is aching and she's sitting there holding hands, she's going to feel weird. And vice versa - if she's too comfortable and feels like your girlfriend and not your lover, creating sexual excitement is harder.

Also, for many girls, they want to keep casual stuff separate from relationships. That's why some girls who are ready to bang don't want to kiss - or hold hands, or other things they have 'reserved' as signifiers of relationship status. So you holding hands might inadvertently make her very uncomfortable if she was looking for some fun.

The only time I hold a girls hand is when I'm right in front of her and looking her in the eyes, I like to do the handshake that turns into a 'invitation to dance' type of thing. But other than brief things like that, I do not recommend it as a way to escalate.

i forgot to remark,

this is an excellent description BUT i actually don't want to bang on the first date ( my mind is still coming to terms with that, please consider that i am doing a lot of deconditioning and unlearning a lot of the conservative beliefs about sex/intimacy that were taught to me when i was younger )

i actually want her to feel comfortable with me, as such i would very much prefer something semi-casual (but where her investment is higher) and not just a one night stand or first date sex

currently, i am frustrated by this girl who had a good time with me, got to know me and also about my family as well, she even hugged my goodbye

BUT being the busy bee that she is, she replies very late ( days later wtf ) and i want to go out on a second date with her and there, i atleast want to hold hands if not kiss her ( i would very much like to kiss her )

but i myself feel scared, nervous .. so i just want to take it step by step and keep it semi casual rather than casual

 

[Yaxir]

Your thinking is good! You understand that it is much easier to escalate to sex not as one huge jump from no physical contact, but from a place of established mutual physical intimacy. You see that it is easier to move to sex after having already established some lesser physical intimacy. Let's take it further, and see that it is easier to move into hand-holding after some smaller physical intimacy.

Having no contact, and then asking to hold hands with a girl makes the hand-holding into a big deal, something that can be noticed and rejected. But the physical intimacy need not jump straight to hand holding. It can start with a touch on the shoulder as you look away, a brush of the arm, your arm around her as you point something out, your arm around her waist as you guide her somewhere, her body against yours as you sit beside each other... and suddenly the hand holding seems natural. You would just take her hand and it would be no big deal.
.
Physical escalation is not discrete jumps: nothing - hand-holding - sex. Rather, it is a smooth continuum: nothing, minor touches, greater touches, touching her hair, and-holding, kissing, making-out, touching her neck, her face, the rest of her body, foreplay, sex. There is never any big move, because it all takes place quite smoothly.

In pickup jargon, any physical touch of this nature is kino. Increasing the level of kino is kino escalation.

Read a little about kino escalation and try to do it in your next sets. Meet a girl and, within the first few minutes of conversation, touch her shoulder on a high point. Have her take your arm as you sit next to her. Try these little steps first, and you'll see that it's much less scary to take a girl's hand.

My advice is that it is good to be a touchy guy in general, not just with the girls you like. When I meet a group, I touch the guys a lot and I physically play with the ugly girls. When I begin to kino escalate on my target... Well, he's just a touchy guy! It's okay!

Also, little reframe for your question: do not ask how to hold a girl's hand on the first or second date. Ask how to hold a girl's hand in general. A minute after you meet her. If you can do that, it will get a lot easier on the date as well. Women are women, on the date, on the street, or in the club.

- Tryst

I touched her arm, I took her hand,
I thought I'd have to wait a week,
We slowed, she stopped, and turned around
To plant a kiss upon my cheek!

this is another GREAT description! I like the poem at the end ..

i just have a few questions,

1. How do i hold her hand a minute after meeting her? the most i do, is introduce myself by my name in cold approach and then shake her hands - does that count? can i take this any further?

2. If there is a rejection of my touching the girl during any stage - e.g she squirms away when i try to lead her by the waist or just moves away or even shrugs my hand, how do i handle that? I know this comes under calibration (red-yellow-green signals) but any tips are greatly appreciated!

3. On one of the dates i went out with .. well, i did this where i touched her elbow at least twice and protected her while crossing the road by touching her waist ( in my nervousness of touching her waist, i remarked to her that the driver was crazy to drive so fast on the road ..), she did not reject any of my touches .. but i don't know or i feel scared about taking it further. Do you think i should brush my arm, shoulder onto her from time to time? it can look like natural but ofcourse it will be a bit planned by me, because i want my brain to register that touching a girl is normal

your help is greatly appreciated!


I will read more about kino, physical touch on the website!

 

[gameboy]

3. On one of the dates i went out with .. well, i did this where i touched her elbow at least twice and protected her while crossing the road by touching her waist ( in my nervousness of touching her waist, i remarked to her that the driver was crazy to drive so fast on the road ..), she did not reject any of my touches .. but i don't know or i feel scared about taking it further. Do you think i should brush my arm, shoulder onto her from time to time? it can look like natural but ofcourse it will be a bit planned by me, because i want my brain to register that touching a girl is normal

This ^^

is exactly how you do it.

If she "rejects" , squirms or shows any resistance, just back off and continue as normal. Then later, rinse and repeat.

 

[Will_V]

i forgot to remark,

this is an excellent description BUT i actually don't want to bang on the first date ( my mind is still coming to terms with that, please consider that i am doing a lot of deconditioning and unlearning a lot of the conservative beliefs about sex/intimacy that were taught to me when i was younger )

i actually want her to feel comfortable with me, as such i would very much prefer something semi-casual (but where her investment is higher) and not just a one night stand or first date sex

currently, i am frustrated by this girl who had a good time with me, got to know me and also about my family as well, she even hugged my goodbye

BUT being the busy bee that she is, she replies very late ( days later wtf ) and i want to go out on a second date with her and there, i atleast want to hold hands if not kiss her ( i would very much like to kiss her )

but i myself feel scared, nervous .. so i just want to take it step by step and keep it semi casual rather than casual

So regardless if you want to sleep on the first date, it's still not great to sit there holding hands. What you want to do is get used to touching her every so often, like you did with her crossing the road.

For holding hands, I suggest to do it for a short time to lead her, but not for too long. Crossing the road is a perfect example of when it's a great idea to do it. Also when you are moving her from one place to another, when you get up to go, grab her hand and gently pull her alongside you, then hold it for a couple of seconds longer before letting it go as you both walk along.

The idea is to use hand-holding in brief as a way of establishing your leadership and dominance. You're leading, and she's coming with you.

Other ways of touching her:

Touch her arm or leg when you are saying something where you want to make a point or add extra emphasis. Especially if you are commenting on something about her, or something she's said. Think of it like this: if you would naturally lean toward her a bit when saying something, using touch instead (or with it) is good. Use very brief touches at first, and gradually build up to leaving your hand there for 3-5 seconds or so each time once you've settled into rapport.

When you greet her, if she holds her hand out for a handshake, grasp her hand and turn your hand slightly palm up, and look at her admiringly for a few seconds (look her up and down if you dare!), and tell her how good she looks. Hold it for a few seconds.

Hug her to greet her and to say goodbye - hold her gently and let your body relax completely, and as soon as you feel her start to react a little, smoothly let her go.

The overall idea is that touch is an accentuator, it adds effect to specific actions and transitions - the start/end of a date, when moving her, and every so often when you want to add effect to something you say, are the main ones. If you think of it that way, you won't be just randomly reaching out gingerly to touch her because you feel like it's about time, or sitting there frozen wondering if/when to touch her.

Once you get used to that you can start using more sexual touch when things escalate, for example if you're sitting together and it's getting intimate, what I like to do is put my hand around her lower back/side and just gently run my hands up between her upper and lower torso, sometimes using my fingertips to make it feel even better. You have to gauge when it's the right time, and if she doesn't seem to be ready, just stop and continue talking like nothing happened. And never just keep doing it forever, keeping it shorter makes her think about it and want it more.

Keep at it and you'll be used to it in no time!

 

[Yaxir]

So regardless if you want to sleep on the first date, it's still not great to sit there holding hands. What you want to do is get used to touching her every so often, like you did with her crossing the road.

For holding hands, I suggest to do it for a short time to lead her, but not for too long. Crossing the road is a perfect example of when it's a great idea to do it. Also when you are moving her from one place to another, when you get up to go, grab her hand and gently pull her alongside you, then hold it for a couple of seconds longer before letting it go as you both walk along.

The idea is to use hand-holding in brief as a way of establishing your leadership and dominance. You're leading, and she's coming with you.

Other ways of touching her:

Touch her arm or leg when you are saying something where you want to make a point or add extra emphasis. Especially if you are commenting on something about her, or something she's said. Think of it like this: if you would naturally lean toward her a bit when saying something, using touch instead (or with it) is good. Use very brief touches at first, and gradually build up to leaving your hand there for 3-5 seconds or so each time once you've settled into rapport.

When you greet her, if she holds her hand out for a handshake, grasp her hand and turn your hand slightly palm up, and look at her admiringly for a few seconds (look her up and down if you dare!), and tell her how good she looks. Hold it for a few seconds.

Hug her to greet her and to say goodbye - hold her gently and let your body relax completely, and as soon as you feel her start to react a little, smoothly let her go.

The overall idea is that touch is an accentuator, it adds effect to specific actions and transitions - the start/end of a date, when moving her, and every so often when you want to add effect to something you say, are the main ones. If you think of it that way, you won't be just randomly reaching out gingerly to touch her because you feel like it's about time, or sitting there frozen wondering if/when to touch her.

Once you get used to that you can start using more sexual touch when things escalate, for example if you're sitting together and it's getting intimate, what I like to do is put my hand around her lower back/side and just gently run my hands up between her upper and lower torso, sometimes using my fingertips to make it feel even better. You have to gauge when it's the right time, and if she doesn't seem to be ready, just stop and continue talking like nothing happened. And never just keep doing it forever, keeping it shorter makes her think about it and want it more.

Keep at it and you'll be used to it in no time!

thank you!

i have come a long way from being touch-averse, to touching women on the shoulders/elbows and even the waist when crossing the road

holding her hand to cross the road will be a GREAT idea actually

the part about hugging her for an extended time and relaxing my body WHILE hugging her feels a bit nervy, as i still sometimes feel nervous - but i do believe hugging a girl is completely normal stuff to do ( i was scared of doing that before lol )

i guess i can try it when i get a second date with a girl

and i might try it with different girls (as i meet more of them!)

i can definitely try the 'hold her hand and look at her up and down' for a few seconds to compliment her, even on the first date ( she did prepare to come meet me, after all )

the point about touching her for a short time and then taking it away is GOLDEN because it makes her want it more!

i still feel a bit unsure about leaving my hands on her for 3 - 5 seconds, any tips on this is appreciated - i am open to learning this

thanks Will, you're amazing!

 

[Will_V]

the part about hugging her for an extended time and relaxing my body WHILE hugging her feels a bit nervy, as i still sometimes feel nervous - but i do believe hugging a girl is completely normal stuff to do ( i was scared of doing that before lol )

Yeah the main thing is just to give her a hug at the beginning and end without worrying too much about it, and get more and more used to it. Start with a quick one and hold it longer as you get more comfortable.

Being relaxed is important and worth working on - not only for seduction in general, but any kind of touch feels a lot better from someone who is completely relaxed compared to someone who's tense. Meditating is very good for this, if you haven't tried it yet.

i can definitely try the 'hold her hand and look at her up and down' for a few seconds to compliment her, even on the first date ( she did prepare to come meet me, after all )

Yeah, that's probably the easiest way to start. Hold her hand (or both her hands) and tell her that she looks great, her hair is really nice, etc, and give her a big smile.

i still feel a bit unsure about leaving my hands on her for 3 - 5 seconds, any tips on this is appreciated - i am open to learning this

Just start with a very brief touch, and increase it a little bit each time. Easy! As you get more comfortable you'll naturally leave it a bit longer.

A lot of this is already instinctive for you - the same way you instinctively touched/guided her across the road - but you simply haven't practiced it often. As you spend more time around women it will all come back!

 

[Tryst]

this is an excellent description BUT i actually don't want to bang on the first date ( my mind is still coming to terms with that, please consider that i am doing a lot of deconditioning and unlearning a lot of the conservative beliefs about sex/intimacy that were taught to me when i was younger )

i actually want her to feel comfortable with me, as such i would very much prefer something semi-casual (but where her investment is higher) and not just a one night stand or first date sex

This is all fine and can totally fit in with the PUA mindset. I am almost certain that as you get better, you will become more open-minded to things like SNL, which can be fun and carefree and innocent and all sorts of things that aren't shameful. Some people are into pickup just to rack up lays and fuck as many hot girls as possible as quickly as possible. This is cool if that's what they want - but it doesn't have to be what you want. Be you

A lot of deconditioning, however, will be required for you to get good at this.

currently, i am frustrated by this girl who had a good time with me, got to know me and also about my family as well, she even hugged my goodbye

BUT being the busy bee that she is, she replies very late ( days later wtf ) and i want to go out on a second date with her and there, i atleast want to hold hands if not kiss her ( i would very much like to kiss her )

Very soon you will read what you have written here and marvel at how much you have changed.

1. How do i hold her hand a minute after meeting her? the most i do, is introduce myself by my name in cold approach and then shake her hands - does that count? can i take this any further?

2. If there is a rejection of my touching the girl during any stage - e.g she squirms away when i try to lead her by the waist or just moves away or even shrugs my hand, how do i handle that? I know this comes under calibration (red-yellow-green signals) but any tips are greatly appreciated!

3. On one of the dates i went out with .. well, i did this where i touched her elbow at least twice and protected her while crossing the road by touching her waist ( in my nervousness of touching her waist, i remarked to her that the driver was crazy to drive so fast on the road ..), she did not reject any of my touches .. but i don't know or i feel scared about taking it further. Do you think i should brush my arm, shoulder onto her from time to time? it can look like natural but ofcourse it will be a bit planned by me, because i want my brain to register that touching a girl is normal

1) You're thinking about hand-holding as some traditional boyfriend/girlfriend big deal. What if you meet her, say something, she gets super excited, and grabs at you, then you take her hand and squeeze it as you keep talking? What if you meet her, she's interested in what you're saying, you tell her to follow you, and then put your hand out behind you for her to take as you walk deeper into the crowd on the way to your comfort building location? She'll be holding your hand and she won't even be thinking about it- it's just natural. What if you take her hand to look at her rings for a moment, then drop it again?

2) No big deal. Stop trying to escalate, pull away from her for a moment, and act as if nothing happened. Don't even mention it. It's okay. It's a pickup. She knows it's your job to escalate, and it's her job to resist that escalation. She's not gonna think less of you for having tried. Different pickup methods have different ways of handling these little rejections, but you can start off just by pretending it never happened, backing away, and trying to escalate again after 5 minutes. (She'll actually feel more comfortable with you after seeing how chill you are about rejection, and be more likely to let you escalate next time.)

3) Yes. All good. Soon you will be touching girls all the time, and it won't be weird, for you or for her.


- Tryst

To Mars

With wicked sword you may be stronger,
But ask your wife, we do last longer!
Your son did yield his shafts and bow
But not so soon she bade us go:
She taught us her more gentle art;
Good Yaxir wields now Cupid's dart.

 

[Rakehell]

I don’t see an issue with doing stuff like holding hands when you’re starting out if you’re that anxious about touch in general.

But at the same time most girls you court, will let you touch them and hold their hands, or even kiss them. It’s not a difficult thing to have happen.

These things are a part but not necessarily conducive to them letting you fuck them. So it’s not necessary. But it might be necessary for you, as a baby step to see that it isn’t difficult or scary.

 

[Adventurer]

I like holding hands during transitions on dates, iirc it's from a Hector Castillo video

When you pull with "let's go for a walk" or something similar, you hold hands on the way to your place. In my experience it makes it easier to lead, builds tension and escalates touch all in one simple move that's easy to implement