FR++ LMR Troubleshooting - Advice Welcome

[DoWhatWorks]

Been pushing myself to go for faster pulls to improve my game & end feelings of boredom.

Have a couple day game experiences and one recent online one that I’d like people’s feedback

Girl 1 - Daygame Neighbor

I compliment a girl as I walk past her with a causal turn bac saying I like her jacket.

She bites & I go through my usual day game stack of: seem friendly, what brings you to London & validate on what she shares.

Turns out she lives in the same gated community as me, has the next day off work & long story short she agrees to have cocktails at my place after talking for like 5 mins.

She’s 29 (I’m 26) seems very confident in herself, sociable & we’re matching each other’s energy.

She’s well dressed & has had a bit of plastic surgery done which makes sense as I found out she’s a beauty aesthetician.

We make drinks, she comes to mine and I’m just asking her about herself and get her to open up.

I keep it chill for like 15 minutes as being aware of the novelty of the situation before escalating.

Drop in a bit of 2nd gen verbals but not my best as the whole situation caught me off guard lol

I kiss her and she’s enthusiastic. I back off complement her kissing, carry on talking then kiss her again.

Grinding ensures, she has her top off, sucking on her breasts & I can feel how wet she is but she won’t let me go the whole way and says “just met me, can meet again next week”

This dance carries on between conversation before she eventually says she has to go.

All ended on good terms, she texts me later in the night but ultimately nothing comes from it when she doesn’t reply to my ping a week later.

Think she got cold feet as she shared reservations about the neighbor thing which I downplayed as we’re both mature enough to be chill about it. Ultimately she back rationalised as I failed to close the deal.

In hindsight I could of micro-escalated more but any ideas on how to improve this LMR is welcome




Girl 2 - Daygame Number grab

This is one of my strangest ones ever.

Blonde girl checks me out on the bus and I pretend to not see it. Approach her from the side when we get out,chit chat and get her number.

Proceed to text her and get her out for a bar for drinks. 2nd gen verbals, bit of touching & she’s super open about sex, having a high drive etc.

We get back to mine for drinks. Start kissing her and she’s responsive but shortly after says:

“Sorry I get more friend vibes between us… You’re attractive, we get on but just not feeling it”

I laugh and say cool,I’m just chilling and not even tried anything with you, chit chat, escalate and get her turned on but she won’t let me touch her pussy but everything else is fair came.

She then later asks me how big my dick is and I reply “not had any complaints”

Eventually she has to go and again goes nowhere unsurprisingly.

In hindsight I could of pulled my cock out , tried offering a massage and perhaps been more explicit with my game style IE say I want to fuck you at the right time.

This girl is the type to like more hood black guys and in the past they see me as “too soft”

Again any ideas welcome



Girl 3 - Online Mexican

I’ll keep this short and sweet. Day 2 with Mexican girl who is a little shy and slow with English so think a lot of my usual verbal game didn’t hit.

Round mine for drinks & first time in a while where I get the LMR where a girl just stops the interaction to not feel turned on e.g. kisses you, suck’s your lips, gets into it then just gets up.

Like she’s trying to short fuse herself getting turned on. From how she kissed she seemed more nervous /less experienced and mentioned never had a BF before but I’m simply speculating.

Any advice on this is welcome and for context I’ve read all the main LMR girlschase guides…

Thank you!

 

[Chase]

@DoWhatWorks,

You've been doing awesome all year.

These kinds of closing bugs are pretty common for where you're at. You're actually almost all the way there with these girls... just need a little more finesse.

Remarks on solving these:

Re: Girl #1: the easiest way past the "same complex" reservation is just a little white lie: "I'm supposed to move out next month."

It's not lying, it's flirting, right?

If worse comes to worse, you shag her, two months go by, and she asks why you're still there: "Oh, they gave me a great rate on the lease so I stayed." No problem. It's been two months, you haven't gone weird, and she'll be fine with it by then.

As for this part:

Grinding ensures, she has her top off, sucking on her breasts & I can feel how wet she is but she won’t let me go the whole way and says “just met me, can meet again next week”

I can't tell how far along you are -- if your cock's in her but not all the way in, or some lower stage (just fingers, etc.).

But if your cock's already in her, this is where you use bursts of passion... just get really passionate, start making out with her hard, going wild, get her super amped up, then go all the way in once she's going crazy for it. Level unlocked. If she pushes you back out after, though, there is some issue there you'll have to solve by talking to her.

====

Re: Girl #2: she's actually pretty similar to Girl #1, in that she had a voiced reservation that probably would've sealed the lay had you handled it right.

When a girl who's giving you LMR asks you how big your dick is, she's asking you to sell her on you. "I've not had any complaints" is not selling, it's objection-handling... but this wasn't an objection; she wanted to be sold.

You can decide how best you'd want to sell there... Personally I'd just go with, "It's fucking massive."

Then if she complains when you take it out (which size queens may if you're not actually humongous, IME), you just tell her, "Well it's not in a pussy yet. How's it supposed to reach full size?"

About this bit:

We get back to mine for drinks. Start kissing her and she’s responsive but shortly after says:

“Sorry I get more friend vibes between us… You’re attractive, we get on but just not feeling it”

I laugh and say cool,I’m just chilling and not even tried anything with you, chit chat, escalate and get her turned on but she won’t let me touch her pussy but everything else is fair came.

She then later asks me how big my dick is and I reply “not had any complaints”

You handled the apology and the 'friend vibes' curveball well.

The other route is making a game of it: "Just call me Mr. Rogers" (sensual voice / eyes). Then as you're escalating on her: "It's a beautiful day in the neighborhood..."

Eventually she has to go and again goes nowhere unsurprisingly.

In hindsight I could of pulled my cock out , tried offering a massage and perhaps been more explicit with my game style IE say I want to fuck you at the right time.

All are good ideas.

This girl is the type to like more hood black guys and in the past they see me as “too soft”

Again any ideas welcome

Next time you get girls like this you could always experiment with some explicit hood-type escalation.

I don't know exactly how that'd go... but I could see something like her throwing out the friend vibe test and you responding with, "What's that mean? You think I wanna be friends with you? Come on over ho, I'll show you what type of friends I like."

Or when she asks how big you are, just telling her, "Bitch, I am big enough. But how tight's that pussy? That's the real question."

====

Re: Girl #3:

Round mine for drinks & first time in a while where I get the LMR where a girl just stops the interaction to not feel turned on e.g. kisses you, suck’s your lips, gets into it then just gets up.

Like she’s trying to short fuse herself getting turned on. From how she kissed she seemed more nervous /less experienced and mentioned never had a BF before but I’m simply speculating.

Any advice on this is welcome and for context I’ve read all the main LMR girlschase guides…

Thank you!

Sometimes calling out behavior -- especially with inexperienced girls -- is enough to get it to stop.

e.g., "You know, if you keep interrupting us like that, we're never going to be able to get it going really good."

A lot of times young girls have defenses they aren't even fully consciously aware they're using, and if you just point it out to them, while tying the idea of not using those defenses to having a much better time, they will set them aside and get into it.

Chase

 

[DoWhatWorks]

You've been doing awesome all year.

Thanks @Chase definitely been an uptick year where a lot of things have just "clicked" for me

Appreciate you taking time out to give feedback.

white lie: "I'm supposed to move out next month."

Good suggestion. Damn, this is an obvious way to have logically handled the objection. It's also true as I'm always looking for new places and will genuinely move out to my own place relatively soon if the value for money is right.

I can't tell how far along you are -- if your cock's in her but not all the way in, or some lower stage (just fingers, etc.).

But if your cock's already in her, this is where you use bursts of passion... just get really passionate, start making out with her hard, going wild, get her super amped up, then go all the way in once she's going crazy for it. Level unlocked. If she pushes you back out after, though, there is some issue there you'll have to solve by talking to her.

I should of been clearer, her top was off but jeans were still on so just fingers. I turned things on pretty heavy by dirty talking and rubbing her clit through her jeans... She said "You're making this really difficult" then short circuit by saying "I need to go"

Most common type of LMR I get these days... Girls who're turned on and know they'll want to have sex if they stay so opt to remove themselves...

Typing that up has made me realize I'm getting it because they "feel" it's too soon so way I address that is:

1. More deep diving / getting her to open up... So she feels "close" to me and that she's known me longer than she has

2. Escalating quicker to bring LMR to the forefront so it can be addressed before it drags out and her logic kicks in saying she should go

If she pushes you back out after, though, there is some issue there you'll have to solve by talking to her.

With this girl her issue was how long we had known each other.... 30 minutes to 1 hour from hello to my bed.

So think my above observation would of handled it. I did a bit of rapport chit chat but definitely missed opportunities to go deeper.

"I've not had any complaints" is not selling, it's objection-handling... but this wasn't an objection; she wanted to be sold.

Think you're 100% spot on with this... Excellent point

Or when she asks how big you are, just telling her, "Bitch, I am big enough. But how tight's that pussy? That's the real question."

Love this re-frame too and can see it working well with these types of girls

Sometimes calling out behavior -- especially with inexperienced girls -- is enough to get it to stop.

e.g., "You know, if you keep interrupting us like that, we're never going to be able to get it going really good."

These things always look so obvious in hindsight! Good analysis I funnily enough did that to kiss her and she was enthusiastic.

Clearly missed the opportunity to do it further up the escalation and the frame of "this makes it good for both of us" is a smooth angle

 

[DoWhatWorks]

Thanks for contributing @Bacchus

if I remember correctly you are a black guy.

That's right

She lives in the same gated community as you... and you went direct. That is what I call a no-no.

Agreed. Unluckily only found out that she lived in the same community as me after the opener

I rarely ever go direct... unless the girl is also black and I have a feeling this girl wasn't black. Why? Because direct game and certain races have been "played out" so many times on screen and in-person that it starts a movie in the subconscious mind of some girls that ends with LMR and fingering herself to sleep. Don't ask me how I know this... too many memories

Feel the pain there and completely get the advantages of indirect. I lean on "light direct" e.g. compliment on outfits vs direct physical appearance because of laziness to be honest and lack of creativity.

As it's harder to think of indirect openers in daygame vs nightgame for example as there's no real context or reason for me to speak to her...

The reality pacing more artistic type openers are also not congruent to my personality so any examples or mindsets I can adopt to go indirect more often is much appreciated... Remember seeing videos of guys asking for directions then switching it up but that would feel weird for me...

Although lack of comfort is a key part of growth so willing to stretch myself.

She had that line in her pocket... before she even walked into your door. You gave her the ammo with your compliment.

In the spirit of learning is a compliment on outfits enough to trigger this? Genuinely curious. As this is something I could say to a guy in passing and my vibe is very laid back / non-wanting hence why I think she hooked so quickly.

I've complimented on outfits in daygame and led to lays in the past as I thought it's more subtle than "you're beautiful/gorgeous" etc

I did not touch girls before they were sitting on my bed...

For the most part, me too

I consider what she can handle before giving it.

Any signals to look out for that let you know where a girl is at?

In the examples above, they were all comfortable with sitting close to me, made good eye contact etc.

I also have a post on archetypes... these ones are more subconscious and deal with her fantasies... dreams... and sexual narratives. I'm curious to see how combining these outlooks will affect your journey. I have a feeling it will make cold approach a lot easier.

Thank you I'll check your post out!

"How big is your dick?"

"Come find out... take off my belt." "Slide it out." "Rub the tip slowly..." "Mmmm... you feel so good."

With a sensual vibe, causal smile and a low, calm voice...

Another good angle I could of tried. Like how it smoothly gets her physically escalating on me while building compliance - nice

Now a question you may be asking is yourself... is "how the hell does Bacchus know the sex dreams of a girl he has never met?" It takes conceptual skill to spot the hints but I will list a couple here. She apologized for resisting your physical advances and behaved rather ambivalently regarding sex... does she want it? Does she not? Underneath that ambivalence are rushing waves of desire bursting against the dam. The dam is her social conditioning.

Part of the deal with effective compliance demands is stillness and non-judgment. She may take time before she complies... so you just look at her without moving. Other girls may have something to say... let them talk then reframe her objections then and there. Do this right and it's smooth sailing...

Also good points - will take time to go through the links

 

[Skills]

Been pushing myself to go for faster pulls to improve my game & end feelings of boredom.

Have a couple day game experiences and one recent online one that I’d like people’s feedback

Girl 1 - Daygame Neighbor

I compliment a girl as I walk past her with a causal turn bac saying I like her jacket.

She bites & I go through my usual day game stack of: seem friendly, what brings you to London & validate on what she shares.

Turns out she lives in the same gated community as me, has the next day off work & long story short she agrees to have cocktails at my place after talking for like 5 mins.

She’s 29 (I’m 26) seems very confident in herself, sociable & we’re matching each other’s energy.

She’s well dressed & has had a bit of plastic surgery done which makes sense as I found out she’s a beauty aesthetician.

We make drinks, she comes to mine and I’m just asking her about herself and get her to open up.

I keep it chill for like 15 minutes as being aware of the novelty of the situation before escalating.

Drop in a bit of 2nd gen verbals but not my best as the whole situation caught me off guard lol

I kiss her and she’s enthusiastic. I back off complement her kissing, carry on talking then kiss her again.

Grinding ensures, she has her top off, sucking on her breasts & I can feel how wet she is but she won’t let me go the whole way and says “just met me, can meet again next week”

This dance carries on between conversation before she eventually says she has to go.

All ended on good terms, she texts me later in the night but ultimately nothing comes from it when she doesn’t reply to my ping a week later.

Think she got cold feet as she shared reservations about the neighbor thing which I downplayed as we’re both mature enough to be chill about it. Ultimately she back rationalised as I failed to close the deal.

In hindsight I could of micro-escalated more but any ideas on how to improve this LMR is welcome




Girl 2 - Daygame Number grab

This is one of my strangest ones ever.

Blonde girl checks me out on the bus and I pretend to not see it. Approach her from the side when we get out,chit chat and get her number.

Proceed to text her and get her out for a bar for drinks. 2nd gen verbals, bit of touching & she’s super open about sex, having a high drive etc.

We get back to mine for drinks. Start kissing her and she’s responsive but shortly after says:

“Sorry I get more friend vibes between us… You’re attractive, we get on but just not feeling it”

I laugh and say cool,I’m just chilling and not even tried anything with you, chit chat, escalate and get her turned on but she won’t let me touch her pussy but everything else is fair came.

She then later asks me how big my dick is and I reply “not had any complaints”

Eventually she has to go and again goes nowhere unsurprisingly.

In hindsight I could of pulled my cock out , tried offering a massage and perhaps been more explicit with my game style IE say I want to fuck you at the right time.

This girl is the type to like more hood black guys and in the past they see me as “too soft”

Again any ideas welcome



Girl 3 - Online Mexican

I’ll keep this short and sweet. Day 2 with Mexican girl who is a little shy and slow with English so think a lot of my usual verbal game didn’t hit.

Round mine for drinks & first time in a while where I get the LMR where a girl just stops the interaction to not feel turned on e.g. kisses you, suck’s your lips, gets into it then just gets up.

Like she’s trying to short fuse herself getting turned on. From how she kissed she seemed more nervous /less experienced and mentioned never had a BF before but I’m simply speculating.

Any advice on this is welcome and for context I’ve read all the main LMR girlschase guides…

Thank you!

with girl number 1 :

With girl 1 you said you did second gen, but not your best??? I don't know what this means.... But, pyco (pull you dick out) would have worked, even the @topcat stuff about being small and put your hands over it (as long is above average)... or the way i do it is as i am kissing sucking tits, i act all exited and pull it out masturbating to her tits/body complimenting it while squezzing my dick over pants and then pulling it out and masturbating, sometimes "if i have lemons make lemonade" and keep jerking sometimes i put hand over dick or masturbate on top of her in missionary rubbing against clit over panties, depending on situation, then put her hands over my dick and she jerks it...

With girl number 2:

again pyco (pull out dick) and repeat the ^....


Girl number 3:

- the issue is you overplayed cause since she is inexperience did not match your expectations of coming straight home, the coming straight home put the asd up and on guard in this particular situation, she was never was able to relax, if she is not relax there is not arousal and logical mind, and fight/flight response.... in this one 3 bounce or meeting outside would have worked out better even for meet number 2...


for lmr these are proven:

Transitions - Back to physical game: Reinforcement of NO SEXUAL act while physical/verbally escalating....

It seems that the community went through a face of verbal game, then we went through a phase of physical game, then some of the guys from nextasf brought back verbal game with the second generation stuff.... The problem is it seems that most of the guys for what i notice in the forum have...

www.skilledseducer.com

on pyco: