Socializing Most of my friends married... bitches?

[ulrich]

Hi fellow seducers

There is a puzzle bothering me for the last couple of months and I thought that perhaps one of you with higher social circle skills would be able to solve it.

I have a group of really close friends since high school who are actually very high value men and over the years we have kept a very close friendship.
As we close to 40 years old, most of them have gotten married, with only one staying single and me with a long term exclusive relationship.

Now, most of my friends married very attractive women and these women had very nice personalities too... or so it seemed...

As time passes, one thing I notice is that these women are not actually half as nice as they seem.
Sure, they are great putting a nice face in public but in private they seem to be quite ball-busting.

Some of the things I've heard they do from my friends or actually noticed by myself when spending considerable time with them:

+ Constant and repetitive arguments
+ Public tantrums
+ Throwing phony compliments at other women
+ Showing off their wealth (most time their husband's)
+ Competing between them about how much money they spend (dressed off as talking about luxury and experience)
+ Forbiding my friends from going to bachelor parties

Overall this seems a mix of controlling attitudes along with competing on money (why the hell they compete on money they didn't earn themselves seems alien to me).
From my observations, I think most of my friends can handle the heat... but the heat for some is quite strong to the point that I can safely bet there will be a couple divorces in the future.

So yeah, this is pretty uncomfortable... particularly for my gf who is the sweetest most innocent girl who has to deal with these women.


In any case, my question is... how is it that most of my friends (many of whom had an abundance of choice with women) ended up with the ones who look good on the outside but are a pain to live with?

I would think that it is common sense, if you have such abundance, that you go for the hottest nicest girl you can get.

How is it not obvious?

Or am I missing something?

 

[Chase]

@ulrich,

I'd say you're about two steps away from buying Why Men Marry Bitches

Ever try asking your buddies why they married the chicks they did, and not equally hot but far sweeter/more submissive ones?

There are basically two types of men in the world:

1. Men who value peace and placidity above all else. They don't need the woman to be stimulating or exciting. They just need her to be there, make their lives more comfortable, and not do anything to rock the boat too much.
   
   
2. Men who desire a girl they can be excited about. They need an energetic, confident, passionate, stimulating woman. You end up in "have to take the bad with the good" situations there, though, because impassioned women are impassioned about EVERYTHING -- they are loads of fun when in good moods, and loads of aggravation in bad ones.

These two personalities will never truly 'understand' one another and are prone to biased thinking when they attempt to. The guys who like sweet girls think the guys who like exciting ones are gluttons for punishment trapping themselves in aggravating, energy-consuming nonsense. The guys who like exciting girls think the ones who like sweet ones are softies or else just boring people themselves trapping themselves in aggravating, enervating languor. Both are actually kind of right, but also miss a big part of the mark.

We could go deeper into the psychology of it, but it's ultimately different internal drives and mental reward circuits between these two types of people.

Either way you go, though, excitement & drama or sweetness & placidity, the Grimm Brothers fairy tale "The Three Little Men in the Forest" has a good line about it.

When the daughter of a widower tells him the widow next door wants to know if he'll marry her, he replies, "What should I do? Marriage is a blessing and a torment."

Chase

 

[POB]

Personally, I think this is common but very avoidable (to a certain degree).
It all comes back to how they started their relationships.
Having a strong frame and tightly settting your boundaries from the get go is crucial when dealing with hot energetic women!
I'll come back to it later with more details ...

 

[ulrich]

Ever try asking your buddies why they married the chicks they did, and not equally hot but far sweeter/more submissive ones?

Oh no, I would never

I cannot imagine that conversation going any way other than akward and defensive.

These two personalities will never truly 'understand' one another and are prone to biased thinking when they attempt to. The guys who like sweet girls think the guys who like exciting ones are gluttons for punishment trapping themselves in aggravating, energy-consuming nonsense. The guys who like exciting girls think the ones who like sweet ones are softies or else just boring people themselves trapping themselves in aggravating, enervating languor. Both are actually kind of right, but also miss a big part of the mark.

Ah, OK. That makes sense!
So it’s basically a reversed grass is always greener kind of situation.

When the daughter of a widower tells him the widow next door wants to know if he'll marry her, he replies, "What should I do? Marriage is a blessing and a torment."

thank you @Chase

Personally, I think this is common but very avoidable (to a certain degree).
It all comes back to how they started their relationships.
Having a strong frame and tightly settting your boundaries from the get go is crucial when dealing with hot energetic women!
I'll come back to it later with more details ...

I’d lover to read that @POB

 

[orkie123]

There are basically two types of men in the world:

1. Men who value peace and placidity above all else. They don't need the woman to be stimulating or exciting. They just need her to be there, make their lives more comfortable, and not do anything to rock the boat too much.
   
   
2. Men who desire a girl they can be excited about. They need an energetic, confident, passionate, stimulating woman. You end up in "have to take the bad with the good" situations there, though, because impassioned women are impassioned about EVERYTHING -- they are loads of fun when in good moods, and loads of aggravation in bad ones.

How set in stone are these 2 distinctions? Because I do notice that most girls fall into these 2 categories, and both extremes repel me for a LTR.

My ex was a good balance for me in regards to this:

-She was passionate about her job which involves helping others and was thus kind hearted
-She loved silly challenges and games, and would get extremely competitive which I like
-Spontaneous and up for new challenges and doing some crazy shit in public without caring too much

But also

- Relatively shy and didnt need too many friends
- Hardly went to clubs/bars
- hardly used social media and didnt have many followers/friends on the 2 she had
- Not the most feminine, but still liked to dress up
- Liked to be led
- didnt care about flashy possesions and preferred adventures to expensive clothes or jewellery etc


In the end, the 'passionate' side to her was the reason we broke up - she kept changing her mind what she wanted out of life and thats saying something given that Im lucky enough to have the flexibility to earn money from anywhere in the world.

Esentially, I want a girl similar to her that also 'knows roughly what she wants'.

I dont feel like im asking for a unicorn, but it is rare for me to meet girls like this, let alone for them to be single and to be able to attract them.

 

[Chase]

@orkie123,

I'd probably put her in the calm temperament camp based on that description.

Just because she's calm doesn't mean she can't ever do anything fun and has no interests at all.

It just means that rather than have strong, rigid opinions and be thinking for herself all the time, resisting leadership by anyone other than herself, she is waiting to be led, a bit indecisive, kind of drifting along more, more open to suggestion, etc.

I'd note that:

- didnt need too many friends
- Hardly went to clubs/bars
- hardly used social media and didnt have many followers/friends on the 2 she had
- Not the most feminine, but still liked to dress up
- didnt care about flashy possesions and preferred adventures to expensive clothes or jewellery etc

All these (I removed "relatively shy" and "liked to be led") can vary between both the 'hot' and 'calm' types of gals.

You will find hot-tempered chicks who don't bother much with social media and aren't flashy dressers. You will find calm-tempered chicks who maintain active social medias and like to dress up. And vice versa.

These things (showoff-y things) are a different personality dimension than temperament.

Esentially, I want a girl similar to her that also 'knows roughly what she wants'.

I dont feel like im asking for a unicorn, but it is rare for me to meet girls like this, let alone for them to be single and to be able to attract them.

You can find calm-temperament gals who have clear goals for themselves.

e.g., I had a calm-tempered girlfriend who very clearly knew she wanted to get married, have a kid or two, and run her own architecture firm.

It could be an age thing... or maybe just a maturity thing. Not sure how old your girlfriend was; that architect GF of mine was 28.

People tend to figure things out more as they age.

Chase

 

[Skills]

this is common, most shit test and boundaries test happen during the relationship.. Same with more taming and power dynamics.....

If the dude start caving it, and mantainin piece and falling for the victim, dread, nagging attempts to please her (part of betatizaation attempts)...

Some women will get angry and even PUNISH YOU, i seen it..... Similar to the ruthlessness during break ups that some women have........

^ some women worst than other, and for some reason i have personally experience this with the more attractive ones, don't ask me why? i have no idea.... (eastern european the worst on this)

bd best work imho kind of related:

What Men Don’t Understand About Female Attraction - Alpha Male 2.0

This is one of the most important blog posts I’ve ever made. I hope you understand how important this is. It’s a tough one. It is the single most difficult thing men have trouble understanding about women in relationships. Even very woman-experienced men have trouble...

alphamale20.com

 

[orkie123]

this is common, most shit test and boundaries test happen during the relationship.. Same with more taming and power dynamics.....

If the dude start caving it, and mantainin piece and falling for the victim, dread, nagging attempts to please her (part of betatizaation attempts)...

Some women will get angry and even PUNISH YOU, i seen it..... Similar to the ruthlessness during break ups that some women have........

^ some women worst than other, and for some reason i have personally experience this with the more attractive ones, don't ask me why? i have no idea.... (eastern european the worst on this)

bd best work imho kind of related:

What Men Don’t Understand About Female Attraction - Alpha Male 2.0

This is one of the most important blog posts I’ve ever made. I hope you understand how important this is. It’s a tough one. It is the single most difficult thing men have trouble understanding about women in relationships. Even very woman-experienced men have trouble...

alphamale20.com

Is it possible for LTRs to have relatively equal boundaries and still keep her respect and desire?

For example, I wouldn't date any girl exclusively if she is okey with going for 1to1 drinks with guys unless it is a rare and work related thing. I find it disrespectful.

That said, I'm hypocritical and wouldn't want to apply the same boundary to myself. I know that many people apply 1-sided boundaries, but even though it's what I want, it creates conflict within me because 1) I like to balance fairness in my life and feel manipulative 2) I also lose attraction for girls if they comply too much.

 

[Skills]

Is it possible for LTRs to have relatively equal boundaries and still keep her respect and desire?

of course

For example, I wouldn't date any girl exclusively if she is okey with going for 1to1 drinks with guys unless it is a rare and work related thing. I find it disrespectful.

That is unlikely to happen unless is a gay dude, so i dont know why would you list this as an example.... Most women drink in social occassions with women or with mix set not with "only guys"

That said, I'm hypocritical and wouldn't want to apply the same boundary to myself. I know that many people apply 1-sided boundaries, but even though it's what I want, it creates conflict within me because 1) I like to balance fairness in my life and feel manipulative 2) I also lose attraction for girls if they comply too much.

boundaries are different from men and women, and is ingrained culturally and societally... If you have good ltr game, you will be fine, and if you go into an ltr the right way that works too and what i insist about "history of cheating"....

 

[orkie123]

That is unlikely to happen unless is a gay dude, so i dont know why would you list this as an example.... Most women drink in social occassions with women or with mix set not with "only guys"

Really?

Most of the girls I meet, I wouldn't even try to get them to stop this behavior, it would be impossible. That's why I quickly filter them out of LTR. But even the ones that seem more traditional/conservative and come from countries where it's more of the norm, I see it all the time where they go on drinks 1to1 with other guys or they come with me when they have serious bfs... Even if nothing happens, some would still let me run a lot of kino, etc that to me is pure disrespect for their bfs...

I dont know what Im doing wrong to keep finding girls like this lol. Just to make it clear, I don't judge these girls, they are great for FWB or even just friends to hang out, but I'm really struggling to find girls I would want to date LTR...

 

[Skills]

Really?

Most of the girls I meet, I wouldn't even try to get them to stop this behavior, it would be impossible. That's why I quickly filter them out of LTR. But even the ones that seem more traditional/conservative and come from countries where it's more of the norm, I see it all the time where they go on drinks 1to1 with other guys or they come with me when they have serious bfs... Even if nothing happens, some would still let me run a lot of kino, etc that to me is pure disrespect for their bfs...

I dont know what Im doing wrong to keep finding girls like this lol. Just to make it clear, I don't judge these girls, they are great for FWB or even just friends to hang out, but I'm really struggling to find girls I would want to date LTR...

deleted last post talked to mrs. skills she said you are right, if the guy and girl were friends before of she is in the hospitality industry bar tender, waitress is normal and is not big deal and doesn't mean anything....

So i would not worry about it...