Socializing Pass the Shit Test...

[AdamC]

Hey there...

So I threw some DayGame at a High Caliber girl at the Whole Foods today. After my open which she bit, I practiced teasing her by asking if she was trouble or caused trouble because she was a red head, and when I was in college, I worked with an older Mexican Kat who was a ladies man and he told me - be careful of redheads cuz they can cause trouble. (This is actually a true story - he called them fire crotches, and said they were wild in bed, but fuckin' crazy...)

Anyway, she hooked. Then she sucked me into a little bit of interview talk about our professional - she's head of production at a high end tv commercial... And then she said something to the likes - "But that doesn't matter because you and I won't ever hang out anyway..." And paused looking at me.

Quarterback sack...

As we walked to the grocery store line and all I could reply was - "Yeah, I'm not sure how to respond to that."
I tried qualifying her a couple times after that, and she gave me these cold answers kind like auto-rejection, but not really. And I extended my hand and said - "Cool meeting you, I gotta do the rest of my shopping," and I dipped back into the aisles waitning for her to leave.

Of course when I got in my car - That's when I fucking got a good answer to what I took as a Shit test - "You're right we probably won't hang out, cuz your a red head that's trouble - remember..." But even if I did deliver that line as the answer to the shit test, I'm not sure what I would follow it up with - another qualifier??

So to those who have the experience... When a girl spits out - "well we'll probably never hangout anyway"
OR, as I've gotten too - "Tell me something interesting about yourself?" Her: "There's nothing interesting about me, I'm completely boring..."

What are your replies?
And what will prevent this "quarter back sack" that seems to happen when high caliber girls like this throw out that kinda shit test?

Interested in thoughts!

 

[FAB DRONES]

If you poop good, the girls will like you!

 

[Gorili]

When a girl spits out - "well we'll probably never hangout anyway"

"Hang out? Hmm, I think you're getting ahead of yourself. I only hang out with interesting people who bring value and good energy. Would you say you're someone who's a net positive around people? [After she answers with 'most of the time' / 'yes'] oh yeah, how so?"

OR, as I've gotten too - "Tell me something interesting about yourself?" Her: "There's nothing interesting about me, I'm completely boring..."

I would not use an imperative statement here as this puts them on the spot to qualify. If it's too early in the conversation and / or there's not enough compliance, then you get the response above, and the conversation is headed to an end.

I have the perfect solution though. It has the same effect as your line but just worded differently and avoids the pitfall. Use this line instead (field tested numerous times): "If I were to ask you, what is something that you really enjoy besides eating and sleeping, what would you say?" Then follow up to her response by building similarity and pacing when possible.

And what will prevent this "quarter back sack" that seems to happen when high caliber girls like this throw out that kinda shit test?

Tease them early so that it doesn't end up resembling an interview talk at a networking event to prevent the shit test in the first place. You can also cut threads or give her the bored look if she's becoming too professional. I would say staying calm is also important. Talk slowly so you can buy time and think about what to say next.

 

[Will_V]

Hey there...

So I threw some DayGame at a High Caliber girl at the Whole Foods today. After my open which she bit, I practiced teasing her by asking if she was trouble or caused trouble because she was a red head, and when I was in college, I worked with an older Mexican Kat who was a ladies man and he told me - be careful of redheads cuz they can cause trouble. (This is actually a true story - he called them fire crotches, and said they were wild in bed, but fuckin' crazy...)

Anyway, she hooked. Then she sucked me into a little bit of interview talk about our professional - she's head of production at a high end tv commercial... And then she said something to the likes - "But that doesn't matter because you and I won't ever hang out anyway..." And paused looking at me.

Quarterback sack...

As we walked to the grocery store line and all I could reply was - "Yeah, I'm not sure how to respond to that."
I tried qualifying her a couple times after that, and she gave me these cold answers kind like auto-rejection, but not really. And I extended my hand and said - "Cool meeting you, I gotta do the rest of my shopping," and I dipped back into the aisles waitning for her to leave.

Of course when I got in my car - That's when I fucking got a good answer to what I took as a Shit test - "You're right we probably won't hang out, cuz your a red head that's trouble - remember..." But even if I did deliver that line as the answer to the shit test, I'm not sure what I would follow it up with - another qualifier??

So to those who have the experience... When a girl spits out - "well we'll probably never hangout anyway"
OR, as I've gotten too - "Tell me something interesting about yourself?" Her: "There's nothing interesting about me, I'm completely boring..."

What are your replies?
And what will prevent this "quarter back sack" that seems to happen when high caliber girls like this throw out that kinda shit test?

Interested in thoughts!

Sounds like cases for agree and amplify.

Her: "You and I won't hang out anyway"
You: "Definitely not, you're way too much trouble" smile/wink

Her: "I'm completely boring, there's nothing interesting about me"
You: "Yeah I could tell when I first saw you, but why don't you humor me" smile/wink/nudge

 

[ChrisXKiss]

Hey there...

So I threw some DayGame at a High Caliber girl at the Whole Foods today. After my open which she bit, I practiced teasing her by asking if she was trouble or caused trouble because she was a red head, and when I was in college, I worked with an older Mexican Kat who was a ladies man and he told me - be careful of redheads cuz they can cause trouble. (This is actually a true story - he called them fire crotches, and said they were wild in bed, but fuckin' crazy...)

Anyway, she hooked. Then she sucked me into a little bit of interview talk about our professional - she's head of production at a high end tv commercial... And then she said something to the likes - "But that doesn't matter because you and I won't ever hang out anyway..." And paused looking at me.

Quarterback sack...

As we walked to the grocery store line and all I could reply was - "Yeah, I'm not sure how to respond to that."
I tried qualifying her a couple times after that, and she gave me these cold answers kind like auto-rejection, but not really. And I extended my hand and said - "Cool meeting you, I gotta do the rest of my shopping," and I dipped back into the aisles waitning for her to leave.

Of course when I got in my car - That's when I fucking got a good answer to what I took as a Shit test - "You're right we probably won't hang out, cuz your a red head that's trouble - remember..." But even if I did deliver that line as the answer to the shit test, I'm not sure what I would follow it up with - another qualifier??

So to those who have the experience... When a girl spits out - "well we'll probably never hangout anyway"
OR, as I've gotten too - "Tell me something interesting about yourself?" Her: "There's nothing interesting about me, I'm completely boring..."

What are your replies?
And what will prevent this "quarter back sack" that seems to happen when high caliber girls like this throw out that kinda shit test?

Interested in thoughts!

Having something good as a comeback to the tease is one thing. Having her truly interested in seeing you again is another. I have had situations where I had very good responses but in the end it didn't seem to matter that much. I feel that this girl was not that interested from the beginning due to how you came off at the approach and generally with your vibe. She did hook in the sense that she talked, but she was there shopping anyway, and she is a nice person, so as long as you didn't bother her she was fine having a little chat.

The whole thing with her staying to talk to you very professionally reminds me a lot about girls that are simply friendly and social, but don't see you as a dating prospect. Chase has a great article regarding how much of a challenge women perceive you to be:

Being a Challenge to Women (& REALLY Turning Them On)

Back on the article about gym pickup, The Tool (one of our forum members as well) commented in asking about ways he could meet girls in the gym as a member of the staff, without overstepping professional boundaries: “It was 8 am and this girl wanted to Tan and she had another hour before she...

www.girlschase.com

The idea is that if she is just talking to you calmly, nicely without being nervous, excited aloof or rude, and generally she doesn't seem to comply, it means she just doesn't see you as a challenge but more like a nice guy that could be a friend under the right circumstances.

In these situations I have found out that any material you try to throw at them, teases, push pulls, qualifications, it seems to not faze them at all. Even if you manage to make them laugh let's say, or have a good comeback, they may think oh this is good, but to me it comes off as more of a: Oh, look at what he had as a comeback, he is really trying isn't he?

I feel the most important part is the vibe you have during the interaction, the fundamentals and how you come off. There is another article Ricardus has about first impressions that is also really good regarding that:

A Good First Impression: Making One Every Time

As we all know, you don't get a second chance to make a good first impression. And this is more than just a cliché... this is HUGE! I'll say it again: You just DON'T get a second chance! Studies in the field of sales have confirmed the old adage. As it turns out, 80% of our perception of a...

www.girlschase.com

In the end, it is good to have some answers to the shit tests, and the others gave some great approaches to that. In fact in this scenario it's probable that she would give you some chance if it was handled correctly, but I still feel that it was mostly off from the beginning. I think the most important thing is controlling how you are perceived initially and then the flow of the interaction. If she just seems friendly and you follow along the friendly vibe she gives off, you are simply accepting this a just a nice discussion.

By the way, I love your posts, because these are the kind of women that fire me up as well. The girl that pushed me to get way more seriously into improving my skills in all this was a tall slim fashion designer in Milan I met sitting down at a sidewalk, we talked for a bit, even had lunch together, and I couldn't understand why she never even answered my first text. But then I realised, I was just a nice conversation during her day with nothing else to offer her. And this stung, but it was the trigger that made me say I will go so hard at this, that I will reach the point where I will be thinking if they have anything else to offer me.

 

[AdamC]

Good stuff Chris X, Will V, Mr.Man, and Gorili...

And interesting update applying what I learned above. I DayGamed 2 females today, one who might turn out to be a decent Professional Contact - she's cute but more on the average side. Not very warm and fuzzy, but could turn out to valuable in my industry.

The other would be a valuable score (for me anyway) if the logistics are right, however her logistics look pretty bad. She's in acting school which is having finals this week, so she's in class from 10am to 9:30pm. She was ambiguous about the weekend, then Monday the 1st she's off to Rhode Island with her friends for a week to 10 days and who knows who she'll be with and what will happen, and I can't put my life on hold for other prospects for her.

However, she's another 10. I wouldn't be surprised if I found out she did OnlyFans - quite prevalent in Southern California with any aspiring actress, model, Starbucks barista! She's 21 year old hipster with cowboy boots, short skirt, midriff top, and aviator sunglasses. I'm in my 30's so to pull that would be great... Told her that she was just a kid, and that maybe should couldn't handle my wisdom and experience.

If anything it was a boost to what I am learning and applying here. It was a sidewalk approach, just as I parked that turned into a kinda instadate where I went with her to the stationary store for she to buy a folder for her acting scripts. Teased her. Didn't really get shit tests like the other girls, which was kind of a concern however before I got her info I was touching her arm teasing her about how someone drew on her with a sharpie - i.e. making a joke about one of her tattoos. Then went and was playing with her finger that she had a snake ring on. I asked if she bits, she giggled. I asked if she had venom.

Now will this be a solid number? I don't know.
Can I make a date and then the pull - I don't know.

If anything, It's one step further than yesterday. And I have a quota of 3 solid approaches per day this week through the 4th. Of which tomorrow I have to do 4, because I only was able to accomplish 2 today...

Any advice?

 

[Gorili]

The other would be a valuable score (for me anyway) if the logistics are right, however her logistics look pretty bad. She's in acting school which is having finals this week, so she's in class from 10am to 9:30pm. She was ambiguous about the weekend, then Monday the 1st she's off to Rhode Island with her friends for a week to 10 days and who knows who she'll be with and what will happen, and I can't put my life on hold for other prospects for her.

I meet a lot of college girls, and you're 100% correct that finals will make things difficult. Here's what's going on in their head. They'll be focusing on the final every minute until it ends. After it ends, they can't wait to get out of this place (both mentally and physically) and let loose. I think Friday night and the weekend would be your best bet logistics-wise.

Like you mentioned, you definitely want to get her out before she jets off. Depending on what happens in Rhode Island, she might not even remember you when she comes back...

Now will this be a solid number? I don't know.
Can I make a date and then the pull - I don't know.

You wanna know if it's a solid number or not? Then ping her immediately. Read up on @Skills' texting guides. I'm not too familiar with how acting finals are structured, but for your opener text, it should be something related to the previous conversation thread (like finals) with a positive tone. Maybe make a joke about whether she was able to pull off an Angelina Jolie acting performance, or whichever other good actress (I'm sure you can think of one).

If she bites -> banter -> on high point soft close. Text something like "congrats on acing your final, we needa celebrate." Then hard close and figure out logistics.

 

[AdamC]

Good stuff.
So my first text today would be something like:
"Hey Hazel, hope you gave your best Scarlet Johansson performance on yesterday's video shoot..."

See, she was talking about how she got out of class yesterday because she had an internet video shoot to do in the afternoon or even.
Course, how warped I am from Cali girls, my mind went to her doing an onlyfans shoot, but that's just in my head.

We'll see if she bites, and perhaps I'll reach out again for the soft close for Fri, or Sat.
Sat I have two art openings I have to go to for networking. She said she studied art in boarding school. She also mentioned how she has a very tight "social circle," and kinda really only dates within that circle or who she meets via that circle...

 

[AdamC]

Update...

So following the advice above, yesterday I text the 21year old acting student an icebreaker in the morning, then a semi qualifier text in the evening. Both no response!

Icebreaker - "It was amusing meeting you yesterday Hazel"
Qualifier text later - "So I'm curious. did you give your best Scarlett Johanesson performance on that video shoot last night?"

So I'm not sure if there is anything to work on for a third text to try and get something happening for Friday or the weekend before she leaves?
Also, it's a let down that it turns out to be a lame-duck number for an instadate, daygame experience which seemed so promising. (although as I said before her logistics and then leaving town suck)

So thoughts??

Later I will do a separate post asking how an older guy in his 30's or 40's can game early 20's girls if possible
One of the guys whose videos I watch on youtube, including his great infield daygame, says it's possible and he's in his 40s.

I reviewed both of the articles above. A couple of notes...

1. I disagree that one shouldn't use the "false time constraint" particularly in daygame.
The youtube guy advocates it, and I use it, and it seems to help quell the fear from the girl that you are there just to hit on girls, vs going from one place to another, and just organically stopped for her. And that you won't awkwardly hang on her for a while, unless it becomes super interesting like that instadate with the 21 year old...

2. Ricardus's "vibe" article. YES - coming in with a nervous vibe will possibly decrease your value, or attainability, etc. Or creep out the girl.
But, if you are trying to overcome Approach Anxiety - there is no other fucking way to do it.
YOU ARE GOING to BE NERVOUS
And the only way to get over nervousness is to finally have some wins,
So how do you still approach when you are nervous - but still have a good first impression?
Seems like a Catch-22 here...

Interested in thoughts.

 

[ChrisXKiss]

I'll try to give some thoughts, not an expert though, just from what I've seen with myself

So following the advice above, yesterday I text the 21year old acting student an icebreaker in the morning, then a semi qualifier text in the evening. Both no response!

Yeah that doesn't look good. One thing I would change is probably send the icebreaker the same day, some hours after the approach, not too long though. This can also vary depending on the vibe you felt with a girl, and maybe even wait a bit more before sending the second text. I understand there is time pressure for her leaving, but unless you specifically discussed doing something and you need a confirmation, it feels a bit chasing to double text the same day.

But all this is mostly best practices, they won't really make a not interested girl become interested.

So I'm not sure if there is anything to work on for a third text to try and get something happening for Friday or the weekend before she leaves?

Can't really tell if something will work, but what I have started doing lately when left on read is send a voice message. I feel it's a bit more personal. I'm doing it after the first time left on read usually, and basically greet the girl telling something about my day, asking about hers and maybe inviting her out depending on where we are in the conversation. At least it breaks the pattern of text, after text with no response.

Also, it's a let down that it turns out to be a lame-duck number for an instadate, daygame experience which seemed so promising. (although as I said before her logistics and then leaving town suck)

By the way, when you say instadate, did you just go with her to the stationary store, so that she could buy her things? Because if you only did that, to me it feels like she didn't really comply to anything or commit to the interaction at all. She went to the place she wanted to go, to buy her stuff, while you accompanied her. I don't think that the frame here is good. In a way it seems like you had nothing to do and basically followed the girl to what she was doing.

I am also guilty of similar practices, thinking that I can spend more time with the girl in this way. But I don't remember a particular situation, where it really worked out. Every time it ends up feeling that I am doing whatever I am doing simply to stay with her more, and unless you can be very nonchalant and she already likes you a lot, she will feel a: "he is really trying to stay with me more, isn't he?".

I am trying to think if a very high value man with options would do something like that, and I feel maybe only if that place was on his way or if he was planning to do something with the girl afterwards. For example, you propose to go for a drink, she says she really needs to go buy folders quickly, so you are like cool, I also need some pencils, let's do that and then go to this very cute cafe close to the stationary store I know, you will love it!

Later I will do a separate post asking how an older guy in his 30's or 40's can game early 20's girls if possible

Honestly would love that as well. There are some good articles already like:

How to Pick Up Younger Women (18-22)

Yesterday I responded to a post on our forum about succeeding with girls in the 19- to 23-years-old range from a guy in his mid-30s who noted he does fine with women over 23 but struggles to get anywhere with younger gals. I wanted to flesh this one out a bit more and make it a proper post. If...

www.girlschase.com

But anything more on this topic would be valuable. I feel that the older you get the more the fundamentals are very important, you have to really be high value to bridge the difference. What I have been trying is to be authoritative when opening, but then I struggle to be relatable, so still working on it.

One of the guys whose videos I watch on youtube, including his great infield daygame, says it's possible and he's in his 40s.

I don't know who you are talking about, but I did see a video from a guy around the same age on this exact topic lately. Not sure if posting material from another dating professional is allowed here, but feel free to send me a personal one regarding that.

1. I disagree that one shouldn't use the "false time constraint" particularly in daygame

I am not sure where that was stated and under what context. I guess it's good if the girl seems to be in a rush especially, but wouldn't say that it's needed every single time. I mean if you even want an instadate as you say, it will feel a bit incongruent to first tell her you have to go in a second, then propose to catch a coffee.

But, if you are trying to overcome Approach Anxiety - there is no other fucking way to do it.
YOU ARE GOING to BE NERVOUS

I feel that especially when you are still dealing with approach anxiety, focusing on just that is more important. If you see what behaviours are described as not masculine in the article ( being gamey, entertainer and using pick up lines a lot ) they are things a lot of people resort to, after getting into approaching, in order to hook and create attraction. Maybe in the beginning these techniques would be even good to help overcome the approach anxiety, giving you some material to have ready and not overthink. What I feel the article wants to say is that eventually as you get more comfortable approaching and talking to women, the focus should be on having more of a masculine vibe.

 

[Gorili]

@AdamC,

Since you've already sent two texts without receiving a response, I would not text her further this week (or send a voice message) unless she responds first. I've field tested this extensively, and from my experience, texting a 3rd time in a row has never yielded anything positively meaningful. See this thread for a related discussion. The consensus in that thread is similar to my observations.

So far, what we're seeing is not good. If the girl is in 'finals mode', she'll get back to you once she is out of it and reply later in the week, perhaps out of the blue in the evening / at night. I would de-prioritize her in the meantime and focus on other girls in your pipeline.

If she doesn't respond at all this week and you really want to triple text, wait until 4th of July next week. Then, ping her with a simple 'happy 4th of July' and see how it goes. To keep your mind off of her, you might as well ping all your recent stale leads with the same line and see who bites.

 

[Will_V]

@AdamC are you seeding the date before you take her number?

Update...

So following the advice above, yesterday I text the 21year old acting student an icebreaker in the morning, then a semi qualifier text in the evening. Both no response!

Icebreaker - "It was amusing meeting you yesterday Hazel"

First of all, icebreakers are sent soon after the interaction, while you're still fresh in her emotions and memory. Sending it the next day is not optimal.

Second, it's not a great text as it's very hard to understand what 'amusing' is supposed to mean. It almost sounds like a polite insult.

Remember texts have no body language behind them, so anything ambiguous can easily be read the wrong way, that's why it's best to keep them simple, positive, and leading forward toward a date. She doesn't want to have to try and figure out what you mean, or risk misunderstanding you, so it's easier just to ghost you.

Icebreakers don't need to be complicated, it's just establishing communication.

"Hey HB, wonderful to have met -Adam" (credit Chase, I use this one a lot)
"Hey HB, save my number! -Adam"
"Hey HB, great meeting you this afternoon -Adam"

You just want something simple, warm, and non ambiguous.

Qualifier text later - "So I'm curious. did you give your best Scarlett Johanesson performance on that video shoot last night?"

Was Scarlett Johanesson a theme of your approach conversation? If not, there's no point bringing her up, since again the meaning of the comparison is ambiguous. Is this a tease? It's not clear. And using these words like 'curious' and 'amusing' in relationship to your interactions is just not how familiar people usually talk to eachother.

I'd just have gone with something simple:

"Sooo, tell me you aced your video shoot last night "

Again, simple, warm, positive, nothing to decode.

 

[AdamC]

Gotcha. Good stuff fellas.
Icebreaker - sameday
Texts - short, simple (no flirting, qualifiers)
Yes I did seed a date, but that's when she described her "tough schedule."
I've got 3 solid approaches on my "to do list" for today. As well as for tomorrow.

See all you fellas on the next post!

 

[Gorili]

Texts - short, simple (no flirting, qualifiers)

I don't think this was what was said...

If you don't flirt at all, then the conversation could come off as very bland. As @Will_V was saying above, the choice of words could have been adjusted to remove the ambiguous meaning. You could also have added an emoticon / emoji to illustrate that you're just messing with her, not taking her seriously, and spice things up.

 

[Teparus]

That was a golden opportunity for chase framing.

"Wow, you're already thinking of hanging out with me? Aw, that's so sweet. But, anyway, like I was saying, blah blah other topic," said with a half-surprised, half-playful face.

You're acknowledging and responding to what she's saying, so you don't lose points for not showing up to the frame battle, at the same time, you're not complying with her frame -- you're setting up your own frame for her to potentially comply with (or at least not object to). And to top it off, it's not any old frame, but a chase frame, one of the most powerful tools in a man's arsenal.

ANY time a girl says something or other "won't be happening", I immediately reframe it was "Oh, so you were thinking of X already, eh?" in one form or another. It should be instinctive.

What I have been trying is to be authoritative when opening, but then I struggle to be relatable, so still working on it.

I'm curious, what does this look like in practice for you? I'm trying to imagine "looking authoritative" in daygame in a way that isn't highly situational and failing.

 

[Will_V]

I don't think this was what was said...

If you don't flirt at all, then the conversation could come off as very bland. As @Will_V was saying above, the choice of words could have been adjusted to remove the ambiguous meaning. You could also have added an emoticon / emoji to illustrate that you're just messing with her, not taking her seriously, and spice things up.

Well, it's not flirting per se but it's not boring texts either.

Flirting in my experience just doesn't really do anything on text. The pleasure of flirting is not in the words but in the body language, the tension, the eye contact, the pauses, your presence - and in texts all that is stripped away, leaving only the words. Unless she's got a great imagination and memory to imagine you saying them, which most girls just aren't doing, she's going to read them in the flattest of tones and they won't have any effect. And besides, flirtatious words by themselves typically sound blunt and overbearing, and it's only by saying them the right way that they dominate the space in a pleasurable way.

That said, I try to make my texts sound brusque and familiar, while also being warm. Notice I didn't ask 'how did the video shoot go?" I said "Tell me you aced the video shoot " A slight command followed by a smile. That's the sort of thing I aim for, where I come across as if we are already together and I'm assuming that we can talk that way already. I always avoid questions on text if at all possible.

Flirting on text can be done, but personally I don't enjoy it, and it seems to be mostly a waste of time - either she's attracted by your approach, or she's not and no amount of text flirting will change that.