Advanced Technique Show Solidarity: Backing Girls Up in Fights

[Chase]

I just replied to a field report of Scofield's where he talks about a girl he'd met whom he was really into and who was really into him where the night got ruined following a fight the girl got into with another girl in the bathroom at the end of the night. He jumped in the middle and tried to play the role of peacemaker (side note: he had some reasons for not wanting to stir up trouble in that particular venue), and things spiraled down to disaster after that, with the girl treating him like a nice guy by evening's end rather than the sexy, interesting, alluring guy he'd been to her later. What happened?

The problem was this: you've got to back girls up in fights if you want to win with them.

The examples I referenced to Scofield were Monsterslimjim's New Year's Eve threesome report that came as a result of him backing up two girls he'd just met (report's here if you haven't read it yet) - Jay has a similar tale of his own he shares in response to Jim's post - and the mention in my ebook at the end of the book of a girl I slept with quickly who got upset because she thought some guys would judge her and I harshly eviscerated them to her in order to show solidarity.

What happens is that women (and men, too) very quickly assess how on their side you are when fights go down. And if you want to sleep with a girl later, you've got to be on her side.

It doesn't matter if the fight is over something stupid. Most fights are.

It doesn't matter if your girl is totally in the wrong.

YOU'VE GOT TO BACK HER UP.

Backing her up means you come in around the same level she's at. If she's shouting at someone else, you shout at them even louder and call them some really rude names. If she's in a fight with somebody, you shove them off her and mix it up with them a bit. Or you deck the guy, as Monsterslimjim did.

Once you've proven that you're firmly on her side and her fight is your fight, you can wind things down - you can step in and say, "Screw this person, she's not worth our time," and your girl will go along with your judgment because she's viewing you and her as one solid, cohesive unit. At that point, it becomes VERY easy to cool things off a bit, then pull her home and have some really passionate lovemaking.

Don't be the peacemaker. Peacemakers just take abuse from both sides and get appreciation from neither. Instead, back your friends up and make the other side back down.

And then take your girl home and shag her silly after that.

Chase

 

[PinotNoir]

Hey Chase, this definitely make sense, but I have 3 questions.

1. What about if you're not a very strong guy? Or even if you're strong, the guy is stronger or there are multiple? Should you just bark the loudest and hope that intimidates them? Or just always bow out and go find another girl? If I know that I'm going to get beaten to a pulp, I assume that won't be very sexy.

2. Wonder if you're yelling at a girl defending your girl and the girl hits you? I don't hit girls -- unless they have a weapon or trying to steal my money or something lol. If it's a typical girl, it's not going to hurt that bad, but how do you recover from that? I'm thinking after she slaps you that you would just say, "All right, this dumb. (look at your girl) Let's leave."

3. This hasn't happened to me personally, but I've seen sometimes with people in relationships. Your girlfriend yells at some guy or slaps him. Then the guy takes all of his rage out at you and starts to fight you. He can't hit the girl, and you think she was being dumb. Is there anyway out of this except fight?

Thanks man.

 

[Chase]

Pinot-

Hey Chase, this definitely make sense, but I have 3 questions.

1. What about if you're not a very strong guy? Or even if you're strong, the guy is stronger or there are multiple? Should you just bark the loudest and hope that intimidates them? Or just always bow out and go find another girl? If I know that I'm going to get beaten to a pulp, I assume that won't be very sexy.

Roughly, yes. There are ways of causing a lot of noise and bluster without actually escalating things all the way to a full-blown fight. There's a general escalation process to fighting that normally needs to occur, e.g., you shout at him, he shouts at you, you shove him, he shoves you, you hit him, he hits you. You don't normally just walk up to a guy without escalating it to fighting first and deck him out of nowhere. So, normally, you can shout and act like a buffoon but so long as you're not getting physical a fight usually won't break out. And once you're shouting, you can then calm things down. Like:

• Girl to Guy: OMG, you asshole! You just spilled your drink all over me!
  Guy to Girl: You clumsy skank, look where you're going! That drink was expensive!
  Girl to Guy: What did you just call me?
  You to Guy: Whoa, whoa - what the fuck are you saying to her?
  Guy to You: This bitch bumped into ME!
  You to Guy: I don't care who did WHAT, you don't talk to women that way.
  Guy to You: [mumbles something]
  You to Girl: Come on, fuck this guy, he's just angry he isn't getting laid.

Then get her out of there.

You escalate it a bit first => take the guy off guard => then turn to your girl and tell her something insulting about the guy and exit the situation with her.

2. Wonder if you're yelling at a girl defending your girl and the girl hits you? I don't hit girls -- unless they have a weapon or trying to steal my money or something lol. If it's a typical girl, it's not going to hurt that bad, but how do you recover from that? I'm thinking after she slaps you that you would just say, "All right, this dumb. (look at your girl) Let's leave."

You should usually defend yourself some way - shoving her off of you is probably best. Then just stare at her in shock for a few seconds and hold eye contact so she doesn't resume. Then turn to your girl, "Do you believe this dumb cunt? All right, FUCK her, let's get out of here."

3. This hasn't happened to me personally, but I've seen sometimes with people in relationships. Your girlfriend yells at some guy or slaps him. Then the guy takes all of his rage out at you and starts to fight you. He can't hit the girl, and you think she was being dumb. Is there anyway out of this except fight?

Thanks man.

It's a different story when you're in a relationship. I've seen that too - if you've got a girlfriend who's hitting other men, you've nearly always got bigger problems then figuring out how to respond to that interaction (e.g., what's she doing with those other men that's prompting them to do things with her that's prompting her to hit them?). Occasionally though, it might be the case that he's some drunk guy who's just being very aggressive with her and she's saying "no.. no... NO!" but he isn't getting the message, so she gets physical.

Either way, once the guy's trying to fight YOU, there's really nothing else you can do but beat the clay out of him. There are a number of things you can do to incapacitate bigger / stronger attackers quickly (the head butt's always been a favorite of mine... they really shock people, because no one's ever expecting it - they only ever see it in movies, and it means you're pretty serious. You bash your forehead into the guy's nose / mouth - doesn't hurt you, but hurts and shocks him like hell, and usually leaves him fairly bloody. Most drunk fights are people grabbing at each other anyway, which puts you in close proximity and makes this a lot easier to do), but if it's a big concern of yours and you're afraid of running into it, I'd suggest a few months of Krav Maga. It's practical real-world combat training, and readies you to spring into action just about whenever.

Realistically though, I've spent a LOT of time in a LOT of different clubs, some of them pretty ghetto places, some of them with fights regularly breaking out, over the past 8 years or so, and I've never gone into a fight that I couldn't have easily avoided (and I haven't had anyone shove me since 2009, or anyone hit me since 2007 - you figure out how to avoid those things).

It's usually better to just get away from fights if you can - most of the people trying to fight you are people who think they can win against you for whatever reason (they're big than you, they're good at fighting, etc.). So unless you're a lot better at fighting than you look, the safer bet is to get out of the situation.

Also - I had to go through counseling and appear before a judge for a club fight I was in in 2005, and they wanted to scare me with some worst-case scenarios, so told me about a kid a few years back who'd been in a bar fight, punched the other guy, and the other guy slipped, hit his head hard on the corner of a bar, and died. The kid ended up going to prison for manslaughter. The message stuck with me - I don't think I've been in a full-on brawl since then. There's too much that can go wrong if you're not properly trained - who wants to kill some guy by accident and get locked in a cage for the effort?

Back to the dude trying to fight you - usually a guy's only going to fight you if he sees you as an antagonizer. If your girl is getting into some bad stuff, and she's heated, and the guy's heated, the best thing to do is simply to walk up and be annoyed at the situation. "WHAT the fuck is going on here?" you ask them both, looking at them like a couple of bad-behaving school children. The other guy will jump in first to try to get you upset: "This BITCH just blah blah blah;" don't get upset, just turn to your girl and say, "Is that true?" and she'll say, "He's a fucking LIAR! HE'S the one who blah blah blah," at which point you're going to say, "Okay. I didn't see what happened. You [to the guy] seem to think she [whatever he says she did], and she seems to think you [whatever she says he did]. I don't know who's right; and because you're both emotional, I don't think either of you does either. So I'd like you BOTH to apologize to one another, and then you never have to talk to each other again." Then turn to your girl and tell her to apologize. Then turn back to the guy and tell him to apologize, please (nicely but very firmly). Then say okay, and gesture for your girl to go off, and then follow after her. I haven't done this with girls, but I've done it with friends and if you come across as more powerful, calm, and firm then either of them and are 100% certain about what you're saying, you can deescalate things here pretty fast.

Chase

 

[Jay]

To anyone who cares,

I just ran across this post and wanted to add a few personal pointers on fighting in a party/bar type situation, because I have had my fair share of fighting experiences.

I fought only a couple times in high school, nothing serious just a few brawls at house parties that were more wrestling than fighting and a few one on one encounters that generally ended favorably for me. Fighting only became a problem for me when I got to college. I spent the first month or so of college blackout drunk almost constantly, and would frequently wake up facedown in a pool of vomit with bloody knuckles and various minor injuries (I had a serious alcohol problem to say the least, that I have thankfully solved now).

The turning point in fighting for me came when I blacked out one night in early September and woke up in the parking lot of my friend's apartment in a shitload of pain. My right side hurt like hell, I could tell by looking that my right hand was fucked up, and I couldn't see out of my right eye. I stumbled my way into my friend's apartment and he took me to the hospital, where they told me I had 2 broken ribs, a broken wrist and finger on my right hand, and a huge gash from a ring running from under my right eye to my temple. While I was there I got a call from my friend who had been with me the night before who told me I needed to get out of there because the cops were looking for me. Apparently I had gotten into a mood over something a girl I knew said (no one ever figured out what it was, not even the girl, so most likely it was just a case of me being drunk and misinterpreting something), and started walking laps around the bar shouldering people out of my way, looking for a fight. Long story short, one dude finally took my bait and started loudly talking shit, which I responded to by tackling him, mounting him, and breaking my wrist on his face. A bouncer kicked me in the side to get me off of the dude, and another bouncer punched me in the face to temporarily subdue me (this was necessary, I had completely lost my shit, I was spitting and yelling at the kid choking on his teeth on the dance floor). They threw me out, and a couple of the dude's friends tried to jump me outside, but I picked up a brick and almost broke one of their jaws with it so I could run off. I then went to one of my FB's house and banged on the door (fucking up my hand even further) until her roommate had to come out and tell me to fuck off. No one has a damn clue what happened to me after that, but I ended up in that parking lot. The kid I attacked in the club lost four teeth and broke his nose, and the kid I hit with the brick was trying to press major league assault charges on me.

Eventually I was actually able to find these kids and hash it out (a lot of apologizing, a little bit of threatening, a good amount of money and some free drugs were involved) but after that I have been actively working to condition myself to tend towards aggression less, and I hashed out a couple rules for myself to help;

1. Don't fight unless you have to.
-Obvious, but it is pretty hard to stay calm and collected in the moment when some dude is hurling insults at you and threatening your manhood, but if it can at all be avoided, do it.
2. Defend a girl if you really want her or she is your friend or girlfriend, but if she isn't worth much to you, fuck it.
-I've had a couple situations where I have both defended a girl and abandoned one, and I like to draw the line between the two depending on how important the girl is to me in that moment.
3. Never hit a girl, no matter what she says or does to you.
-I can understand this, because I've been there, but I have seen way too many dudes take this bait and end up in a shitstorm of drunkenly chivalrous men to ever hit the girl. Being seen hitting an attractive girl in the face is one of the quickest ways to end up getting stomped out by every dude in the vicinity.
4. Situations you should be able to avoid/diffuse:
-When the girl you are with starts a fight.
-When the girl you are with gets in a fight and you have no reason to support her.
-When a drunk dude starts talking shit.
-When someone lightly pushes, shoves, or bumps into you.
-When someone spills your drink/you spill someone else's.
-When your friend is belligerent and starts starting fights.
-The cops are nearby in any situation (simply mention this and most situations should diffuse, nothing causes a general scatter of drunk people quite like a clear exclamation of "COPS!" (Sidenote: this can work even when there aren't any cops as a quick fight diffuser)).
5. Situations where you should stay and fight:
-The girl you are with is hit or threatened, and you have an obvious reason to defend her.
-A girl is hit in general by a man (you'll have plenty of help here).
-Your boy is getting his ass beat (this is a big one, whether he started the fight or not, it will not go over well if you abandon them in an actual physical conflict).
-Someone punches you (doesn't matter where, if a punch is thrown, someone has to be put down; avoiding and diffusing is good, but looking like a pussy isn't).
6. If you do end up in a fight; make as much noise as possible, fight smart, and end it quickly.
-Sometimes you can actually outshout an opponent, or act crazy enough that someone will not want to fuck with you. Failing that, just remember to lean into punches (you want to close as much space as possible between the windup and your face so your opponent doesn't connect at the peak of release), guard your face, keep your feet moving, and if you're fighting multiple people; never get backed into a corner. Always keep a quick exit path at your back. One trick I like to use is if I am in a situation I can't diffuse is I act much more drunk than I actually am, then when the first wild ass punch comes, I drop the act and end the fight as quickly as possible. Ending the fight quickly is crucial, because unless you are in the best shape of your life with the best training possible, when the adrenaline wears off you will be dirt tired, and you don't want this to happen when you have opponents still on their feet or when you need to run. As a general rule, the longer you are in a fight the less likely it is you will win it.
7. Never fight in front of cops.
-Simple. Unless someone is actively trying to kill you, do not enter a physical conflict in front of police. You will most likely get tackled, might get tazed, and will definitely go to jail (this applies especially if you are under 21, cops generally don't take well to young people making a problem in public, and drinking/possibly drug charges will inevitably follow as well).

Just wanted to get this out there,

Jay

 

[Chase]

Jay-

Really solid stuff here; great share.

Sometimes you can actually outshout an opponent, or act crazy enough that someone will not want to fuck with you. Failing that, just remember to lean into punches (you want to close as much space as possible between the windup and your face so your opponent doesn't connect at the peak of release), guard your face, keep your feet moving, and if you're fighting multiple people; never get backed into a corner. Always keep a quick exit path at your back. One trick I like to use is if I am in a situation I can't diffuse is I act much more drunk than I actually am, then when the first wild ass punch comes, I drop the act and end the fight as quickly as possible. Ending the fight quickly is crucial, because unless you are in the best shape of your life with the best training possible, when the adrenaline wears off you will be dirt tired, and you don't want this to happen when you have opponents still on their feet or when you need to run. As a general rule, the longer you are in a fight the less likely it is you will win it.

This paragraph in particular is a wonderful chunk of practical real world fighting experience.

I just took up Krav Maga again... I've had ~3 years of martial arts training, but all it takes is one class of Krav to make you realize your instincts are crap. I'm awful at predicting where a punch or kick is going to come from, and I was tired out pretty quick after a few of the hyperactive exercises they have you do specifically to tire you out.

It's easy to think you're a superman who's going to win every fight when you haven't been in one for a little while. Getting in a real one, or taking some classes where you're sparring with real opponents, will make you realize very quickly that unless you've had extensive training or a LOT of real world fighting experience, it's not as clean or easy as it looks on TV.

Chase

 

[57Things]

Just wanted to say, LOVE this post. I actually have a problem where people try to pick fights on me a lot... I actually have no idea why, but it happens quite often. I usually have friends that pull me away or defuse the situations before it devolves into fists, but I inevitably end up feeling like crap wondering if I should have fought or not.

This makes a lot of sense, and gives me a base to work off of. I actually do have a lot of martial arts experience, but I in my lucid moments I really do believe that fighting is incredibly stupid...

Thanks again.

-57

 

[trashKENNUT]

BUMP!

 

[ThrowDown]

Krav Maga is a very strong self defence and street combat art. Implementing striking from boxing, Muay Thai, kickboxing and even grappling from American wrestling, and Brazillian Jiu jitsu.

Personally if you find yourself in close quarters.. Commonly a bar or club, or even a bar washroom. My technique for you would be to strike hard and fast. Clinch the guy up behind the head, palm behind Palm grip behind his head, use elbows as a fulcrum and pull him close. From their you can toss and turn him around (strong control) while he would wail into you with his fists. Since he is already close, and pulled tightly, his punches will have no true power! If needed you can throw a couple knees to the body and groin area to muffle him up.

My recommendation would be taking up MMA. If you love self improvement? Martial arts is where you will develop, along with true discipline and grit.