Some techniques I have come across people use and how to defend against them?

[Searcher]

I recently watched a video and read in a PUA forum some techniques where the guys essentially gaslight and guilt trip a girl to get her reactive and qualify. Now the members say it works very well with girls though I have to try it out myself.
But I do feel like using these make me seem low value and accusatory.
(Also how would you defend against them if used on you? Just call out the manipulative behavior by name?)

The techniques are these.

1) If you accuse the person of being something that is directly the opposite of a characteristic or personality trait that she holds dear to her identity

- frame a party girl as an innocent girl

- frame a bitchy sassy girl as the only nice girl in the club. so comforting

- frame an artistic girl as being basic

This will hit hard and she will most likely start qualifying herself or explaining the situation.

2) If you accuse the person of something that she's insecure about. This one takes a lot of skills and calibration.

- framing a young girl as immature and childish

- framing a normal girl as a basic girl (no girl wants to be basic)

- A rich girl for being spoiled and over-entitled.

3) If you make the person feel bad through one of these ways

- just accuse her of something that is completely not true or exaggerated. This is one of the worse feelings and people often will get reactive and start explaining themselves

-painting yourself as a giver and using the rule of reciprocity to paint yourself as a victim and guilt trip them. This can be very effective but making an emotional impact is key.

The underlying principle is that you accuse her of something negative, which she then has to fight her way out of and start offering answers.

 

[Gaturro]

When used against you, treat them the same as shit tests, there’s plenty of material about that.

About the techniques, I think they may work with specific girls, but it’s too risky, you could trigger trauma or get in an ego battle.

Regarding technique no. 1, she may just think you don’t understand her, which is bad, unless you make it obvious that you’re kidding. But then she might not qualify, just laugh at the joke (which is not bad at all, you can use it as a hook).

As for 2 and 3 you would have to be very careful with your words to get a good response, otherwise you might just hurt her with no need.

I’m sure there are plenty of less risky ways to get her to qualify. Just ask questions or, even better, make affirmations/guesses about her. I wouldn’t overcomplicate it. Yes, I’m pretty sure that with very specific girls (low self-esteem or cluster B, for example) those techniques must be very effective. But I wouldn’t try them with every girl I approach...

 

[ulrich]

It’s the neg all over again.

It’s a good tool to have, it can help you salvage almost dead interactions in aggressive environments BUT (and I can’t stress this enough) it should not be used as your bread and butter.

It is not cool to go around making people feel insecure.
These kind of techniques come back and bite you in the ass sooner than you would expect.

I had a dating coach do stuff like that to me despite paying him 1.5K USD for his services.
It made me very weary of him and I rather loosed contact than risk him ripping me off.

 

[Tim Iron]

The first step is recognition. Personally, I would just describe what he/she is doing but I wouldn't mention the name of the manipulation technique... Doing that would usually be enough to get them to stop.

 

[Glow]

Defence could be
Thank you - its well spotted that im the innocent type,
you should know im also quite naive and hyper-hesitant to do anything thats not comfortable to me..

do a slight pause before you answer and do it with a on top of the world laidback vibe

same same for whatever , just take the knife and make it even more extreme with a rockstarish attitude

 

[West_Indian_Archie]

It's a shit test, which usually means that they're interested - even if they don't realize it.

Standard shit tests response

• Pause and let the words hang
• Ask them to repeat themselves
• Agree and Amplify
• Ignore
• Eye contact and ignore
• Misinterpret the words
• Misinterpret the intentions
• Accuse them of paying you special attention, because you're special - i.e. get close, "you love me" + smirk/smile of recognition
• Get Physical - quickly put a hand on their shoulder, "Look at you shiver" and then start laughing; Or you could step into their physical space.

There are a million ways to deal with shit tests.

In the West, Pick Up Rookies (and a lot of us vets) don't know how to deal with these situations, because they only have the safe work and school environments to socialize. Those environments allow women to cut loose, and they practice on each other - but there's nothing comparable for men.

Remember, pick up is an ADVANCED social skill, not a basic one. So you need basic social skills (I don't mean manners) in order to get GREAT at pick up.

You've been taught to be magnanimous, but have you been taught to be selfish? That your pleasure might come at the cost of someone else's pain? That you might need to "hurt" people to get what you want? (kicking people out of your friend group, not hanging with certain friends, firing employees)

They teach you to be a sheep, so they can remain wolves.

That's why guys have so many problems using shit tests or defending against them.

WIA