What to do when Girls don't Enter Your Frame During Date

[vicknick]

When on multiples dates and I have noticed sometimes girls will not agree or enter your frame during dates. For example, one girl says she was boring when the date being like this:

(Date started)

Me: You carry a laptop today. Seems like a busy day I guess?

Girl: Yeah. Actually, I am quite a boring person, so what do you want to ask me in this date?

Me: Oh you are a boring person. I don't really like boring girls. I guess we can't work out then, byeee (said in a teasing way, then acting like I am getting up and leaving)

Girl: Oh okay, byeee (refusing to enter frame)

How do you counteract when girl like this don't accept your tease or frame? If she were to laugh then she would have entered my frame, which is not the case. On the other hand, if I were to say "I am just kidding", I would have fell for her frame?



Another example:

Me: It's unfair girls have to act innocent when it comes to sex (setting sexual frame)

Girl: Well, I don't think about sex really. I have never done the deed with my ex. (refusing to enter frame)

Me: Hmm... don't tell me you are lesbian (said in a teasing way)

Girl: Haha, no I just didn't think about sex (refusing to enter frame)

Me: (find girl didn't accept sexual topics, switch back to normal topics again)

For this case, the girl refuse to enter the sexual frame you set. Will you just switch back to normal topics first, and then try again later?

 

[Wick]

Girl: Yeah. Actually, I am quite a boring person, so what do you want to ask me in this date?

Me: Oh you are a boring person. I don't really like boring girls. I guess we can't work out then, byeee (said in a teasing way, then acting like I am getting up and leaving)

Less a frame issue here and more the way you’re teasing.

Good teasing gets her qualifying herself in a fun way or playing along

tease example:

her: "Actually, I’m pretty boring."

you: "oh no, you’re not one of those girls that binge watches Netflix with a tub of chocolate ice cream are you? I only binge watch Netflix with strawberry."

her: “oh no I’m not that bad” or “you know I’m more into mint”

Lightens the tone, doesn’t take it seriously, doesn’t make her feel too bad if she actually does binge watch with a tub of ice crea

Absurd example:

her: "actually I’m pretty boring"

you: "cool, me too. Thinking about starting a club: watch paint dry with cats. I’ll give you a free membership, if you bring a cat."

/////

That being said I think there is a bigger problem going on. In the beginning of a date, you want to focus on rapport and comfort. The “we won’t work out” works best when there is already rapport going on, and you playfully break it. There was nothing to break here so it went flat, and probably created more distance between you two when you want to get closer. Not because you teased or walked away, but because she asked you "so what do you want to ask me in this date?" and you didn't give her a good reason. If you would have given her a good answer that is one way to build rapport.

 

[vicknick]

Not because you teased or walked away, but because she asked you "so what do you want to ask me in this date?" and you didn't give her a good reason. If you would have given her a good answer that is one way to build rapport.

From the way she said "what do you want to ask me", I felt she place herself higher than me, so isn't it better if I challenge her or tease her to lower her frame? For example, I can say "damn, you just make this date sounds like an interview, no wonder you are so boring"?

 

[ulrich]

Me: Oh you are a boring person. I don't really like boring girls. I guess we can't work out then, byeee (said in a teasing way, then acting like I am getting up and leaving)

Girl: Oh okay, byeee (refusing to enter frame)

Actually the girl is accepting your frame.
The thing is that the frame you set up is non-conductive for seduction.

You have to mind this and not shooting yourself in the foot.

Me: It's unfair girls have to act innocent when it comes to sex (setting sexual frame)

Girl: Well, I don't think about sex really. I have never done the deed with my ex. (refusing to enter frame)

Me: Hmm... don't tell me you are lesbian (said in a teasing way)

Girl: Haha, no I just didn't think about sex (refusing to enter frame)

In this case, she is rejecting your frames but that is because accepting them puts her in a negative light.

If she accepts the first one, then she is pretending to be innocent and actually is kind of hypocritical.
For the second one, if she accepts then she is a lesbian or a highly sexually active woman (which is lower value to her).

You could have framed her as being distracted, silly, childish or shy and you would have gotten an easier transition.

At the moment, your frames are too much too soon.

 

[DonGately]

Start off by treating them like your little sister to get to the right frame [teasing, non-sexual to begin] and then adjust from there.

 

[Will_V]

You made it very easy to fail the test by pretending to walk off, so she literally has to do nothing to make you fail (go into reverse).

Tease the shit out of her, play around and say whatever you want. Either she'll like you or she won't. Look at her as if you're fucking her and she's being rebellious, and you're putting her in her place and having fun. Soon you'll get a clear answer.

 

[vicknick]

Tease the shit out of her, play around and say whatever you want. Either she'll like you or she won't. Look at her as if you're fucking her and she's being rebellious, and you're putting her in her place and having fun. Soon you'll get a clear answer.

What would you say if she say "I am a boring person. So what do you want to ask me today?" at the beginning of the date.

Also, when I tried to escalate physically, she backed off, while saying she didn't like guys touching her, even when on a date, because she is uncomfortable when guys are near her. After this, I never escalate physically again with her. What will you do in this situation?

 

[Will_V]

What would you say if she say "I am a boring person. So what do you want to ask me today?" at the beginning of the date.

I would laugh and say "did you come for an interview?" and make fun of her until she softened up. If she can't handle the humor and leaves, at least I had fun, and I'd probably even feel cheerful enough to get another number on the way home.

Also, when I tried to escalate physically, she backed off, while saying she didn't like guys touching her, even when on a date, because she is uncomfortable when guys are near her. After this, I never escalate physically again with her. What will you do in this situation?

I would show mild disapproval, and ask her if she ever gets laid that way. If she says she isn't getting laid, I'd tell her she must be very horny by now and start sexualizing.

You're too afraid of losing her. You gotta realize that if she's being so antagonistic, your frame with her is zero anyway. Either you're going to pull her in by being unrelenting, or you'll never get those panties off anyway.

 

[Chase]

Lots of good replies from guys here, @vicknick.

Just wanted to point out a few other nuances with your teasing:

Me: You carry a laptop today. Seems like a busy day I guess?

Girl: Yeah. Actually, I am quite a boring person, so what do you want to ask me in this date?

Me: Oh you are a boring person. I don't really like boring girls. I guess we can't work out then, byeee (said in a teasing way, then acting like I am getting up and leaving)

Girl: Oh okay, byeee (refusing to enter frame)

When she disqualifies herself, she is being non-compliant. If you then respond by accepting her frame and rejecting her, there's just not anywhere to go. e.g.:

HER: I'm boring (disqualifying / i.e., not trying to qualify herself to you or impress you)​

​

YOU: Okay, you're boring. Well I don't like boring girls. Bye. (accepting her frame / nowhere for you to go now)​

​

HER: Okay then. Bye. (you accepted her frame. What's she supposed to do, drop the frame herself?)​

You're not really giving her anything to work with here at all.

What you really want is to break her out of this thing where she isn't qualifying herself. Fortunately for you, by disqualifying herself she gives you the perfect setup to double-bind her into qualifying herself. Here's the go-to double bind every time a girl disqualifies herself: "Prove it!"

Like so:

HER: I'm boring (disqualifying / i.e., not trying to qualify herself to you or impress you)​

​

YOU: Bullshit, no one's really THAT boring! Tell me the two most boring things you did today. (telling her to prove it)​

She now must either prove to you she's boring... which is her complying with you while disqualifying herself.

There's high-value disqualification, where you disqualify yourself in some vague way -- but you don't want to be pressed to actually flesh that out. You're just doing a little posturing that actually makes you sound mock-humble. Think the news reporter interviewing the superhero and the superhero saying, "Oh, no, I'm really just an ordinary guy." Everybody knows he's not.

Then there's low-value disqualification, where you disqualify yourself then list out a bunch of things proving that you actually are some low value thing. This would be the superhero talking about how he has been having tooth pain because he hasn't been brushing his teeth and how he is really upset because this girl he likes isn't texting him back. Now he just sounds like a loser.

She only has two real options:

1. She can walk it back ("I was just kidding. I'm not actually THAT boring"), in which case she's qualifying to you
   
   
2. She can make light of it ("Oh, WELL! I spent an hour waiting for my turn at the bank today, reading blah blah book. Think that book is interesting? It's not... it's really boring. But I read it anyway. Then I blah blah..."), in which case she is complying with your request

In either case you win.

(there are still some options for her if she's really disinterested or really frame-battling you. But you won't see these much except with girls who are very disinterested right after you've approached them... probably won't see it on dates much at all)

Me: It's unfair girls have to act innocent when it comes to sex (setting sexual frame)

Girl: Well, I don't think about sex really. I have never done the deed with my ex. (refusing to enter frame)

Me: Hmm... don't tell me you are lesbian (said in a teasing way)

Girl: Haha, no I just didn't think about sex (refusing to enter frame)

Not sure where you were going with the lesbian frame. Doesn't seem like it'd be helpful.

Instead, just do "Prove it":

HER: I don't think about sex really. I have never done the deed with my ex.​

​

YOU: No way; you're fucking kidding me. So what are you thinking about when he's dry-humping your leg? He's got his hard-on rubbing on you and you're like, "Man, I could really go for a ham and cheese right about now"?​

​

HER: lol no, actually I blah blah​

So again, you are asking her to "prove it" by telling you what she is thinking about in sexual situations... while sexualizing the whole conversation, talking about her ex dry-humping her leg, having a hard-on, etc. (also valuable intel to find out how hard this guy actually tried to get laid... a lot of times with girls like this you will find out the guy didn't really try hard at all / had no idea what he was doing)

It doesn't really even matter what her answer is; you just want to set the frame that you find it hard to believe she doesn't think about sex (because you sure do), while simultaneously making her think about sex (by painting these clear, vivid mental pictures for her in her mind).

Chase