FU 3 dates, no close, FML, is 2024 plagued with bad luck?

[Swati]

This is embarrassing, and I was weirded out by this frame. With the amount of girls this year I've have been fucking up with is just depressing lol

what happened was I went out on 3 dates with the same girl, and I was unable to close. 2nd date, I was escalating sexually and could have fingered the pussy but I didn't want to break the tension, and use it to pull back to my hotel, didn't work. On 3rd date it went downhill, her being in a bad state of mind, just finishing up her exams, and sleep-deprived

she's a conservative girl, having had a 7-year LTR bf and 22. I wanted to try out a conservative girl like this because I would see what traditional dating is actually like...

Is it social frame or missing windows it may all be true

On 1st date we held hands and tried to seed a movie at my place didn't happen, so she left, I called her taxi back to her place.

2nd the date she dressed sexy, we went to this hookah lounge, and at some point, I was making dirty jokes, about how parents hide to have sex, and she said "Kids ask the most random questions......."

I felt like I missed a window, and walked too long outside. Anyway, last-ditch when she said she wanted to go home I tried to pull, but she wouldn't come. thinking I could see her again

On 3rd date when I requested we go sit in the sun she declined and sat me back down, and from this, I was irritated a lot but this situation was just irritating, we were walking in the part right next to my hotel, and I tried to pull up to my different hotel again! she wouldn't come "Oh bad vibes

Frame battle/grabbing

2 times happened when we were drinking our coffee I told her to let's go to the park and she said "No no no I need to rest a bit" and I sat back down, horrible negative momentum

2nd time when I told her to let's go in the sun, she told me it wasn't going to work, she wanted to leave in a relaxed way
"you could go before we've been on 3 dates, what made you all of a sudden make this decision?"

'just wanted to know what the situation was, then she stayed because I uncovered more about my knowledge about handling future kids, etc.
where mid-conversation she abruptly said, "This is not working out, I'm going to go..."

my response: "Well you're free to, just curious what made you feel that way"

she felt like I was indifferent, how I didn't ask her enough questions, I didn't care about her, forgetting things about her, etc. After a bit of conversation, I shared my views on the outlook in life, etc, she didn't leave she invited me to go eat with her, and she paid since I've been paying for everything. After eating she departed from me. I don't think I'll see her again, she was a lovely girl, just probably me having been through too many pussies makes me indifferent or I fucked up somewhere.

I think that girls punish guys who are providers if they end up not being able to become lovers when given a chance.

I don't understand their social frame completely. near the end, she offered to buy me food, we ate, sat down holding hands talking about random stuff, some political stuff, how government policies are implied, etc. Looked at her, she's a bit too much wanting a relationship approach to all her dating. As if nothing happened. I walked her to the metro, I hugged her goodbye.

what do you think?

 

[Gorili]

she felt like I was indifferent, how I didn't ask her enough questions, I didn't care about her, forgetting things about her, etc.

I think this pretty much summarizes how she viewed you and why it didn't work out. Did you deep dive her? Did you open up to her? Can you share more of the conversations on the 1st and 2nd dates and what you guys talked about? Cuz from what you wrote, from your perspective, it seemed like it was always about pulling, but she wasn't ready for that yet.

The negative compliance to your requests (movie, sun, park, etc.) was a symptom of her feeling like you guys didn't really connect and weren't on the same page. There wasn't enough compliance for you guys to escalate further at that point. She probably felt like there wasn't enough similarity, and you guys needed to get to know each other better.

what happened was I went out on 3 dates with the same girl, and I was unable to close. 2nd date, I was escalating sexually and could have fingered the pussy but I didn't want to break the tension, and use it to pull back to my hotel, didn't work. On 3rd date it went downhill, her being in a bad state of mind, just finishing up her exams, and sleep-deprived

She went on 3 dates with you, so she was attracted at least initially and giving you chances. Each date was like a reset from before to see if you could pull the right moves and establish that you guys shared similar views.

I don't understand their social frame completely. near the end, she offered to buy me food, we ate, sat down holding hands talking about random stuff, some political stuff, how government policies are implied, etc.

I don't know what the technical term is for this, but this has happened to me before, too. The way I think about it is it's a consolation that she offers to thank you for your time and end things on a positive note, but she knows that this won't be going anywhere.

 

[Swati]

I think this pretty much summarizes how she viewed you and why it didn't work out. Did you deep dive her? Did you open up to her? Can you share more of the conversations on the 1st and 2nd dates and what you guys talked about? Cuz from what you wrote, from your perspective, it seemed like it was always about pulling, but she wasn't ready for that yet.

At some point, I did deep dive into her, or she shared things on topics, I showed her recent movies I've watched and I half listened. We talked about what each other's hobbies are, and why she was learning Italian, I spoke a little bit of Spanish, and we spoke to each see how much mutual intelligibility, kind of DHV.

I don't know what the technical term is for this, but this has happened to me before, too. The way I think about it is it's a consolation that she offers to thank you for your time and end things on a positive note, but she knows that this won't be going anywhere.

On our way to the canteen, "I" stop asked if she wanted to leave and she reply "that's your decision", at this point I made a problem out of the her "issue" wanting to leave and shit. Of course I followed because I was starving, lmao. But yeah I was 50% going to leave the situation if they bring up anymore shit.

i think girls in general have a radar and sense that I don't put up with alot of shit, which could lead them to auto reject because I feel like THEY think, if the guy doesn't fight with me and be feminine to some extend I can't get him emotional so that's why I'm causing a scene. So it's easy for them to reject compared to later on when I've dicked her down and she's attached emotionally.


I'm curious what Chase thinks about this too, it's has happened with my LTRs way too much in the last 12 month I think
@Chase

 

[Chase]

@Swati,

On the girl from the report in particular, at least from reading the report she sounds like a female autist. Every one of these chicks I have gone on dates with came from online (well, one was from a matchmaking service I tried, just for the sake of trying everything. The female autist was the ONLY hot chick I got matched with… the rest were just tragic, lol).

Typical tells for these girls:

• Has a very rigid belief system, typically conservative, in a "I follow all the rules very closely and think it's not very good if other people do not" sort of way. One I went out with was 24 years old and told me immediately on the first date she was looking for a man to get married to and start a family with ASAP. I think my response was something like "Oh." She didn't even ask me what I was looking for. #femaleautists
  
  
• They give you this sort of checked-out eye contact where you can feel they are seeing you but not really seeing you? Like they are not deeply studying your face for reactions... probably because as autists they cannot read those subtle nonverbal cues. Personally I find it slightly unsettling.
  
  
• Will happily (but rather nonchalantly) tell you everything she is looking for in a man/relationship when prompted, and it is a list so long as to basically be like reading one of those online "what your standards should be" lists in some unmarried mid-30s woman's blog post, except she is actually saying it in real life. Then on top of that she will typically not be trying to relate it to you in any way, whether to talk about how you match her qualifications or do not. She is just listing things out and it has nothing to do with you.
  
  
• These chicks are typically more or less completely humorless. Like you try to crack jokes and they might mirror your smile back a bit as part of the masking they are doing, but not otherwise seem to get it, or else it is like it just does not register and they just treat it like a normal conversation topic. Or they may ask if you are serious, and if you say it was a joke, they just go, "Oh" and continue on with whatever they were saying before.
  
  
• A lot of the date will feel like it has nothing to do with you. Like she is just talking to talk. It will feel like everything you are trying to do to get a connection going bounces off her. Instead it is like your talking triggers thoughts in her that lead to her talking and branching off, but not really as an attempt to connect with you like a normal chick would, but instead just as a kind of "Oh, that makes me think of XYZ" and then off she goes.
  
  
• When they talk about "you" it is in a sort of detached evaluative way, as if they are checking to see whether you tick all their boxes or whether you come close enough and they might be willing to compromise on some of them for you. It's more like a computer evaluating reproductive options than a woman who is getting all hot and bothered by some sexy guy.
  
  
• They tend to have these longer relationships, but it is not because they are super romantic or loyal or anything... it is just because they view the man as a sort of appendage who is fulfilling his role so there is no need to rock the boat. Come to think of it I am not sure how autistic chicks' relationships break down... I would be very curious about that now... I know one guy in a relationship with one but they are married with a kid... right now their marriage is good. It seems like when they have problems it is more that she retreats into her shell and he just starts feeling overwhelmed and abandoned. I wonder if autistic chicks' relationships usually end with the guy no longer being able to take it, or else maybe the autistic chick makes a calculation at some point like "This guy is not serious enough" then just decides to leave?
  
  
• Also, they may say things that make it seem like they are completely disinterested in you. And you will be like, "All right. Well, I am not really feeling this either. Guess this is pretty cut and dry then." Then they will make some comment that makes it sound like they think they are going to see you again next time. And you will just be like, "WTF?"

Does this sound like your chick at all?

I would also say that if she is an Asian chick from Asia, some of those chicks can be like "Autistic Lite" without being full-on autists. They just spent so much of their first 21-23 years doing nothing but studying that they are just total social retards.

Anyway, for the full on proper autist chicks, one date is enough for me to be outta there, so I can't give too much advice on closing those ones. The rigidity, the weird eye contact stuff, the feeling like I am not even really "there" as a person to this chick... you just feel like you somehow zapped onto the wrong planet.

But my read with these chicks is that probably if you a.) tick all their boxes or most of them, then you would just need to b.) keep pursuing them until you get the hookup. Although I don't know how long that would take.

Maybe that was not your chick and her deal was something else. But that was my first impression on reading through your report...

At some point, I did deep dive into her, or she shared things on topics, I showed her recent movies I've watched and I half listened. We talked about what each other's hobbies are, and why she was learning Italian, I spoke a little bit of Spanish, and we spoke to each see how much mutual intelligibility, kind of DHV.

Chicks learning a language you are not a native speaker of = chicks with a fetish/fantasy for a guy of a nationality you are not a member of.

Just personally my preferred tactic here is to be the "Poor Man's [Whatever]." e.g., Poor Man's Italian... speak to her in a cheesy Italian accent, act like you are going to give her a boat tour through Venice, talk about that Italian recipe you know how to cook really well, tell her about your trip to Amalfi or Portofino or Milan, tell her about your distant Italian step-uncle and his wacky Sicilian stories, etc. Do your best to embody her fantasy even if it is just the poor man's version.

i think girls in general have a radar and sense that I don't put up with alot of shit, which could lead them to auto reject because I feel like THEY think, if the guy doesn't fight with me and be feminine to some extend I can't get him emotional so that's why I'm causing a scene. So it's easy for them to reject compared to later on when I've dicked her down and she's attached emotionally.


I'm curious what Chase thinks about this too, it's has happened with my LTRs way too much in the last 12 month I think
@Chase

Yeah, I think to an extent there are girls who look for the chill bad boy and there are girls who look for the passionate rake. And if you are too cool for school and they feel like they cannot get to you they will auto-reject.

It was a big upgrade to my game adding a ton of warmth in. That was how I learned how to get the girls who usually prefer passionate guys. Before that I could really only get the girls who like chill guys. e.g., girls who will chase you without prompting, talk about how you are so cool, how nothing fazes you, girls talking about your "Zen", etc. But the chicks who like passionate guys, or need a passionate guy, I used to have a kind of mutual iciness between. I was chill and they were chiller and nobody was crossing that divide, lol.

Tactics Tuesdays: How to Be a Warm Person

Commenting on the post on building social status, a reader asks the following about how to be a warm person: “Hi Chase, great site, great article. Could you discuss more about warmth? You discuss it quite often, but you could dive into this topic more in-depth? It's a powerful tool to use in all...

www.girlschase.com

So you could be having attainability problems there.

In LTRs you need a certain degree of openness to growth and a certain amount of progression, or else the girl is simply going to say to herself at some point, "This isn't going anywhere," and start looking for the exit.

If you want to post a Relationship Report on the Relationships Board or just a summary of the behavior you've been seeing and what you think might be triggering it I'd be happy to take a look.

Anyway, sorry 2024's been an unlucky year for you, brother.

You know how luck goes. Sometimes it's down, sometimes it's up.

Won't stay 'down' forever...!

Chase

 

[isildur1]

think you're beating yourself up too much about this - she saw you three times she clearly likes you - the fact that she came out of 7 year LTR maybe that's still playing on her mind - seven years is a long time to be committed to someone .

With highly religious/conservative women you're in a spot that's tough for everyone - i dated one in Latvia , London and Hong Kong - all three lead to nothing they would be very affectionate over text and in meeting but once escalation happens they'd back off out of fear . Then after the date they'd text me saying they missed me and wish to see me again even though i knew sex was off the table because of their religious upbringing or the fact they just really genuinely seemed conservative and wouldnt go further than a hand hold - i guess for some people sex is serious and moving on from a 7 year relationship is a huge deal for someone basically since 15 this person has only dated one guy it might be a very confusing time for her- You shouldn't be upset with yourself over a factors in the woman's life that you can't control.

Still 3 dates shows she liked you a lot and you're practically the second person she's ever dated if she just came out of 7 year relationship from the age of 15 but basic variance out of every 100 women you date there are always going to be some conservative /religious or socially frigid ones - it's basic probability especially after a break up i found they either are whoring on the rebound or are cautious about how life would be with a different man for the first time ever

 

[Swati]

think you're beating yourself up too much about this - she saw you three times she clearly likes you - the fact that she came out of 7 year LTR maybe that's still playing on her mind - seven years is a long time to be committed to someone .

With highly religious/conservative women you're in a spot that's tough for everyone - i dated one in Latvia , London and Hong Kong - all three lead to nothing they would be very affectionate over text and in meeting but once escalation happens they'd back off out of fear . Then after the date they'd text me saying they missed me and wish to see me again even though i knew sex was off the table because of their religious upbringing or the fact they just really genuinely seemed conservative and wouldnt go further than a hand hold - i guess for some people sex is serious and moving on from a 7 year relationship is a huge deal for someone basically since 15 this person has only dated one guy it might be a very confusing time for her- You shouldn't be upset with yourself over a factors in the woman's life that you can't control.

Still 3 dates shows she liked you a lot and you're practically the second person she's ever dated if she just came out of 7 year relationship from the age of 15 but basic variance out of every 100 women you date there are always going to be some conservative /religious or socially frigid ones - it's basic probability especially after a break up i found they either are whoring on the rebound or are cautious about how life would be with a different man for the first time ever

Usually, the girls that hold back sex, have something weird going on

I'm forgetting she told me

"they (you) will lose interest after sex"

this line itself tells me she wants to bargain as if she knows her personality is not enough to keep me around long-term

I read a post about the leveling with dating,

generally, if people have to think about whether to spend time with you or you with them, the debate is usually the one with a higher value

 

[Skills]

I think you used the wrong strategy..... How long has it been since the last relationship?

1.- date you held hands and she left on a taxi.... - that was a waste of date

2.- you went on a hook at lounge and did "dirty jokes"= nothing waste of date

3.- date you were irritated and try to pull = waste of date

it seems she lacked comfort... It seems you were thinking you were progressing and reaching goal while going on subpar low strategy dates were the girl did like you but was not feeling the strategy...

I don't know about this female autist angle..... tbh... Most gen z women are not only autist but someone retarded.... it comes with the territory...

I hope instead of blaming the "girl" you think back on how you could have done better strategy angle wise, for me it screamed lack of comfort and wasted dates aka super low quality dates, i have never run my dates like that....

 

[Swati]

I think you used the wrong strategy..... How long has it been since the last relationship?

1.- date you held hands and she left on a taxi.... - that was a waste of date

2.- you went on a hook at lounge and did "dirty jokes"= nothing waste of date

3.- date you were irritated and try to pull = waste of date

it seems she lacked comfort... It seems you were thinking you were progressing and reaching goal while going on subpar low strategy dates were the girl did like you but was not feeling the strategy...

I don't know about this female autist angle..... tbh... Most gen z women are not only autist but someone retarded.... it comes with the territory...

I hope instead of blaming the "girl" you think back on how you could have done better strategy angle wise, for me it screamed lack of comfort and wasted dates aka super low quality dates, i have never run my dates like that....

no shit. if you went on a date and didn't close, of course I could say it's a waste of date or subpar. I could say that to your FUs if you post them.

Idk, what you mean by comfort because i did a lot of comfort already from the venue bounces, verbal ( gambits, with how she had ejected from a date 20minutes in), and etc. what you think we did this whole time sat at a bus stations with hobos asking for money? It's already a bit obvious this girl from a different social frame from yours. I didn't bother to include the entire dialogues as it would be too long.

are you thinking in insular way or I'm missing something here?

 

[Swati]

I think this pretty much summarizes how she viewed you and why it didn't work out. Did you deep dive her? Did you open up to her? Can you share more of the conversations on the 1st and 2nd dates and what you guys talked about? Cuz from what you wrote, from your perspective, it seemed like it was always about pulling, but she wasn't ready for that yet.

1st date she said something like

“it seems like you don't want to be here", yeah i was tired it might have effected the date. Overall she had a strict rule about not going back to guys first date bla blah blah, even tho the proposal to go back to mine might of spook her a bit.

2nd date I believe to have missed a escalation window with her, which is probably the biggest "fail" turning point of where she was going to slot me.

from my perspective 1st date to see if I'm normal, 2nd date giving him the opportunity to be a lover, 3rd date she deemed me to be too unstable and not very interested provider, which resulted in the frame grab/war leading to auto rejection

 

[Skills]

no shit. if you went on a date and didn't close, of course I could say it's a waste of date or subpar. I could say that to your FUs if you post them.

Idk, what you mean by comfort because i did a lot of comfort already from the venue bounces, verbal ( gambits, with how she had ejected from a date 20minutes in), and etc. what you think we did this whole time sat at a bus stations with hobos asking for money? It's already a bit obvious this girl from a different social frame from yours. I didn't bother to include the entire dialogues as it would be too long.

are you thinking in insular way or I'm missing something here?

Swatti, if you go on a date and you didn't fuck is not necessarily a fuck up... I specially said how you ran the dates, was not ideal was not help you towards accomplishing the goal ...i said your strategy being used with that girl and running the date based on the information provided.... for example if you ran proper dates with right structure and you didn't get laid, yes that is more on the girl... But the way you ran the dates was no optimal, even if you think you address comfort she is telling you after you asked was her issue that she lacked comfort... I been with conservative women of all ages i called them time machine girls.. and guess what? They are not different from other seductions just that when they fall they did fall way harder... A time machine girl is a girl that due to her being in an ltr for 7 years and being 22 she was out of the dating loop and game for that long and she has a dating perspective of an equivalent 12 year old girl...she is very inexperience in dating and dating dynamics.. you did not calibrate properly to the girl and the situation and how you ran the dates didn't help... Yes may be seen autistic and retarded but they are way more goolable, inexperienced, and more of living in fantasy... Is not autism per se just long time out of market and dating and hook up dynamics
..

 

[Swati]

Swatti, if you go on a date and you didn't fuck is not necessarily a fuck up... I specially said how you ran the dates, was not ideal was not help you towards accomplishing the goal ...i said your strategy being used with that girl and running the date based on the information provided.... for example if you ran proper dates with right structure and you didn't get laid, yes that is more on the girl... But the way you ran the dates was no optimal, even if you think you address comfort she is telling you after you asked was her issue that she lacked comfort... I been with conservative women of all ages i called them time machine girls.. and guess what? They are not different from other seductions just that when they fall they did fall way harder... A time machine girl is a girl that due to her being in an ltr for 7 years and being 22 she was out of the dating loop and game for that long and she has a dating perspective of an equivalent 12 year old girl...she is very inexperience in dating and dating dynamics.. you did not calibrate properly to the girl and the situation and how you ran the dates didn't help... Yes may be seen autistic and retarded but they are way more goolable, inexperienced, and more of living in fantasy... Is not autism per se just long time out of market and dating and hook up dynamics
..

you just shit stirring then actually having anything to say useful

1.- date you held hands and she left on a taxi.... - that was a waste of date

2.- you went on a hook at lounge and did "dirty jokes"= nothing waste of date

3.- date you were irritated and try to pull = waste of date

1-3, are you stating it was a waste of date? how?

1st was comfort in establishing a date, you acting like Don Juan saying I wasted time with her, etc. She wasn't going to get pulled, I understand this by her behaviors, but I tired

2nd the date, I had a lot of sexual tension on the date with her and semi-disqualified myself as too stable of a guy, for attraction reasons.

"I love kids, I'm looking to have like 10 of them"

She replies

"it doesn't seem like it is comfortable for you to be around taking care of them in the long run, etc... I could have like 2 and am open to adopting more"

"no that's not true, I would take care of them if they were my own. But I wouldn't adopt them since they aren't mine"

(we were on the same page with this)

A lot more conversation going on about how

Yes, I missed the window by not pulling fast enough, and let the attraction expire walking outside too long, based on my intuition was 70% I could pull

When I would like to show you a view at my place

SHE asked

"where is your hotel?"

Before we were making out, not too much at the lounge, at a bench, I should of went and fingered the pussy too, since there wasn't any LMR when I moved my hand near there.

unfortunately we walked in the wrong direction for way too fucking long, nearly 2 hours AFTER we came out of the hookah place, which I overstayed at as well. This missed the escalation window, she had too much to debate put the breaks so I fucked it up.

3rd, it took like 10 days to meet again, too much time in limbo. she was on her period, meeting with her friend, being in a bad state after getting up early for an exam. If I didn't escalate I probably would of been able to close her on the 4th.

 

[Skills]

you just shit stirring then actually having anything to say useful


1-3, are you stating it was a waste of date? how?

1st was comfort in establishing a date, you acting like Don Juan saying I wasted time with her, etc. She wasn't going to get pulled, I understand this by her behaviors, but I tired

2nd the date, I had a lot of sexual tension on the date with her and semi-disqualified myself as too stable of a guy, for attraction reasons.

"I love kids, I'm looking to have like 10 of them"

She replies

"it doesn't seem like it is comfortable for you to be around taking care of them in the long run, etc... I could have like 2 and am open to adopting more"

"no that's not true, I would take care of them if they were my own. But I wouldn't adopt them since they aren't mine"

(we were on the same page with this)

A lot more conversation going on about how

Yes, I missed the window by not pulling fast enough, and let the attraction expire walking outside too long, based on my intuition was 70% I could pull

When I would like to show you a view at my place

SHE asked

"where is your hotel?"

Before we were making out, not too much at the lounge, at a bench, I should of went and fingered the pussy too, since there wasn't any LMR when I moved my hand near there.

unfortunately we walked in the wrong direction for way too fucking long, nearly 2 hours AFTER we came out of the hookah place, which I overstayed at as well. This missed the escalation window, she had too much to debate put the breaks so I fucked it up.

3rd, it took like 10 days to meet again, too much time in limbo. she was on her period, meeting with her friend, being in a bad state after getting up early for an exam. If I didn't escalate I probably would of been able to close her on the 4th.

You did not write this on the report... Is obvious what happened which is correct you missed the window probably due to getting lost for 2 hours ouch,and by the 3rd date momentum was lost.... But was does this have to do with the girl punishing providers and being autistic.... My point is not to make knee jerk reactions based on flawed diagnosis, chances of 3rd date lays for any type of girls is total shit anyway...

 

[Swati]

But was does this have to do with the girl punishing providers and being autistic

of the missed escalation window, she was disappointed and past ovulation, which got her into a her normal autistic frame of mind again, if you don't know what an NPC is, check it up

 

[StrayDog]

Okay @Swati , I am going to tell you the #1 thing what went wrong here. I know this because I have made similar mistakes in similar scenarios, and some of the guys here schooled me up on this. Looking back I could see many times where I made this mistake in the past, or actually handled it well and was successful. I just wasn't clear on what i was doing wrong/right at the time. Also, recently had success with a woman, same scenario, by being very intentional about how I approached the situation.

Before I get to it though let's just be clear about some other obvious things you have mentioned

-You set bad frames by hand holding, as well as talking future relationship goals and all that. Slots you into the boyfriend zone. Then when you try to make more lover moves, it comes of as incongruent. Makes her feel like you are being disingenuous with how you are presenting yourself.

-You keep trying to make moves when she is not ready. Comes across like having an agenda and not being present with where she is at. Hence her saying "it feels like you don't actually care about me" (or whatever she said around those lines). While you might be "deep diving" a bit, you are not getting to the core of her emotional state, and giving her an opportunity to truly let her hair down, relax, and trust the interaction.

So with those mistakes being addressed I will now tell you the #1 thing that would have helped move things forward between the two of you.

GET HER TO OPEN UP ABOUT HER HEARTBREAK

She just got out of a seven year relationship. She is most likely wrestling with all of that inside while she is trying to connect with you. She is trying to conceive of who even she is now that she is done with that relationship, and what does it mean to relate to men now, and be intimate with them. The two of you are kind of addressing it a little, on the surface layer. But that surface layer only represents a small snap shot of the picture. The things that feel safe to talk about. The surface layer is going to entail a lot of her basic social framework she is operating from. "So, this is the type of guy I am looking for, this is what I think about long term relationships" (okay she didn't say this exactly but you get the point).

Under the surface however there is a deeper well of emotions that don't feel like they have room to express themselves in the interaction the two of you are having. She doesn't know that it is even a possibility to express those things with you. So she is making all of these internal evaluations on her own, instead of you offering those emotions space to express themselves and then using that space where the two of you can navigate what it all means for intimacy TOGETHER.

Whenever you are on a date with a woman who is going through a big break up, you absolutely must lean into the subject when the opportunity presents itself. I am sure she threw out subtle hints every now and then. You have to create the opportunity for her to express all of those things that are welling up inside her.

When she shares those things you have to approach her with genuine care, and interest in the nuances of her emotional being.

Once she shares all of the dashed hopes, the un met desires, the things that drew her to him in the first place, and the things that made her leave. And once she sees that you have truly heard/ seen her. There will now be more room in the interaction for the two of you. Room to explore genuine chemistry. This in when you can speak to her in a way that appeals to her erotic sensibilities. You can engage her vulnerabilities with insight, and tenderness, and stoke her lust and abandon in a way that allows her to let go. She will have basically given you a template for how she wants to be seduced, in light of her recent foibles with intimacy.

If you fail to do this, she will always have her walls up and find every reason why she shouldn't give herself to the moment. Giver her self to you.

The best time to do this is usually in the second phase of your date, when the a proper moment presents it self. You don't want to pry, but just breach the subject a bit and let it naturally unfold. Fractionate if you have to, but be sure to circle back again and again until she feels comfortable sharing. She might even say things like "are you sure you want to talk about this?" or "I don't want to be a downer". Assure her it is okay, and that you are interested, and enjoy talking about stuff like this because it's part of who we are.


Do not attempt a pull until this has been properly addressed. If you have to move the date to a secondary chill, public location, and that makes sense for the flow you two are in, go for it. But do not pull. Do not escalate.

Once you two have addressed it, she is speaking frames that are more conducive to the seduction. Ramp up the playfulness again, so things are lighter. Then you can pull/ escalate.

Now, sometimes she wont want to pull/ escalate even after you two have explored that terrain together. That is fine. End the date on a strong note. She will most likely be game for the second date. Second date will be way smoother and easier to pull, pretty much she is expecting it to go there.

If you know a woman has just been through a major breakup/heartache. Resolve yourself to lean into it. Go into the date knowing you must address it.

Can you see now all the signs she was giving you?