FR A volume high score

[SparklingWadah]

Goal​

Following from my last field report I am working on better eye contact and voice when in the field https://www.skilledseducer.com/threads/getting-serious.29495/#post-181163

1. Strong eye contact - she should look down at least once
2. Deeper and more resonant voice, originating from the chest
3. End your sentences with a downward tonality

Outing​

Went to a popular shopping street next to the mall today to do daygame

Warmup​

Started by asking a few different girls for directions to the bathroom. I'm not a fan of how contrived it feels, and I would like to have more genuine openers in my warmup in the future.

Approach 1​

Saw a girl walk perpendicular to me on the street. She seemed to see me but turned her head to look forward quickly and kept her hands to her sides. I followed her a short distance down the block and approached. Noticed she seemed on guard, kept walking, and not very open. Felt like a cold reception and I pivoted to just asking her directions.

Takeaway: I got another datapoint on what is NOT an approach invitation

Approach 2​

Saw a set of two girls hanging out and sitting together. Per my last field report I believed I was ready to approach two girls at once. I felt nervous but pretended to stop and suddenly notice them. Then I moved my feet forward. I usually get intimidated and abort the approach at the last second, especially because there was a bystander sitting next to them, but to my surprise I actually ended up in front of them and opening. I used the opener from Meet Girls Everywhere: "Hi, I just saw you and your friend over here, and I thought your friend was really beautiful. Do you mind if I borrow her for a minute?"

I approached the friend, not the girl I was interested in. I made more eye contact with the friend than the girl I wanted to approach. I could feel a slight quaver to my voice because I was nervous. The friend said "Actually, I'm hanging out with her. And she has a boyfriend." The other girl seemed to agree. So I backed off and bid them farewell.

Takeaway: I can approach two girls at once. I should use a more even spread of eye contact between the two girls.

Approach 3​

I saw a girl sitting alone at a table outside the mall, however all the tables around her were packed with possible spectators. I got nervous and procrastinated a bit, going inside a nearby store and scoping out the angles. I realized I was avoiding the problem and decided I needed to go approach, so I went out and maneuvered into a small open space next to her. I was nervous and my voice was a bit stiff. When I introduced myself, asked her name and held out my hand, she declined to take it or introduce herself so I moved on.

Takeaway: Be aware when I am procrastinating and take immediate action.

Approach 4​

Saw a cute girl in a pink outfit who seemed to see me while walking at an angle towards me in the mall. She looked for a second then turned her head back forward and kept walking. I caught up and approached, and she accepted the compliment, but kept walking.

Takeaway: I got another datapoint on what is NOT an approach invitation.

Approach 5​

Was shopping inside a store in the mall when I saw a cute girl just outside. She is moving slowly like she doesn't have anything to do, so I approach her. I thought she was on her phone and asked her if she was (may have seemed insecure?). She wasn't doing anything, but created some distance from me and seemed a bit closed off. There was an awkward silence and she excused herself. By this point I was running low on energy and was forgetting all my goals for the day. I also gave a weak opener without good energy.

Takeaway: Practice delivering a good opener until you can do it while tired

Approach 6​

Saw a pretty girl in the food court by herself with several shopping bags in the seat next to her. She had an interesting drink on the table. I didn't know if she was by herself, but I know I need to accept uncertainty. I walked up and asked about her drink, which was beer--teased her for drinking so early in the afternoon. Noticed her brushing her hair, and asked for compliance by asking to try a sample of the beer. She allowed it, and I asked to sit down with her. She was out alone buying a swimsuit to go to the pool with her kids later. I did a bad job of screening her marital status, and I didn't scan properly for a ring on her hand, but I noticed she still seemed attentive and brushed her hair. Her order at the food court arrived, and she stood up to get it. I awkwardly sat for a little bit before she came back. Knew it was a low point, so teased her on how much food she ordered, before asking her out for coffee. She accepted but I then messed up by not confirming I received her text, because I didn't receive anything and lost the number.

Takeway: I behaved un-virtuously by not screening for her marital status properly as soon as I heard about kids. I don't want to be a homewrecker. I messed up by not confirming I had her number.

Approach 7​

Saw a girl with a beautiful skirt walking towards me. Thought she made eye contact with me, so I gave her a spontaneous compliment. She accepted but didn't stop and kept moving.

Takeaway: Step a little into her path next time and do a policeman stop.

Approach 8​

Saw a girl in a elegant outfit walk past, and caught up to approach her. Said she had a really elegant outfit, loved the color of her jacket, but didn't do great on the delivery. She gave a super monotone "You made my day" and lingered briefly, but I noticed she was not my type up close.

Takeaway: Adding a little more detail to your compliment is good

Approach 9​

Saw a girl with a great body sitting alone by a coffee shop outside. There were some possible spectators nearby and felt a little nervous. But I knew I couldn't avoid this and pretended to notice her as I walked by. She gave one of those attentive, eager "Yes?" when I started talking, so maybe she was giving approach invitations? Anyway I complimented her, and noticed she would brush her hair and giggle. So I pushed forward and asked to sit down with her. She agreed somewhat hesitantly and we chatted.

I was a little nervous about her age (I have bad experiences approaching underage girls), but it turned out she was 19. She was out studying for a meeting with her church group later, and then got the idea to give me a card for her bible study group. This seemed like the wrong direction, so I teased her, "Is this how you pick up guys? Get them to join your bible study group?" She giggled and looked down, seemed pretty good. Seemed like a high point so I asked her out, but she said she is "currently seeing someone". Does this mean she is thinking of me in a boyfriend role so I am competing for the boyfriend spot?

Takeaway: I was pretty proud of the little chase frame, I'm working hard to rewire my brain to do that. I was more relaxed (by necessity, because I was so tired by this point), and that seemed to be good. Maybe chat a little more before asking to sit down.

Approach 10​

Saw a girl sitting down on a couch while walking by, so I maneuvered over and opened. Was nervous about the spectator making eye contact with me while I was approaching her, but resolved to ignore him and commit. She appreciated my compliment, but pulled back and got more aloof and closed when I asked to sit down right after. She seemed young and I was also nervous about her being underage, so I excused myself soon after.

Takeaway: Chat a little more before you ask to sit down.

Approach 11​

Visited a stationery store and saw a cute girl farther down the aisle. Slowly made my way down while examining the items. Eventually she was right next to me, I "noticed" her and immediately said "Oh, I like your outfit." She thanked me while moving past me a little bit, and then lingered examining something nearby. This might have been an invitation to keep talking, but I was super tired and didn't pounce immediately so she kept moving.

Takeaway: Be faster to launch into your follow up after the opener, like "So how's your day going?"

Approach 12​

Saw a girl sitting at an outdoor table next to a restaurant, and walked past her before pretending to "notice" her. I said she was very pretty, and she seemed friendly, but said she was waiting for someone. It sounded like she implied a date, so I asked her about it, and she said "yeah, sort of". I didn't know how to handle it so I took it as a rejection, but she still seemed friendly so I might have had a shot.

Takeaway: Figure out a graceful way to say "Oh hey, if your date doesn't work out, go out with me instead."

Missing Opportunities​

I was looking for approach invitations and thought I might have got a couple, but failed to capitalize on it because I was nervous. It was actually quite helpful to compare girls actual body language to a "neutral" body language with her head forward, arms at her sides, and straight posture, to detect differences that may be a sign of interest.

Takeaway: Push yourself to test these approach invitations more.

Outcome​

Approached a set of 2 girls for the first time.

Approached double digit (12) girls in one outing for the first time.

1 number close but messed it up.

I got very tired after a few approaches and my ability to focus declined drammatically. The 1 two-set was super exhausting for my stamina. I should be more aware of my energy levels in the field.

This field report was very hard to write, I was so zoned out after coming home. I need to be more efficient and write more concise reports.

 

[Will_V]

Goal​

Following from my last field report I am working on better eye contact and voice when in the field https://www.skilledseducer.com/threads/getting-serious.29495/#post-181163

1. Strong eye contact - she should look down at least once
2. Deeper and more resonant voice, originating from the chest
3. End your sentences with a downward tonality

Outing​

Went to a popular shopping street next to the mall today to do daygame

Warmup​

Started by asking a few different girls for directions to the bathroom. I'm not a fan of how contrived it feels, and I would like to have more genuine openers in my warmup in the future.

Approach 1​

Saw a girl walk perpendicular to me on the street. She seemed to see me but turned her head to look forward quickly and kept her hands to her sides. I followed her a short distance down the block and approached. Noticed she seemed on guard, kept walking, and not very open. Felt like a cold reception and I pivoted to just asking her directions.

Takeaway: I got another datapoint on what is NOT an approach invitation

Approach 2​

Saw a set of two girls hanging out and sitting together. Per my last field report I believed I was ready to approach two girls at once. I felt nervous but pretended to stop and suddenly notice them. Then I moved my feet forward. I usually get intimidated and abort the approach at the last second, especially because there was a bystander sitting next to them, but to my surprise I actually ended up in front of them and opening. I used the opener from Meet Girls Everywhere: "Hi, I just saw you and your friend over here, and I thought your friend was really beautiful. Do you mind if I borrow her for a minute?"

I approached the friend, not the girl I was interested in. I made more eye contact with the friend than the girl I wanted to approach. I could feel a slight quaver to my voice because I was nervous. The friend said "Actually, I'm hanging out with her. And she has a boyfriend." The other girl seemed to agree. So I backed off and bid them farewell.

Takeaway: I can approach two girls at once. I should use a more even spread of eye contact between the two girls.

Approach 3​

I saw a girl sitting alone at a table outside the mall, however all the tables around her were packed with possible spectators. I got nervous and procrastinated a bit, going inside a nearby store and scoping out the angles. I realized I was avoiding the problem and decided I needed to go approach, so I went out and maneuvered into a small open space next to her. I was nervous and my voice was a bit stiff. When I introduced myself, asked her name and held out my hand, she declined to take it or introduce herself so I moved on.

Takeaway: Be aware when I am procrastinating and take immediate action.

Approach 4​

Saw a cute girl in a pink outfit who seemed to see me while walking at an angle towards me in the mall. She looked for a second then turned her head back forward and kept walking. I caught up and approached, and she accepted the compliment, but kept walking.

Takeaway: I got another datapoint on what is NOT an approach invitation.

Approach 5​

Was shopping inside a store in the mall when I saw a cute girl just outside. She is moving slowly like she doesn't have anything to do, so I approach her. I thought she was on her phone and asked her if she was (may have seemed insecure?). She wasn't doing anything, but created some distance from me and seemed a bit closed off. There was an awkward silence and she excused herself. By this point I was running low on energy and was forgetting all my goals for the day. I also gave a weak opener without good energy.

Takeaway: Practice delivering a good opener until you can do it while tired

Approach 6​

Saw a pretty girl in the food court by herself with several shopping bags in the seat next to her. She had an interesting drink on the table. I didn't know if she was by herself, but I know I need to accept uncertainty. I walked up and asked about her drink, which was beer--teased her for drinking so early in the afternoon. Noticed her brushing her hair, and asked for compliance by asking to try a sample of the beer. She allowed it, and I asked to sit down with her. She was out alone buying a swimsuit to go to the pool with her kids later. I did a bad job of screening her marital status, and I didn't scan properly for a ring on her hand, but I noticed she still seemed attentive and brushed her hair. Her order at the food court arrived, and she stood up to get it. I awkwardly sat for a little bit before she came back. Knew it was a low point, so teased her on how much food she ordered, before asking her out for coffee. She accepted but I then messed up by not confirming I received her text, because I didn't receive anything and lost the number.

Takeway: I behaved un-virtuously by not screening for her marital status properly as soon as I heard about kids. I don't want to be a homewrecker. I messed up by not confirming I had her number.

Approach 7​

Saw a girl with a beautiful skirt walking towards me. Thought she made eye contact with me, so I gave her a spontaneous compliment. She accepted but didn't stop and kept moving.

Takeaway: Step a little into her path next time and do a policeman stop.

Approach 8​

Saw a girl in a elegant outfit walk past, and caught up to approach her. Said she had a really elegant outfit, loved the color of her jacket, but didn't do great on the delivery. She gave a super monotone "You made my day" and lingered briefly, but I noticed she was not my type up close.

Takeaway: Adding a little more detail to your compliment is good

Approach 9​

Saw a girl with a great body sitting alone by a coffee shop outside. There were some possible spectators nearby and felt a little nervous. But I knew I couldn't avoid this and pretended to notice her as I walked by. She gave one of those attentive, eager "Yes?" when I started talking, so maybe she was giving approach invitations? Anyway I complimented her, and noticed she would brush her hair and giggle. So I pushed forward and asked to sit down with her. She agreed somewhat hesitantly and we chatted.

I was a little nervous about her age (I have bad experiences approaching underage girls), but it turned out she was 19. She was out studying for a meeting with her church group later, and then got the idea to give me a card for her bible study group. This seemed like the wrong direction, so I teased her, "Is this how you pick up guys? Get them to join your bible study group?" She giggled and looked down, seemed pretty good. Seemed like a high point so I asked her out, but she said she is "currently seeing someone". Does this mean she is thinking of me in a boyfriend role so I am competing for the boyfriend spot?

Takeaway: I was pretty proud of the little chase frame, I'm working hard to rewire my brain to do that. I was more relaxed (by necessity, because I was so tired by this point), and that seemed to be good. Maybe chat a little more before asking to sit down.

Approach 10​

Saw a girl sitting down on a couch while walking by, so I maneuvered over and opened. Was nervous about the spectator making eye contact with me while I was approaching her, but resolved to ignore him and commit. She appreciated my compliment, but pulled back and got more aloof and closed when I asked to sit down right after. She seemed young and I was also nervous about her being underage, so I excused myself soon after.

Takeaway: Chat a little more before you ask to sit down.

Approach 11​

Visited a stationery store and saw a cute girl farther down the aisle. Slowly made my way down while examining the items. Eventually she was right next to me, I "noticed" her and immediately said "Oh, I like your outfit." She thanked me while moving past me a little bit, and then lingered examining something nearby. This might have been an invitation to keep talking, but I was super tired and didn't pounce immediately so she kept moving.

Takeaway: Be faster to launch into your follow up after the opener, like "So how's your day going?"

Approach 12​

Saw a girl sitting at an outdoor table next to a restaurant, and walked past her before pretending to "notice" her. I said she was very pretty, and she seemed friendly, but said she was waiting for someone. It sounded like she implied a date, so I asked her about it, and she said "yeah, sort of". I didn't know how to handle it so I took it as a rejection, but she still seemed friendly so I might have had a shot.

Takeaway: Figure out a graceful way to say "Oh hey, if your date doesn't work out, go out with me instead."

Missing Opportunities​

I was looking for approach invitations and thought I might have got a couple, but failed to capitalize on it because I was nervous. It was actually quite helpful to compare girls actual body language to a "neutral" body language with her head forward, arms at her sides, and straight posture, to detect differences that may be a sign of interest.

Takeaway: Push yourself to test these approach invitations more.

Outcome​

Approached a set of 2 girls for the first time.

Approached double digit (12) girls in one outing for the first time.

1 number close but messed it up.

I got very tired after a few approaches and my ability to focus declined drammatically. The 1 two-set was super exhausting for my stamina. I should be more aware of my energy levels in the field.

This field report was very hard to write, I was so zoned out after coming home. I need to be more efficient and write more concise reports.

Okay that's good you're getting the reps in.

However, it's very clear that your nonverbals (basically, what's on your face and what's being expressed by your body when she first sees you) are not up to scratch. Whenever girls react negatively or defensively right away after they see you, it's because of your vibe and the energy you're coming in with.

By the way, it's normal when you're a beginner and you start doing a lot of approaches, you end up with an 'approach android' type of vibe where you lose your fear but expressing emotion is difficult. I think this happens because your body 'learns' the mechanics of approaching much faster than your emotions can learn how to express in the many types of interactions you'll have.

This can result in emotionally flat interactions or girls being skittish. That's OK, but you want to just stay self-aware and understand that in the end you will need to be able to bring the vibe.

The best way I've found to do this is meditation before going out (gets my head and my body in sync) and to go up to her focusing on my own enjoyment of what's happening right now - she looks wonderful, she sounds delightful, and she moves in alluring ways, she's like a beautiful rare bird sitting on a branch as I'm walking in the forest - and if you keep your mind there, it's very hard not to be expressing that enjoyment in your vibe.

 

[alexlaguma]

Okay that's good you're getting the reps in.

However, it's very clear that your nonverbals (basically, what's on your face and what's being expressed by your body when she first sees you) are not up to scratch. Whenever girls react negatively or defensively right away after they see you, it's because of your vibe and the energy you're coming in with.

By the way, it's normal when you're a beginner and you start doing a lot of approaches, you end up with an 'approach android' type of vibe where you lose your fear but expressing emotion is difficult. I think this happens because your body 'learns' the mechanics of approaching much faster than your emotions can learn how to express in the many types of interactions you'll have.

This can result in emotionally flat interactions or girls being skittish. That's OK, but you want to just stay self-aware and understand that in the end you will need to be able to bring the vibe.

The best way I've found to do this is meditation before going out (gets my head and my body in sync) and to go up to her focusing on my own enjoyment of what's happening right now - she looks wonderful, she sounds delightful, and she moves in alluring ways, she's like a beautiful rare bird sitting on a branch as I'm walking in the forest - and if you keep your mind there, it's very hard not to be expressing that enjoyment in your vibe.

This is excellent advice.

@SparklingWadah well done for getting the approaches in. And equally for REFLECTING on each approach and making observations. Continuing to do those two things (approaching + reflecting) will accelerate your progress massively.

If you have the time, I would suggest repeating what you did today (10 approaches + writing a field report) for the next week. By the end of it you'll feel like a different man.

 

[SparklingWadah]

This is excellent advice.

@SparklingWadah well done for getting the approaches in. And equally for REFLECTING on each approach and making observations. Continuing to do those two things (approaching + reflecting) will accelerate your progress massively.

If you have the time, I would suggest repeating what you did today (10 approaches + writing a field report) for the next week. By the end of it you'll feel like a different man.

Thank you for the encouragement. I feel skeptical I will see much progress any time soon, but I realize this may be unfounded skepticism and plan to keep doing FRs for at least another week.

 

[AspiringStoic]

Thank you for the encouragement. I feel skeptical I will see much progress any time soon, but I realize this may be unfounded skepticism and plan to keep doing FRs for at least another week.

A week is a great short term goal to have, but on a more realistic level I would say please be patient with this. A year is a good time span to have in mind.

Lets put this in perspective. This is not a simple trick that we are learning, its trying to bring about a FUNDAMENTAL CHANGE IN OUR PERSONALITIES! It is rewiring the brain in some ways, this takes time.

Although, in the short term we may see some results, real change takes longer to accomplish. Its good to have a realistic timeline and expectations while embarking on this amazing journey.

I see in my city and local groups so many guys quit because:

-They had 2-3 sessions where they got bad AA.

-They had a bad reaction from the last 4-5 girls they approached.

-The last 4-5 numbers they got flaked.

-The last 2-3 dates they went on went nowhere etc.

All the guys who I know who got successful at this, were ones who viewed it as a long time process and did not read too much into the variance in results they got in the short run.

So I would say, be calm, enjoy the process and have faith that over the long run you will definitely change. Lose the short term skepticism and take pride in the fact that you are doing what 99 percent of men would not ever attempt.

 

[Marty]

@SparklingWadah you are a fucking machine, this is very cool! I am not going to comment on anything, because I am not qualified to do so, and the experienced members such as @Will_V have already given you advice. But I wanted to say that I am really impressed with your persistence and determination! I’ve seen your later report too. Keep it up!

 

[SlayerCJ82]

I skimmed your post but So u did 12 approaches and got .. what exactly? Any numbers even?

dude stop Cold Approaching immediately.

you should be Warm Approaching this is 1000x more efficient and more productive AMA I’ll tell u all how to do it easily. For realz.

 

[SlayerCJ82]

All you are really doing here is creeping out/ making socially uncomfortable 12-13 random chicks.
There are no “reps” to get in buddy. sorry to tell you.

any experienced ‘Playa’ should be advising you NOT To do what you are doing above.

Get an IOI from the chick firstly ->to turn into a Warm Approach is step 0 dude.
Trust me on that.

 

[SparklingWadah]

-They had 2-3 sessions where they got bad AA.

-They had a bad reaction from the last 4-5 girls they approached.

-The last 4-5 numbers they got flaked.

-The last 2-3 dates they went on went nowhere etc.

This is pretty interesting for me to hear. I've already hit these benchmarks several times over by now

 

[Marty]

All you are really doing here is creeping out/ making socially uncomfortable 12-13 random chicks

Nope.

@SparklingWadah needs to find a style which is congruent with his own personality. That requires repetition and intelligent practice. When I started out, there was no way I was going to go up to a girl while imitating the approach of, say, RSD Tyler, as that guy has a natural manner diametrically opposed to my own.

It took me time and many attempts to find a style which I really “owned” and felt sincere to me. You need to allow this very motivated and hardworking novice space to make his own mistakes and learn from them, and certainly not discourage him with remarks like the following:

dude stop Cold Approaching immediately

 

[SlayerCJ82]

Nope.

@SparklingWadah needs to find a style which is congruent with his own personality. That requires repetition and intelligent practice. When I started out, there was no way I was going to go up to a girl while imitating the approach of, say, RSD Tyler, as that guy has a natural manner diametrically opposed to my own.

It took me time and many attempts to find a style which I really “owned” and felt sincere to me. You need to allow this very motivated and hardworking novice space to make his own mistakes and learn from them, and certainly not discourage him with remarks like the following:

I’m trying to save him unnecessary pain and a lot of effort leading to not much results.

he did 12 approaches and got jack,
And learned what exactly?

cold approaching for newbies and even intermediate level guys has already been debunked more or less years ago . I have no idea why it’s still being promoted,

I just watched a video the other day of RSD tyler doing 15 “warm up” approaches at night outside and inside a club,
He got blown out over and over and over again , girl even told him flat out F-off from second 1.
And he’s been apparently “ teaching” pickup for what 20 years ?

approaching 101 step 1 for anyone experienced enough to give advice should be :

wait for an approach invitation .

period.

Id ask this - is the OP getting any IOIs at all in his analysis and breakdown? If not , why is he approaching these 12 women?
What’s the supposed purpose of this exercise exactly?

 

[SlayerCJ82]

Oh I reread the OP.
to practice eye contact and voice.
I will still recommend not practicing cold approaching chicks who have shown zero interest for him to do so.

it’s not hard to get a non verbal “ Orange “ signal. Work on that first before approaching everything will be much easier and feel more natural. The OP will have more confidence naturally.

it’s actually Way less stressful than what he’s doing.

 

[Will_V]

cold approaching for newbies and even intermediate level guys has already been debunked more or less years ago .

It has not.

wait for an approach invitation .

No. You don't need an approach invitation. You do need the calibration and social skills to smoothly and pleasantly walk up and meet someone, that's all.

 

[SlayerCJ82]

It has not.



No. You don't need an approach invitation. You do need the calibration and social skills to smoothly and pleasantly walk up and meet someone, that's all.

Ok dude. Sure thing.

maybe do a bit of googling if you missed a very experienced seducer breaking down exactly point by point the issues with cold approaching and the % odds from it.

 

[Will_V]

Ok dude. Sure thing.

maybe do a bit of googling if you missed a very experienced seducer breaking down exactly point by point the issues with cold approaching and the % odds from it.

I don't know what makes you presume to tell guys what they can or can't do. I've gotten laid plenty from daygame cold approach, and it's my preferred way to meet women.

An approach isn't either a crushing rejection or a lay. It's not black and white like that. You can get a lot of pleasure and satisfaction from the experience of approaching or taking her on a date, even if it doesn't end up in the bedroom. I enjoy all the fun interactions I've had, the flirting, the conversation, the ebb and flow of tension, and satisfying my curiosity in general about different kinds of girls and what they are like in person. Sometimes I enjoy it more than sex.

That's why I'm emphasizing the social skills aspect of it, because if you aren't enjoying and having fun with every part of seduction, you're going to experience every approach that doesn't turn into a lay as a personal failure that deals a blow to your self esteem. Girls can see it immediately when a guy is needy and outcome dependent like this, it looks pathetic to her, and she will shut him down right away.

 

[SlayerCJ82]

I don't know what makes you presume to tell guys what they can or can't do. I've gotten laid plenty from daygame cold approach, and it's my preferred way to meet women.

An approach isn't either a crushing rejection or a lay. It's not black and white like that. You can get a lot of pleasure and satisfaction from the experience of approaching or taking her on a date, even if it doesn't end up in the bedroom. I enjoy all the fun interactions I've had, the flirting, the conversation, the ebb and flow of tension, and satisfying my curiosity in general about different kinds of girls and what they are like in person. Sometimes I enjoy it more than sex.

That's why I'm emphasizing the social skills aspect of it, because if you aren't enjoying and having fun with every part of seduction, you're going to experience every approach that doesn't turn into a lay as a personal failure that deals a blow to your self esteem. Girls can see it immediately when a guy is needy and outcome dependent like this, it looks pathetic to her, and she will shut him down right away.

Just my strong opinions from experience that’s all. I’m not ‘telling’ anyone. Just my 2 cents and another side / perspective having gone thru the whole PUA thing myself and looking back on it.

fair enough . I came here for Online Game tips mainly I’ll stick to that discussion then.

i just thought it had been more or less ‘proven ‘ the low odds of street game already a few years back in the community But some very experienced guys in said community. (?) I must be wrong then.

Carry on .