Different take on Reactions vs Results from an advanced guy

[Bismarck]

The idea of this forum is to give guys the tools to, in a variety of settings, be able to take a hot girl to bed (with consent ofc).

Yes, fundamentals are important, but they are not everything.

Personally, I have no interest in having metal etched onto my skin (tattoos), dyeing my hair, punching holes in my ears or nostrils or wherever (piercings, earrings), or following garish fashion trends (baggy jeans, etc.)

Also, I don’t like to go to sleep late to go to a bar at closing time so that I can prey on morsels. And I’d rather drink as little alcohol as possible (none even), since it damages sleep when you drink it at nighttime. At my age and after the health issues I’ve dealt with I’m more concerned with longevity.

And if other guys on here are not willing to make irreversible changes to their appearance or to negatively impact their health by losing a good night’s sleep, they should be safe in the knowledge that they can still smash hot young girls regardless.

 

[Spike]

Personally, I have no interest in

In sleeping with hot girls with consistency. Fixed that for you. Otherwise you wouldn’t have removed the photo of the girl I posted in my last report out of jealousy even after I sketched her eyes out in the photo.

Guess what? At ages 18 (younger actually. But it’s illegal here in the states)-20, girls LOVE all the things you have no interest in. I believe @Skills is near 50 and he follows all that advice except dye his hair because he’s bald. I know that since his made a couple changes to his appearance he has noticed things getting better for him (I saw what he looked like in his last video…he still has more work to do but he’s doing ok).

So either stay mad or listen. Clearly whatever you been doing for the last how many years you been doing this hasn’t gotten you to the point where your sleeping with hot girls with consistency, so why not try something different for a change?

was it Einstein who said, insanity was doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result?

they should be safe in the knowledge that they can still smash hot young girls regardless

If this was the case then there would be a lot more consistency in the forum no?

Look at yourself in the mirror and be honest with yourself. Not just you, Bismarck. Im asking the members of the forum.

Are you currently sleeping with the girls you really want to sleeping with or no?

if your not, and you’ve been following all the mystery method advice, maybe it’s time you tried something different. See what happens.

 

[Rakehell]

I see nothing wrong with this advice, it’s a viable option for people who aren’t taking advantage of extra attraction that they could have.

I do think the framing of it is extreme.

If the quality of girls that open you are:

- below the quality you would like to bang,
- no girls open you or give you Indicators of interests,
- some girls are of the quality you would like to bang

Then I am afraid your fundamentals need a LOT of work.

For example this is desperately in need of context and a reframing. It reads as, if you are never opened then you aren’t attractive, and if you don’t believe girls open guys then you’re gaslighting yourself.

But it fully ignores the who and where of what you are trying to teach.

I.e the type of these girls personalities, their ages, and more importantly where this is happening to you and how consistently;

Not in the grocery store, the mall, at the gym, etc where alot of these guys tend to go. Leaving out key information paints a darker picture than it has to, “hot” is not an acceptable metric and too broad of a term for what you’re insinuating.

Your phrasing and the information that you exclude is the reason for the negative reception of the advice. Not the advice itself.

 

[KJ Francis]

I did not like the nitpick on the lr... But the advice look good and get women 9 to open you is a waste of time

I agree the LR is valid and think the forum is better for having more reports. Even if they are simple, efficient, etc. I just think it is a little much for him to come post stuff to the tune of "why do you guys think James D is good and not me" and then "I am an advanced seducer, give me my respect".

And yeah because it all boils down to filtering girls down. Effective and efficient, but very narrow. I agree with what @Bismarck wrote. There's no replicable game. There is no strategy offered regarding how to approach and/or seduce a woman.

That has been around for ever lol

I go to bed at like 9pm. This is all news to me. I'm learning new vocabulary from scratch, like "bouncer", "cover", and "nap".

I agree with the overall message to make sure your fundamentals are in check and keep improving them, and even dress to an archetype. But that's a prerequisite to the actual seduction. So my nitpick in the LR's like his and that insane milf one that another guy just posted is to share significantly more detail of the actions taken (including nonverbal), and especially the dialog so we can learn from the nuances of the back and forth conversation.

 

[Spike]

I.e the type of these girls personalities, their ages, and more importantly where this is happening to you and how consistently;

Not in the grocery store, the mall, at the gym, etc where alot of these guys tend to go. Leaving out key information paints a darker picture than it has to, “hot” is not an acceptable metric and too broad of a term for what you’re insinuating.

You are correct. I went into further context of where this is happening, girls ages, personality further down in the comments but did not include it in the OP. My apologies

 

[Spike]

Effective and efficient, but very narrow

Some of the girls you end up with will have similar personalities and music taste. Others completely different. Even how ambitions they are career wise will vary. I suppose that’s the fun in all this. Getting to get to know different types of girls and how they live their lives. But to me that is secondary to getting with hot girls in a fast and efficient manner

 

[KJ Francis]

Are you currently sleeping with the girls you really want to sleeping with or no?

if your not, and you’ve been following all the mystery method advice, maybe it’s time you tried something different. See what happens

Mystery would wear black eyeliner and nail polish to get girls to open him. Your pre-game is actually similar there. And I don't know of anyone here doing pure MM, which prioritizes retention and lowering buyer's remorse.

Here is how I see your game from the lens of the M3 model:

A1 (open): girl opens you
A2 (female to male interest): handled by screening through extreme peacocking not replicable in all social settings
A3 (screening/qualifying): "I will fuck you"

C1-3 (comfort): not needed due to screening out girls who need comfort, and screening in the most impulsive girls

S1-3 (sex): LMR screened out. Get to it.

***

Effective and efficient!

However, every word I have ever written to you comes down to that if the girl is not immediately visually fascinated by you before engaging, I see your game as this:

A1: ?
Game over.

So if you ever need to deal with a bitch shield, maybe MM is worth a read.

I do commend your results and if you're achieving your goals, that's awesome. But like you said with the archetype fashion video, it is a "cheat code", meaning it avoids having to play a skillful game. Smart strategy, honestly. But useless if the girl is neutral or starting from a basic interest level.

 

[Spike]

So if you ever need to deal with a bitch shield, maybe MM is worth a read

I don’t need to deal with bitch shields. Nor would I ever want to. What you dont know is that I’ve been gaming for 10+ years. So I went through the whole mystery method thing many years ago. It never got me the results (consistent quality) that I’m getting today.

Smart strategy, honestly. But useless if the girl is neutral or starting from a basic interest level

Thanks and yeah the goal is to make it so those same neutral girls (because before chasing my appearance. These same kinds of girls were pretty “can take him or level him”) start out at a high interest level. Less dancing monkey. More chill. Then again could be an age thing lol

 

[KJ Francis]

Some of the girls you end up with will have similar personalities and music taste. Others completely different. Even how ambitions they are career wise will vary. I suppose that’s the fun in all this. Getting to get to know different types of girls and how they live their lives. But to me that is secondary to getting with hot girls in a fast and efficient manner

Yes but your entire pool is already filtered to the girl with the confidence to actively approach the guy dressed for a one night stand and who is still going after the venue close.

It meets your goal, so your advice is good for guys who want to replicate it in this specific scenario with girls already narrowly selected.

I posted a link to something from Teevster earlier, differentiating new school vs. old school (being able to seduce a particular girl of interest).

 

[Spike]

Yes but your entire pool is already filtered to the girl with the confidence to actively approach the guy dressed for a one night stand and who is still going after the venue close.

My pool is hot girls who went to the bar that particular night. The thing about my college town is that it’s pretty boring. There’s not much to do here besides go out. So a lot of girls go out, making that pool enormous. Sometimes as I said in the comment below on skills other thread, you’ll bump into girls hot girls who never go out and drink.

While the bars with be filled with mostly subpar girls, older girls (that are past frat parties stage or don’t like frats), and only a couple hot girls that were either at frat earlier in the night and then came to the bar or they don’t like frats and usually never go out, but you got lucky and ran into her the one night she goes out. My point about being a sniper in skills last post

Now about the confidence to approach thing. What youll find is that a lot of these girls that end up approaching you, never do that. They wait for the guy to approach them. I’m trying to make you such a spectacle, that they’ll throw away their rule and find some excuse to say something to you. Or make their friend say something to you for them. But that’s not what I’m aiming at here.

again, the point of hot girls approaching you (the “confident” ones) is an honest signal that a lot of these girls in this place will be receptive to you. So even if she hasn’t looked at you yet, you can be sure she will have a strong likeliness of being receptive to you, because your previous experience (either at this same bar last week, this same outing) shows that your at the level you want to be at. That’s the point of looking for that sign (hot girls approaching you).

 

[Rakehell]

Yes but your entire pool is already filtered to the girl with the confidence to actively approach the guy dressed for a one night stand and who is still going after the venue close.

This isn’t necessarily true, it reads as a layup but there are other factors at play, it still takes “game” to capitalize on attraction, & the game aspect has already been beaten to death and framed in a billion ways for any one persons comprehension level.

Undermining it as screening for girls open to hooking up is purely an emotional response by the reader. Girls open to opening themselves or hooking up are not taking that initiative for every guy.

Any girl that you sleep with is fundamentally “open to hooking up”. They hooked up with you. No it is not only about girls who are ovulating, or out for some kind of rebound etc.

I personally think that it is valuable to have an update on how to cater your presentation to this demographic, if it is your demographic. Who wouldn’t want to know this?

 

[POB]

Otherwise you wouldn’t have removed the photo of the girl I posted in my last report out of jealousy even after I sketched her eyes out in the photo.

I removed it.
Even with scratched eyes, you could clearly identify her.

Also worth taking a look:
https://www.skilledseducer.com/thre...e-to-make-friends-not-be-a-drama-queen.28112/

I'll go ahead and highlight some stuff if you don't wanna read it all:

1. "Arguing with senior members. We kind of understand if you’re a pro, who has some pretty set opinions and is not used to operating within a community of other guys, some of whom may be very skilled but have very different seduction “operating systems” to yours. But you should still avoid arguments until you’re more seasoned. Folks don’t know who you are yet. Give them time to figure out you are ACTUALLY skilled… and give yourself time to figure out who’s who here. If you are NOT a pro, then you REALLY should not be arguing with senior members. Don’t do it, man. If you’re new and arguing, we’re probably going to ban you and force you to take your anger to the YouTube comment section instead.
   
2. Not respecting senior members. The guys at Rank 2 (Tool-Bearing Hominid… the green rank) can get there purely just on the basis of a positive attitude and an action-orientation. But anyone above that rank reached his rank because we think he’s skilled enough. Rank 3s (Cro-Magnon Men) are decent with girls. Rank 4s (Modern Humans) are very solid with girls and usually getting laid regularly and have their own novel techniques and skills sets. Rank 5s (Tribal Elders) are the legendary boss players at the top of the game. You’re new here, you don’t know who everyone is yet, the relationship between other members… don’t make the mistake of disrespecting guys. Seriously. Get a feel for the place. Be chill. In time, you will know who these guys are (you might not see eye-to-eye with all of them, but you will at least understand them better, and they you)."

 

[Rakehell]

This isn’t necessarily true, it reads as a layup but there are other factors at play, it still takes “game” to capitalize on attraction, & the game aspect has already been beaten to death and framed in a billion ways for any one persons comprehension level.

Undermining it as screening for girls open to hooking up is purely an emotional response by the reader. Girls open to opening themselves or hooking up are not taking that initiative for every guy.

Any girl that you sleep with is fundamentally “open to hooking up”. They hooked up with you. No it is not only about girls who are ovulating, or out for some kind of rebound etc.

I personally think that it is valuable to have an update on how to cater your presentation to this demographic, if it is your demographic. Who wouldn’t want to know this?

Alot of the advice in the op was distilled in a way that applies to people already operating at an advanced level. People who already know how to capitalize on attraction. And what good fundamentals entails.

I have implemented a-lot of the things OP talks about and can vouch for them working in terms of a fundamental boost in attractiveness.

 

[KJ Francis]

I’m trying to make you such a spectacle, that they’ll throw away their rule and find some excuse to say something to you

Yes this was one of the original ideas of peacocking - to elicit an open from the girl.

This isn’t necessarily true, it reads as a layup but there are other factors at play, it still takes “game” to capitalize on attraction, & the game aspect has already been beaten to death and framed in a billion ways for any one persons comprehension level.

Undermining it as screening for girls open to hooking up is purely an emotional response by the reader. Girls open to opening themselves or hooking up are not taking that initiative for every guy.

Any girl that you sleep with is fundamentally “open to hooking up”. They hooked up with you. No it is not only about girls who are ovulating, or out for some kind of rebound etc.

I personally think that it is valuable to have an update on how to cater your presentation to this demographic, if it is your demographic. Who wouldn’t want to know this?

I agree with all this. I would like to learn more of his "game" beyond his fundamentals and have not seen anything so far.

But if he does not even engage with girls who are not placing themselves in a chase frame from the start, I do not see it as "advanced". It is like playing a video game on easy mode only.

If he can share more of his process beyond the opener to amplify the attraction, perhaps I can learn something.

 

[Spike]

It is like playing a video game on easy mode only

Yes my friend. That’s what cheat codes are designed to do. Make the game unfairly easy for yourself . From there, I don’t think I do anything interesting to write about that others can’t do themselves. I haven’t gone out since but I can go out this weekend and try to be more detailed about what I do after the open

 

[Skills]

Yes this was one of the original ideas of peacocking - to elicit an open from the girl.


I agree with all this. I would like to learn more of his "game" beyond his fundamentals and have not seen anything so far.

But if he does not even engage with girls who are not placing themselves in a chase frame from the start, I do not see it as "advanced". It is like playing a video game on easy mode only.

If he can share more of his process beyond the opener to amplify the attraction, perhaps I can learn something.

also fundamental are not enough plenty of guys with great fundamentals i can name drop: kaida, darknight, sexnovalidation the dude that got banned that did the telegram group forgot his name.... I can name drop all day are not getting those results if they were to do same structure.........

Again, my point is the lr was fine, people nitpicking was silly... This post to justify the other lr was unnecessary and i am trying to point out, what the perception of the guys nitpicking was.... which you explained really good in this post and doing the structure which is not that practical to many of the guys here...

 

[Skills]

I agree the LR is valid and think the forum is better for having more reports. Even if they are simple, efficient, etc. I just think it is a little much for him to come post stuff to the tune of "why do you guys think James D is good and not me" and then "I am an advanced seducer, give me my respect".

correct lol!

And yeah because it all boils down to filtering girls down. Effective and efficient, but very narrow. I agree with what @Bismarck wrote. There's no replicable game. There is no strategy offered regarding how to approach and/or seduce a woman.

i said that

I go to bed at like 9pm. This is all news to me. I'm learning new vocabulary from scratch, like "bouncer", "cover", and "nap".

Brah!

I agree with the overall message to make sure your fundamentals are in check and keep improving them, and even dress to an archetype. But that's a prerequisite to the actual seduction. So my nitpick in the LR's like his and that insane milf one that another guy just posted is to share significantly more detail of the actions taken (including nonverbal), and especially the dialog so we can learn from the nuances of the back and forth conversation.

correct, but i have still ptsd of you posting a lay report 7 years old, my nitpick is valid...

 

[ChrisVirtue]

1) What is the quality of the girls that open you or give you IOIs and 2) how many of them

If the quality of girls that open you are:

- below the quality you would like to bang,
- no girls open you or give you Indicators of interests,
- some girls are of the quality you would like to bang

this is delusional no ?

genuine question: what environments/cities/scenes are you in that incredibly hot girls regularly open you ?

I've only had that happen in carefully crafted social circle events, and even in those scenarios I'm the one doing the initial open but they already know of me...

 

[ChrisVirtue]

Yep

you are right that does sound like something you can find in any incel forum. Good thing that is not what I am advising.

My advice is to simply pay attention to the quality of girls that give you indicators of interest and the quality of the girls that open you.

If you are still getting approached by drunk fat girls or not getting many indicators of interest from hot girls, or you approach hot girls but a lot of the times it feels like they can take it or leave it (compared to I need this guy) then you need to keep tweaking your appearance.

by tweaking your appearance I mean: your hairstyle, muscles, skincare, piercings, jewelry, tattoos, shirt style, size and fit of your pants, shoes. Keep tweaking until you begin to notice those things starting to happen.

I provided a practical video in my first report I shared on helping achieve that by focusing on archetypes.

Because after you begin to notice those signs, you either could get opened by the hot girls or you can open the hot girls and they will be very compliant to you (“super green”).

that is not “look good” (which first of all is too vague) and 9s to open you.

so you're legitimately just going into small bars alone and standing next to the bar waiting for these so-called 9s to open you ?

what city is this happening in ? that 9s are just frolicking around willy nilly and opening you because you have tattoos

 

[Skills]

so you're legitimately just going into small bars alone and standing next to the bar waiting for these so-called 9s to open you ?

what city is this happening in ? that 9s are just frolicking around willy nilly and opening you because you have tattoos

Happens all the time in night game... Doesn't necessary translate to lays....