Ended

[Oooooook]

. This was really dumb

 

[Tony D]

I'm not familiar with whatever conversation this pertains to. But I'll tell you this: I don't make a shitload of money. But I fly around the world and sleep with sexy women everywhere I go. However, I like making money, and the more I have, the better I make my life. Money gives me a bit more freedom to explore, to sleep (better home environment) and to purchase good tools, like my new macbook.

But if I had more, I'd maybe buy a boat, a big chunk of land in Canada to build a house near the forest, etc. One day.

 

[Tony D]

What do you mean they write you off as hard working?

 

[Tony D]

My assumption is that because of who I am they think I have infinite social options and they don’t feel bad rejecting me and don’t help me out in the seduction. Hector noted that a lot of girls will help out a guy who they think is “dumb” even if he isn’t because they think he needs the help.

I feel like I’m getting the reverse end of that stick. I go to the gym six times a week and approach around 20 women per week but it seems like I’m always losing due to this problem.

Well, I've been coaching clients for a decade and many of them were rich... cause coaching is expensive. They've flown me across the world to live in their houses, cruise in their boats, and I'll tell you this... money doesn't buy you game. It can help bring girls into your life if you use it as a tool.

For example: rent a pimpin air bnb with a swimming pool on a popular beach... then cold approach women and invite them to your place "right there with the pool."

You still need game to cold approach, and show them you're a cool guy. You also need to understand psychology to weed out or at least handle gold diggers, scammers, etc.

I've found though many of the rich clients were just as insecure and needy as the students living off their loans.

 

[Tony D]

I'm not familiar with type A. Or what you mean by "Push too hard." I also don't know in what context women would get intimidated (by what and why.)

 

[Tony D]

My hit rate was higher when I was a broke uglier guy who dressed like shit.

You tell me to look good and approach but doing that almost makes it worse since it’s clear I have time to fix my appearance

My hit rate was higher when I was a broke uglier guy who dressed like shit.

You tell me to look good and approach but doing that almost makes it worse since it’s clear I have time to fix my appearance and time to approach.

time to approach.

I'm going to PM you about this.

 

[ulrich]

@Oooooook You seem to be romanticizing hard work.

Good for you, man. But every single thing in extremes ends up badly, even hard work.
I sure know about that...

 

[Rain]

I'm going to PM you about this.

Hey Tony,

This is a quote from a thread I made asking if money was powerful

Chase wrote

There was a thread on this forum a few months back by a guy talking about how his results have gone down a lot now that he's wealthier.

Have you noticed anything like this with people you know or even clients where they got wealthier and their results went down?

Did you help the rich clients of yours, by maybe dress down a bit or add a bit of edge to their outfit, or tell them not offer to pay for everything[unless shes flat broke/a decade younger as I think Chase said in a comment somewhere that if she's a decade younger you paying can be a bit dominant] or try and change their mindset that money isn't necessarily everything?

I've seen on this forum one or two guys seem to think large amounts of money is necessary when I don't think it is. But at the same time, I have a desire to make money, but not for women, just so I don't have to go to work. Or maybe it's a security thing? Then again that money desire might be more innate in humans generally so in some ways it might be hard to quantify the reasoning behind it.

 

[Tony D]

Hey Tony,

This is a quote from a thread I made asking if money was powerful

Chase wrote


Have you noticed anything like this with people you know or even clients where they got wealthier and their results went down?

Did you help the rich clients of yours, by maybe dress down a bit or add a bit of edge to their outfit, or tell them not offer to pay for everything[unless shes flat broke/a decade younger as I think Chase said in a comment somewhere that if she's a decade younger you paying can be a bit dominant] or try and change their mindset that money isn't necessarily everything?

I've seen on this forum one or two guys seem to think large amounts of money is necessary when I don't think it is. But at the same time, I have a desire to make money, but not for women, just so I don't have to go to work. Or maybe it's a security thing? Then again that money desire might be more innate in humans generally so in some ways it might be hard to quantify the reasoning behind it.

I've had rich clients that had it in their heads that money was holding them back. But again, this is all inner game stuff. Or they claim now that the girl has seen their nice apartment, they don't see them as a quick sex fling, but a potential boyfriend, and they get lmr.

Most of this is just nonsense.

My job as a coach is basically a bullshit detector. I listen to men tell me their stories, I nod my head empatically, then say... "If you're done with the bullshit, now can we move forward?"

Money is a tool. What's more powerful than money? Fame, of course. But you don't hear many men discussing social proof on the forums? Why is that? Because to develop talent seems far more difficult than earning more money. One is a commodity you get in exchange for your time, the other is a skill you get in exchange for your time.

Who gets more ass? Some dev at Google who makes 600 k a year, or a bad ass drummer in a midly popular underground band?

 

[Beck Bass]

Some dev at Google who makes 600 k a year, or a bad ass drummer in a midly popular underground band?

Very true, not only because the drummer is seem more doing cool stuff, therefore he's more on women's radars (specially on a moment many will of them feel more open to meet new people, and even looking for sex), but because the nature of the jobs is very different:
A drummer will have to socialize with a bunch of people to get on stage, even if he isn't talking with club managers or whatever people put his band there, he still got have a band, and, for that, he needs to keep bonds with those guys that he plays with. Also performing is a bit of social art, even if you're just trying to play a beat, you're trying to communicate with people, somehow, your emotions will show and maybe be even expressed in the song itself... (plus many bands talk about sex nonchalantly, since it's one of people's favorite subjects for songs, fans and artists).
On the other side, a dev/programmer/IT guy will be sitting on his computer all day, having little interaction with other people, for the most part, and when he has, those are mostly other male nerds. People with jobs like these also tend to be heavier on online interactions, instead of having healthy social circle or going out frequently to meet new people (honestly, myself, I do all of three, but the quarantine sure made me go online a lot more, I'm pretty much only going out with Tinder girls, and it sure had an impact on my game).

 

[trashKENNUT]

Don't delete this thread. I'm reading it. *Insert angry face emoji*

z@c+

 

[Rain]

But again, this is all inner game stuff.

That's a good general way of looking at it.

Who gets more ass? Some dev at Google who makes 600 k a year, or a bad ass drummer in a midly popular underground band?

I'm wondering if you meant that as a rhetorical question.... would they be about the same? Or hard to say as we can't see all of their fundametnals and their game

 

[hey_lover]

People always create a false dichotomy when it comes to money, like having game and being filthy rich are mutually exclusive. Surely, the ideal is to develop game, create wealth and marry the two?

My KJ about wealth is that it allows you to climb socioeconomic classes, which then arms you with a major attraction tool (status from being of higher class) to secure hot girls from lower social classes.

 

[Beck Bass]

KJ

Can anyone explain to me what KJ means? I see it thrown around in the forums and I have no idea what it means lmao

 

[ulrich]

Can anyone explain to me what KJ means? I see it thrown around in the forums and I have no idea what it means lmao

Keyjocking: When you write an elaborate speech on the internet about something you have not even tried in real life.

 

[ulrich]

My KJ about wealth is that it allows you to climb socioeconomic classes, which then arms you with a major attraction tool (status from being of higher class) to secure hot girls from lower social classes.

This is a double edge sword.

As men, we tend to think that more power/status will bring you more girls... the more status, the better... which it’s true to some extent... it opens doors for you in the “lower” social classes if you are looking for flings.
But as you grow in status, you change (and you should change)... so it creates dissimilarity.

Dissimilarity is bad if you’re looking for connection, or long term relationships.

They say it is lonely at the top... and for a reason.

 

[Beck Bass]

Keyjocking: When you write an elaborate speech on the internet about something you have not even tried in real life.

Thank you sir

 

[Chase]

There are definitely ways to use wealth to get laid.

One note I'd have here though:

My KJ about wealth is that it allows you to climb socioeconomic classes, which then arms you with a major attraction tool (status from being of higher class) to secure hot girls from lower social classes.

When I got out of college and had a 9-to-5 that put me into the middle-middle or upper-middle class or so, I thought this would be the case.

So I hung out at a bunch of bars where lower class women were and I tried picking up poor chicks for a while by letting them see my car or telling them about my job or the place I lived in.

All I got with them was a bunch of lukewarm interest, for the most part, and I stood around slack-jawed as they ran off with broke guys instead of me.

Then I'd go to places with women in my socioeconomic class, and they'd 'be sooo much easier to game.

At first I thought I was running into auto-rejection with the poor chicks. But it didn't really feel like auto-rejection. It felt like they simply viewed other low class guys as legitimately more attractive than me.

Eventually I figured out that what was happening is there are distinct 'styles' between people in different classes, and that me trying to approach lower class women the same way I approached middle class women was framing me as a guy who didn't get it, wasn't on their level, and wasn't as socially attuned as the cool lower class guy who 'got it'.

For this same reason when I'd see lower class guys hit on middle class girls, the girls would usually be annoyed or grossed out and go to a middle class guy. Not because the poor guy is unattractive, but because he doesn't 'get' how to behave in a way that's considered attractively calibrated to a middle class girl.

That rule goes out the window a bit with the social climbers... e.g., gold diggers and status diggers who are trying to move up from the lower class by being around more higher class people and emulating them (as best they can). These girls will date guys from higher classes, whom they do not necessarily actually consider more attractive (because the girl has lower class calibration still embedded in her), but they are willing to date to try to change their calibration and raise their socioeconomic class.

This is why you will often see gold diggers with some higher class guy, but still banging lower class guys on the side.

It is not really that the lower class guys they shag are necessarily cooler or sexier than the higher class boyfriend (though they might be).

Often it is just that the lower class girl is still calibrated for lower class game, and still finds that more attractive than the game of the guy she's dating from a higher class for the purposes of 'dating up'.

One other data point: also look at the girlfriends and wives of wealthy man. How many of these were women they picked from the slums... versus how many were either a.) women from their own socioeconomic classes, or b.) women who were social climbers / gold diggers, and so made themselves available to these men? It is almost always one of the latter two.

Thus why you don't typically find Oxycontin Olivia giving blowjobs to Big Bucks Ben in her trailer or his penthouse. Instead, Oxycontin Olivia is going to be sucking off Fentanyl Freddie in the trailer park, meanwhile Big Bucks Ben will be in his penthouse getting bjs from Upper Class Ursula or Supermodel Sarah.

Chase

 

[Yaxir]

Very true, not only because the drummer is seem more doing cool stuff, therefore he's more on women's radars (specially on a moment many will of them feel more open to meet new people, and even looking for sex), but because the nature of the jobs is very different:
A drummer will have to socialize with a bunch of people to get on stage, even if he isn't talking with club managers or whatever people put his band there, he still got have a band, and, for that, he needs to keep bonds with those guys that he plays with. Also performing is a bit of social art, even if you're just trying to play a beat, you're trying to communicate with people, somehow, your emotions will show and maybe be even expressed in the song itself... (plus many bands talk about sex nonchalantly, since it's one of people's favorite subjects for songs, fans and artists).
On the other side, a dev/programmer/IT guy will be sitting on his computer all day, having little interaction with other people, for the most part, and when he has, those are mostly other male nerds. People with jobs like these also tend to be heavier on online interactions, instead of having healthy social circle or going out frequently to meet new people (honestly, myself, I do all of three, but the quarantine sure made me go online a lot more, I'm pretty much only going out with Tinder girls, and it sure had an impact on my game).

wow that really rings a bell

mate, can i hit you up some time if i want to ask something @Beck Bass ?

 

[Yaxir]

There are definitely ways to use wealth to get laid.

One note I'd have here though:



When I got out of college and had a 9-to-5 that put me into the middle-middle or upper-middle class or so, I thought this would be the case.

So I hung out at a bunch of bars where lower class women were and I tried picking up poor chicks for a while by letting them see my car or telling them about my job or the place I lived in.

All I got with them was a bunch of lukewarm interest, for the most part, and I stood around slack-jawed as they ran off with broke guys instead of me.

Then I'd go to places with women in my socioeconomic class, and they'd 'be sooo much easier to game.

At first I thought I was running into auto-rejection with the poor chicks. But it didn't really feel like auto-rejection. It felt like they simply viewed other low class guys as legitimately more attractive than me.

Eventually I figured out that what was happening is there are distinct 'styles' between people in different classes, and that me trying to approach lower class women the same way I approached middle class women was framing me as a guy who didn't get it, wasn't on their level, and wasn't as socially attuned as the cool lower class guy who 'got it'.

For this same reason when I'd see lower class guys hit on middle class girls, the girls would usually be annoyed or grossed out and go to a middle class guy. Not because the poor guy is unattractive, but because he doesn't 'get' how to behave in a way that's considered attractively calibrated to a middle class girl.

That rule goes out the window a bit with the social climbers... e.g., gold diggers and status diggers who are trying to move up from the lower class by being around more higher class people and emulating them (as best they can). These girls will date guys from higher classes, whom they do not necessarily actually consider more attractive (because the girl has lower class calibration still embedded in her), but they are willing to date to try to change their calibration and raise their socioeconomic class.

This is why you will often see gold diggers with some higher class guy, but still banging lower class guys on the side.

It is not really that the lower class guys they shag are necessarily cooler or sexier than the higher class boyfriend (though they might be).

Often it is just that the lower class girl is still calibrated for lower class game, and still finds that more attractive than the game of the guy she's dating from a higher class for the purposes of 'dating up'.

One other data point: also look at the girlfriends and wives of wealthy man. How many of these were women they picked from the slums... versus how many were either a.) women from their own socioeconomic classes, or b.) women who were social climbers / gold diggers, and so made themselves available to these men? It is almost always one of the latter two.

Thus why you don't typically find Oxycontin Olivia giving blowjobs to Big Bucks Ben in her trailer or his penthouse. Instead, Oxycontin Olivia is going to be sucking off Fentanyl Freddie in the trailer park, meanwhile Big Bucks Ben will be in his penthouse getting bjs from Upper Class Ursula or Supermodel Sarah.

Chase

from the man himself !

glad to have found this place, Mr. Chase

it's a pleasure to make your acquaintance

thank you for making this forum for us to get advice and share our experiences

that is some great advice and i think it really opens up and clears some confusions i had regarding the class differences between men and women involved in dating, even if i am from a very different society

i am an absolute beginner right now and have almost no game at the moment

i do hope to learn more from you and the others !

cheers