Ergon's Newbie Assignment

[Ergon]

Slow weeks and day 8 (part 2/2)

4.
The following week, another Sunday; I wandered around the city. I saw a girl to approach and sat down next to her and asked if she knew what was the event going on there. She told me, but I realized she was either too old or gaunt due to drug. I'm not really picky anymore but I think being healthy is a basic condition…
I wandered around some more, then made some small talk with a gentlemen who asked some directions and was in the city for business.
Then finally, I saw a girl sitting in some stairs. She had headphones on. I motioned her to take them off, and delivered my opener although a bit awkwardly. "I saw you sitting here... and I thought you were cute..." I was very awkward throughout the whole interaction. She tried to distant herself from me and didn't contribute to the conversation much. I tried to push the conversation to last at least 5 min, at which point she just said I had to leave, nice meeting you, and left. Wish I remembered snippets of the conversation but I just remember I struggled to say anything coherent…

5.
Walking around some more, I let 2 or 3 viable approaches pass by just because they were walking instead of sitting. For me sitting approaches were felt much easier than walking ones. I made a mental note to work on that next time. Then I saw a girl sitting watching a small public concert going on. I sat beside her and didn't make eye contact, until the band made a pause to change song, and I asked her if she knew who they were(situational opening). I then told her I just knew there were many art performances going on around the city that week. She seemed friendlier than the last girl. We exchanged names, where she was from, etc. She asked me what did I do; I answered I wasn't doing anything (true because I wasn't working nor studying during vacations). At some point I said:
Me:"Well I think I have to keep going soon…"
Her: "It was nice to meet you"
Me: "Oh, but I was thinking we could grab a bite or a drink sometime?"
Her: "Mmm, I don't give my number to strangers"
Me: "I bet… [handing her my cellphone] put your number here"

When she was done I got up and told her it was nice meeting her. Then she asked where I worked and I said I was unemployed. A very silly answer, I was trying (too hard) to be intriguing but came out straight out weird. It was not surprising then that she didn't answered any text.

I was glad though because I made two sitting down approaches the same day, effectively accomplishing day 8 of the newbie assignment.

TL;DR
-After dealing with AA for several days, adopting an "approach to fail" and "shoot first, ask question later" I was finally able to approach again.
-At the end I made 2 sitting down approaches in one day
-My sticking points in daygame are... opening confidently, making conversation, closing consistently and getting them to respond the icebreaker. For the openings I think I need to up my fundamentals; I feel they need an urgent upgrade. For making conversation I need to practice more, and vary what I talk about each time (for some reason I always want to ask where they are from and say where I am from, but it's become to repetitive now). As for closing and getting dates I might need to phrase my asking-them-for-coffee a bit better.
-My sticking point with nightgame seems to be handling logistics and isolating... my logistics are not so good; no car, live with roommate, at the outskirt of the city. It is not impossible though.

 

[Ergon]

Reconnecting

The following week, I was on the street when I saw an ex-classmate pass by car. She quickly waved hello as she went on.

We were in the same class a few months ago and we sat next to each most of it. I tried to ask her out about the four week, and we exchanged numbers but she had to cancel and then, for some reason, I didn't persist. Nonetheless we talked and got to know each other a little bit each class until the class ended.

Going forward, the day I saw her I shot her a text:

Did I see you passing by through X street today?
I think so ha
So you're back from your tour? [she had told me she would travel for vacations]
Yes I am, just got back last week
Nice! I'm sure they weren't long enough
It was fun haha, we went to such and such place.
Not too shabby… why don't we meet up and you tell me more about it?
We could, I am bla bla this weekend. Maybe next week?
Yep… next week I can X day. Around the afternoon?

Logistics texts. I sent her a message x day asking if we were on for that day, and she said she could meet almost immediately and we could grab a coffee. We met at a coffee a few blocks from my place. We took the coffee to go and then walked around trying to find a park, but we didn't so I just walked her to my place and sat at the yard. A lot of talking…
Then I suggested we listen to some music and we went inside. She followed me to my room. Forgot to ask her to take her shoes off . We listened to a couple of song but then I just put some house music (I like it and I think Chase mentioned it's sensual). We talked probably around 15 min and then I tried to kiss her, but she turned her head. I tried again 10 minutes later. Then after another 15, to no avail.

Then started to touch her leg for a while and then moved to her tight and massaged it for several minutes, but I didn't move to her crotch. Then at some point she got up and said she had to keep going. I insisted once or twice she stay but she eventually left, although in good terms.
In retrospect I could've done much more to turn her on, escalate and defuse LMR.
Later I found Anatman's article Passion plus Compassion and had to smack my forehead at the many things I could've done in the situation. In retrospect, I also had the chance to create some sex talk, but I didn't.

Also if a girl says: "I don't know you" "Yes you know me, I am me".

Anyway, I felt a bit disappointed, but also a bit optimistic because although I failed, I got farther than ever. It was the farthest I've got escalating, so I see some improvement…

 

[kalyan]

Hey man,
I quickly went over your last two posts,i saw a few things i liked
First, saying "i bet... Put your number here" to the girl who didnt want to give out her number to a stranger. Classic move, even though you didn't get a response on text.
Another good thing is your insistence on kissing (trying 3 times). Things like that help you learn. I do have a few tips for you:
- you waited too long to go for the first kiss.(15 minutes). You should at least touch her neck/ hair or something as sexual after, say, if you were to wait that long. Just go for the kiss earlier.
- i dont think the massaging helps.. You didn't get what you need, and this looks like a big compromise. The way i would do it after 3 failed attempts is tell her something like "so we're alone together now what should we do, just talk?" Coupled with sexy smile/ eye contact.
Cheers!

 

[Ergon]

Kalyan,your advice is spot on.

First, saying "i bet... Put your number here" to the girl who didnt want to give out her number to a stranger. Classic move, even though you didn't get a response on text.

It was kind of automatic. My sticking point now is to actually get a response from the numbers I get from daygame.

you waited too long to go for the first kiss.(15 minutes).

Definitely took too much to go for the kiss. Moreover,reviewing the situation in my mind, the first attempt I should've said "It's okay, we'll go at whatever pace you're comfortable" (courtesy of Anatman). Then the second attempt to kiss her I could've used your line. There was also a point later where we discussed crazy stuff she did in high school, and she also hinted she was very crazy but didn't specify why. I think I could've asked there "Were you dirty?". There were many good leads that I didn't take, but it was a good chance to learn, though.

i dont think the massaging helps.. You didn't get what you need, and this looks like a big compromise.

Interesting... at that moment I just thought it would be better if I tried escalating another way after the failed attempts to kiss her.

Thank you for the feedback!

 

[kalyan]

My sticking point now is to actually get a response from the numbers I get from daygame

You're not alone. my texting could improve as well. am actively working on it. we need to be comfortable with facing lots of rejections (and knowing these rejections are because our skills need polishing, not because we are bad/ unattractive men).

Interesting... at that moment I just thought it would be better if I tried escalating another way after the failed attempts to kiss her.

I see what you mean. let me tell you how i see it:
the path looks something like this: talking --> intimate touching --> kissing --> undressing --> foreplay --> fucking. This is very, very general, but assume this is the way to go.
In no part does massaging squeeze itself here. if your problem was at touching, take a step back to talking. if she doesnt feel comfortable with you touching her boobs (foreplay), go back to kissing. take a step back, then try again.
The problem is, you branched out to massaging: this has no place in this 'model'. IMPORTANT NOTE: some people might make massaging a part of the process, and it could be helpful as there is touching, but i dont put it as part of my escalation. HOWEVER, if it were part of your plan, you could go back to it when you get a kiss rejection. ie:
if your process is talking --> intimate touching --> massage ---> kissing -->... then massage would be fine, as you're NOT compromising, you're simply going back to an earlier point.

 

[Ergon]

I see what you mean. let me tell you how i see it:
the path looks something like this: talking --> intimate touching --> kissing --> undressing --> foreplay --> fucking. This is very, very general, but assume this is the way to go.
In no part does massaging squeeze itself here. if your problem was at touching, take a step back to talking. if she doesnt feel comfortable with you touching her boobs (foreplay), go back to kissing. take a step back, then try again.
The problem is, you branched out to massaging: this has no place in this 'model'. IMPORTANT NOTE: some people might make massaging a part of the process, and it could be helpful as there is touching, but i dont put it as part of my escalation. HOWEVER, if it were part of your plan, you could go back to it when you get a kiss rejection. ie:
if your process is talking --> intimate touching --> massage ---> kissing -->... then massage would be fine, as you're NOT compromising, you're simply going back to an earlier point.

Oh, perhaps there's a little misunderstanding here, I was actually caressing her leg and inner thighs, moving my hand around. Intimate touch? I spend a few minutes doing this but didn't move to her pussy despite her not staving off my touch as I moved closer to it. I also touched her hair after, but at this point it was kind of a desperate attempt as she was hinting now she had to leave

 

[kalyan]

There was a misunderstanding- I thought you meant massaging her shoulders!
That should be fine, I'd place it under intimate touching. Don't be unfazed that she didn't kiss you, and keep on doing what you're doing.. Then go for the kiss again!

 

[Ergon]

Short approaches

Yeah, this stage of escalation was totally new for me...

On another news, just the next day after my "Reconnecting" post, I made two short but bold approaches.

The first one was with a cashier at a retail store. My first at a hired gun. I was paying for the pair of jeans I bought, exchanged formalities, and after 4 or 5 seconds I told her she had a great sense of style.

Her: Oh this is just something I put together fast in the morning[she was being modest, and seemed visibly flattered]
Me: I see
Her: Where are you from?
Me: X country, what about you?
Her: Oh I'm just from the US.
Me: But, your parents where from [country in Asia]?
Her: Oh yeah my parents are from ___
Me: Yeah, you look a bit ethnic.
Me: Hey why don't you write your number so we can grab something sometime…? [said this just as she finished handing me my bag]
Her: Oh, I… can't I'm working
Me: Ok [left the place with quick steps]

Overall, the compliment worked pretty well to grab her interest, but I didn't make good conversation. I also needed a more smooth way to ask her out/her number. The interaction ended quite awkwardly, but afterwards I felt like I couldn't recognize myself. I just did it without thinking much beforehand, and I felt bold, glad and silly afterwards.

I wanted to make more approaches and build momentum, but by the time I translated myself to where there were more people (the store was in a pretty empty area of the city) I began to feel really tired. I sat at a stairs and saw a really cute girl walking by, but I hesitated a lot to catch up with her and soon she was too far. Next was another girl walking by the same direction, slow and looking at her cellphone. I glance at her briefly and she glanced also. She walked on through some ramp and I intercepted her after said ramp. She was looking at her cellphone again, but I opened her sideways:

Hey, I thought you were cute and I had to say hi
Thank you [she blushed and smiled but continued walking]
What's your name?
[says name]

and she continued walking while I stood at the same place. I was feeling tired and couldn't actually think of something to make her stop, nor did I feel like matching her stride, so I let her go and took a different trail.

So even though these weren't very successful approaches, I was making headway solving AA and learning new forms of approach (first time hired gun, and first time catching up with a girl walking ahead of me).

This weekend, however, after two very busy and wearing weeks (unforeseen responsibilities, didn't meet any girls), I went out to an event on Friday, and to a bar today, and also tried to approach girls downtown but couldn't do even one. Due to several factors, I've felt as unconfident as I hadn't feel in a while, also tired and constantly irked. Most likely, stress due to responsibilities, money, and barely any sleep; also relapse into porn, plus hanging out this weekend with the only friend [kind of] I have in the city. He is kind of good hooking up with girls, although I don't know how much; he comments and implies many things,but some I really doubt. He's an asshole, something I was hoping I could learn a bit from him, but he also belittles me so much and is so irritating that I decided is not worth it, so I won't hang out with him anymore.

So, I'll be taking 10 days off to recover physically and mentally, and finish pending responsibilities, after which I'll schedule time to approach again
Just day game, three times per week, by myself, it's what has worked better for my lifestyle, apparently.

 

[Ergon]

A nice weekend
I had a couple of good nights recently. One you can check here: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=14864. The following night I was at the same spot for an event with my social circle. I met two girls but I deliberately didn't push the interactions, then I met a kind of feisty girl who surprisingly I managed to match. She seemed annoyed (not with me though) and didn't ignored me; so hornyness maybe? I considered inviting myself to hers, yet it would have to be at hers and what would happen to her female friend? Now I suspect I should have been just direct. Like a variation of "I don't know what you got going on for the rest of the night, but how about we head to your pad and kick back a while longer?". The window closed and she ignored me. Still, I had fun that night. I guess the place is already kind of my niche de facto (I have 0 LR so can't really say).

Girl from social circle + failed escalation
The next week I got an interesting social circle case. A girl close to me had been texting me for a week. We've known each other for four months; social circle but we were working together on a project too. By experience, I know that getting involved with a girl you'll have to work with or see for some fixed time can end in headaches (e.g. loss of respect and discontent with one another, in my case). For that and because she seemed very conservative, I didn't attempt anything besides lots of flirting, touching and sexual tension.

When our commitment ended we texted a bit almost every day for a week. She invited me to go dancing with her one day but I declined. I knew she had events going on over the weekend, so I invited her for some drinks near my place when she became available. We met and grabbed a drink. Some people were yelling their opinions of the debate, so I told her to go somewhere more quiet to keep talking and keep drinking (my place of course). I poured a glass of liquor for both and after about 15 minutes we started to kiss pretty heavily. Finished my glass and took her to my room (no words said). We laid on the bed, me on top of her and I clumsily tried to take off my shirt for a minute while making out with her. I kiss her face, ears and chest, then went for the pants but no luck. I dry humped her, kissed her belly and her tits but I never saw her pussy and wouldn't even let me touch it over her pants.

I couldn't overcome the heavy LMR despite using a lot of tips from Hector: https://www.girlschase.com/content/shatt ... on-passion.
I made a lot of mistakes. She said she was drunk and I responded that she hadn't drink that much. She told me she was virgin, even though she is several years older than me and didn't exactly acted like she was. She showed me her ring of chastity. At some point she mentioned she hadn't had many boyfriend and I said "good" (?). Even though I don't value low partner count nor chastity at all.

I kissed her in every place I could, I told her I wanted to be inside of her, that she turned me on, that she was sexy, I pointed at my dick, and whipped it out but she wouldn't touch it. While dry humping her there was a moment she seemed about to reach climax but I stopped before that. Don't know if that was a mistake or not. Around midnight she left because she had to go to work early the next day. She left smiling. We haven't text since then (four days now), and I don't really know what to do.

In one of Chase's articles he recommends for first date failed escalations, after a week of radio silence, to invite her next time to a public meeting or something with friends and girls flirting with you. I don't know if it applies in this case, having known each other that that long and through social circle, plus the friends I could invite are not very reliable (they could even not show up). I still have to decide

Hitting the bars
Yesterday I went to out to hit the bars. After I got a bit dizzy I approached a gorgeous girl (probably several years older than me). She seemed to be by herself but actually came with a group to celebrate a birthday. After a few minutes she excused herself.

Then I approached two girls sitting at a table next to me, with a situational opener. We chatted a bit but soon they also excused themselves. One seemed interested, but the other who said she have a boyfriend took her with her out as soon as the conversation died a little.

I moved to another bar and there there was the same group of people from the birthday party at the last bar. It made me feel a bit awkward. I chatted with a guy and two girls who were apparently high. I stuck with them even after the bar closed and went on a lift with them even though the girls didn't seemed to want to take me and the other guy. They invited us in reluctantly. After quite a while they kicked me out politely because I wouldn't do drugs with them. The dominant girl paid my lift, (I wanted to just walk home). I don't think it was that good of a night. I spent and drank too much and missed many opportunities to approach early in the night.

I also noticed that unless I'm in a place where people of my region/country is expected or the person is from there, asking where someone is from and saying where I'm from and talking to related stuff comes across as dull, out of place or lower value. Unfortunately I always rely on this when starting conversations, but I'll have to learn a way to substitute it and build my approaches around other topics. Also saying I'm new in town or the neighborhood where there's mostly locals seems to have a similar effect.

Daygame
I scheduled a sunday to do some street approaches, but due to rain and cold there were no girls at the malls nor downtown.

 

[Ergon]

Week report

Daygame
Approached a group of girls (3) at the bookstore. I made some conversation. I fist intended to talk to a girl browsing through some novels in French. Then her friends came and I simply asked if they were French. One of the girls was more interested that the other two, she was not the prettiest but she was still very pretty. I even got some compliance quickly by asking her to read a fragment of a difficult text. She was asking me questions. I asked her how long she was staying in the city (she was from a nearby city). She said a couple of days. Then instead of proposing her that we meet for some drinks or food, I let some seconds of silence and then asked her if she liked poetry. She just said no and then distanced herself. I rationalized it thinking that because her two friends were right there it would've been awkward to ask her out. I think they wouldn't had cared and I had to find out anyway.

Next day I asked directions to a pretty girl (which she gave very precisely and did help me). After class I asked a girl If I was in the right place to catch a certain bus. She didn't know but I kept making some conversation. It lasted about 2 minutes after which her bus came and she left.

Nightgame
Next day I went to the bar to dance. It was not a very successful night. Many girls rejected me quite rudely (more than usual). Maybe cause it was the first time I wore an edgy look. (scoop neck black t-shirt and ripped light skinny jeans). I met a very cute brunette who first didn't want to dance with me but did anyway. Then we went outside to talk a little bit and she had one leg on top of mine. I don't have car so I didn't know how to invite her somewhere intimate. I asked her where she lived but she wouldn't told me and ask me if I was looking for a ride. I didn't know what to say. I invited her to walk with me but instead she just said she wanted to dance more. We went inside and she dance with her body really close to mine, very intimate. Then whe danced normally; she would pull me to stay around her but eventually I drifted off. We talked on and off through the night, but then her friends were ready to leave. I invited her to an after party, at first she said yes but asked where. I said x area (where I live) and then she said no and just left.

Almost when the bar was about to close I approached girls with direct compliment opener. The first girl was not very interested (later I saw her with her boyfriend). The second girl was there with her girlfriend (she was lesbian and engaged).

Social circle
The girl I talked about last post was almost begging me to see her Tuesday, but I had midterms and I got sick with the flu. So I told her I would see her Thursday. On Thursday I was still sick, so I invited her to have dinner on Friday. She said she had to work till late on Friday and then asked me If I had plans for Saturday. I told her I would just stay home Saturday. On Saturday I asked her "what kind of trouble are you up to" She said had bake cookies etc.

"Glad to know I'm not the only one spending the weekend peacefully. I'm about to watch a movie. Come over"

She then said thanks but that she was going to grab drinks with her roommate. I guess this means she lost all attraction for me.

Misc
Oh well. Pretty dry week but still productive. I upgraded my wardrobe and planning to take MMA classes this Sundays since I found a place to learn. I've always had chickened out from fights cause I don't know how to fight and I've always been very skinny. Have to change that. Maybe it helps me be less of a nice guy.

 

[Ergon]

So, guess I'm the perfect example of how self-indulgent one can become. For a time it seemed I was doing pretty well, but these past weeks… I haven't even gone out.

It could be that school sucks out all of my energy. Sometimes I hate my career because it leaves me no time for anything; only time for science. On the other hand I'm really good at it, and it can give me a comfortable living in the future.

The other good news is that I'm still going to the gym. Bought a few new items for my wardrobe and will finally get a car.

When I started this journal, around March, my main goals was to get my first lay (ever) before the end of the year. There's one month left and it seems unlikely, but that doesn't mean I will stop trying.

In two weeks I'll have time again. And even if have to start the newbie from scratch, I'll work my way up to at least a LR-. Having said that, to keep my eye on the ball, I won't post again in the forum until that happens.

Best of luck,
Ergon