How Do You Guys Do Monogamy?

[Regal Tiger]

Honestly dude, if you need to meditate in order to remain focused on your woman, her days are numbered..

Overall I agree, but I didn't mean meditate on her but moreso on myself if that makes sense?

I've never been one to try and do the transmuting energies thing that others have talked about. But I would assume (again I don't know much about it) a little bit of that happened


edit: I guess a good way to put it is that I've decided that while I work towards things from ground zero I'll stick with the relationship and try my best to focus on other things in the mean time

 

[Chase]

@Regal Tiger,

There are chicks you can bang forever and never get tired of (sexual chemistry).

Then there are chicks you bang for a while and don’t really have much drive to bang anymore.

If you ask me, when you find yourself with a #2 girl, it’s time to hit the exit.

There’s a lot you can power through, but a woman not turning you on isn’t really one of them.

Chase

 

[Skills]

@Regal Tiger,

There are chicks you can bang forever and never get tired of (sexual chemistry).

I will respectfully disagree, once you reach over certain amount of lays you can have the biggest chemistry with the hottest 10 in the world, and you will hit the Coolidge.... Would love to hear example of otherwise...

 

[Chase]

I will respectfully disagree, once you reach over certain amount of lays you can have the biggest chemistry with the hottest 10 in the world, and you will hit the Coolidge.... Would love to hear example of otherwise...

It’s hedonic adaptation:

Hedonic treadmill - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Happens regardless of hotness level, and yes, general “sexual chemistry” I guess would be included too. I should’ve picked a better term.

It’s not lay count. There are dudes out there with 1 lay who get sick of their wives and stop fucking them. There’s a whole board on Reddit on dead bedrooms filled with people in sexless marriages where they haven’t fucked in years or decades.

Sex drive is conquest/reconquest. It’s why you can fuck the shit out of a new girl all weekend and still not have enough but a chick you’ve been seeing six months once or twice in a weekend is more than enough. But also why when you fuck an ex you fuck like bunnies for a while (then once you feel like you’ve “got her” the sex drops off and you get bored again).

The actual recipe for maintaining sexual attraction long-term is having a woman who is at the edge of your ability to retain. Frequently frustrating/irritating, pushing you to the point of being like “Fuck this, why am I putting up with this chick? I’m outta here!” and then she makes it up to you, get sweet and sexy again, and you fuck like bunnies for a while.

Then at some point you start to get bored (maybe she’s too sweet for too long), desire to fuck her falls, until she gets really frustrating again, pisses you off, makes you decide “That’s it, this time I am ditching her!”, then she gets sweet again and makes it back up to you and you fuck like bunnies again.

That’s why I see all these dudes being like “I just want a drama-free relationship” and I shake my head and go, “It’s gonna be nice and calm and also BORING AS FUCK and you’re gonna have to be cheating or swinging or running an oLTR.” And that’s always how it is.

Every one of my pals with triple digit lays who’s married now and still fucks his wife a lot after 10+ years has one of these chicks who drives him crazy sometimes and makes him want to divorce her then gets sweet and ropes him back in and they fuck a whole bunch again.

Maybe than “sexual chemistry” we’d call it “relationship push-pull” or something.

Chase

 

[topcat]

The actual recipe for maintaining sexual attraction long-term is having a woman who is at the edge of your ability to retain. Frequently frustrating/irritating, pushing you to the point of being like “Fuck this, why am I putting up with this chick? I’m outta here!” and then she makes it up to you, get sweet and sexy again, and you fuck like bunnies for a while.

Sums up the type of women to satisfy my “absolute abundance” needs.

How do you find & screen for such women on the outset? It’s been hit and miss/random that i find these types (they tend to find me)

 

[Chase]

Sums up the type of women to satisfy my “absolute abundance” needs.

How do you find & screen for such women on the outset? It’s been hit and miss/random that i find these types (they tend to find me)

I don’t think you can screen them pre-sex. It really comes down to their behavior post-sex.

IME the ones who end up being “edge of your ability” to retain give you pushback post-sex about seeing you. “I don’t think I can keep seeing you,” “I don’t think this has a future,” “This isn’t going to be anything serious,” etc.

Basically you want girls who are looking at you saying, “Hmm, I don’t know if this guy is exactly The One for me,” because those are the girls you end up having to re-conquer again and again.

When you get the girl who is always like “Yes, you are it; you are MY ‘The One’!” and she never wavers in that, the challenge just drains out of the relationship and it becomes this placid thing.

Every man says he wants peace and placidity in his relationships. But when you really get that, you also have less and less interest in shagging the chick over time, because you’ve already got her and she isn’t going anywhere.

Chase

 

[Skills]

It’s hedonic adaptation:

Hedonic treadmill - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Happens regardless of hotness level, and yes, general “sexual chemistry” I guess would be included too. I should’ve picked a better term.

It’s not lay count. There are dudes out there with 1 lay who get sick of their wives and stop fucking them. There’s a whole board on Reddit on dead bedrooms filled with people in sexless marriages where they haven’t fucked in years or decades.

Sex drive is conquest/reconquest. It’s why you can fuck the shit out of a new girl all weekend and still not have enough but a chick you’ve been seeing six months once or twice in a weekend is more than enough. But also why when you fuck an ex you fuck like bunnies for a while (then once you feel like you’ve “got her” the sex drops off and you get bored again).

The actual recipe for maintaining sexual attraction long-term is having a woman who is at the edge of your ability to retain. Frequently frustrating/irritating, pushing you to the point of being like “Fuck this, why am I putting up with this chick? I’m outta here!” and then she makes it up to you, get sweet and sexy again, and you fuck like bunnies for a while.

Then at some point you start to get bored (maybe she’s too sweet for too long), desire to fuck her falls, until she gets really frustrating again, pisses you off, makes you decide “That’s it, this time I am ditching her!”, then she gets sweet again and makes it back up to you and you fuck like bunnies again.

That’s why I see all these dudes being like “I just want a drama-free relationship” and I shake my head and go, “It’s gonna be nice and calm and also BORING AS FUCK and you’re gonna have to be cheating or swinging or running an oLTR.” And that’s always how it is.

Every one of my pals with triple digit lays who’s married now and still fucks his wife a lot after 10+ years has one of these chicks who drives him crazy sometimes and makes him want to divorce her then gets sweet and ropes him back in and they fuck a whole bunch again.

Maybe than “sexual chemistry” we’d call it “relationship push-pull” or soyrdmething.

Chase

Yes ad me to the list... But you are mixing divorce and break up with monogamy.... I seen former Playboys staying with girl and marriage, but no monogamous

 

[ChrisVirtue]

One of the things I think is important that I've been considering recently is the difference between a monogamous (sexual) commitment and a commitment to oneself to have an abundance of relationships.

The commitment to your own abundance NEEDS to come before the monogamous sexual commitment to the other.

So, for a seducer who commits to only having sex with one woman, this means still being social, going out, meeting new people often, having other relationships and having boundaries with your monogamous woman, so that you have the power to walkaway if the relationship is pulling you down rather than empowering you.

I think most women do this well because they often maintain orbiters and friends while many men get in a relationship and go "well, I've now solved my love life so I have no need to be social".

For instance alex hormozi said something similar "by marrying my wife I've now got my love life solved so I can spend more time focusing on my business".


I think seeking to fully "solve" a core area of your life like that is a foolish pursuit because it's an AREA (infinite scope) not a PROJECT (finite completion).

You can always get better at social skills/influence, just as you can always get healthier/more in shape (fitness) always develop more control over your mind (meditation) and always make more money/generate more value in a marketplace/industry (wealth).



Many guys I know I've seen get into a relationship and then become reclusive. I did this as well. And I think for a lot of guys it's because they went into "dating" with a subconscious goal of "I'm only improving myself and my social skills UNTIL I find a girlfriend I deem good enough". For me I DEFINITELY did not have this goal CONSCIOUSLY, but subconsciously it must be true that I was secretly pursuing it.


The real benefit of learning pick up is the SELF-GROWTH (for instance from progressing from weak beta to a powerful social leader).


As a man, we need to have a commitment to ourselves that is prioritized over a commitment of where our dick goes.


Monogamy is a social construct that most women have been hypnotized into seeing no other long term life path. If a woman is a genuinely empowering force in your life (pulling you towards your actual wants & needs), then MONOGAMY is something you CAN give her. BUT THAT IS COMPLETELY SEPARATE FROM ALLOWING YOUR SOCIAL SKILLS TO DEGRADE.

There is no "one true relationship". We are simply humans who can empower or disempower others and you can have multiple empowering relationships with other humans (friendships, business, romantic) OR multiple disempowering relationships.


A true healthy man only allows empowering relationships to occur in his life. Anyone disempowering gets blocked/limited by their boundaries and screening.

 

[TomInHo]

I don’t think you can screen them pre-sex. It really comes down to their behavior post-sex.

IME the ones who end up being “edge of your ability” to retain give you pushback post-sex about seeing you. “I don’t think I can keep seeing you,” “I don’t think this has a future,” “This isn’t going to be anything serious,” etc.

IME this was not the case for me

When I convert girls that were skeptical or "edge of my ability" my desire to fuck other women never went away. In fact when they get annoying I want to fuck other women MORE

Basically you want girls who are looking at you saying, “Hmm, I don’t know if this guy is exactly The One for me,” because those are the girls you end up having to re-conquer again and again.

Ye... I'll pass on that

When you get the girl who is always like “Yes, you are it; you are MY ‘The One’!” and she never wavers in that, the challenge just drains out of the relationship and it becomes this placid thing.

Not IME

I've had girls like that and we still had good sexual chemistry. But I still wanted to fuck other women because I like variety and the other girls will usually have something my favorite doesn't

Also noticed that when I shagged other girls my drive for my main stays in tact or sometimes goes up. In a weird way me fucking other chicks makes me value her more because I can visibly see the contrast in the value she brings to my life compared to other girls

Every man says he wants peace and placidity in his relationships. But when you really get that, you also have less and less interest in shagging the chick over time, because you’ve already got her and she isn’t going anywhere.

Well, I can always shag other chicks

I rather have a peaceful and sexual relationship with one girl and some variety with others. Guess I have Madonna/Whore or something

But having a main chick I always have to re-conquer sounds miserable to me. Been there done that

Not saying the way I go about things is the best or superior but it seems to work for me. I think every man needs to sit down and really think about what he wants out of his relationship(s) in relation to his own values and personality

You are the leader and you can design your love life however you feel is best, even if it doesn't neatly fit into what is traditionally expected of you

 

[Chase]

Yes ad me to the list... But you are mixing divorce and break up with monogamy.... I seen former Playboys staying with girl and marriage, but no monogamous

I didn't say not taking other girls!

Regal Tiger was asking about how to not lose your sex drive for the chick...

IME this was not the case for me

When I convert girls that were skeptical or "edge of my ability" my desire to fuck other women never went away. In fact when they get annoying I want to fuck other women MORE

Again, not responding to "how do I make myself not want to fuck other girls."

I don't think @Regal Tiger even asked that.

Ye... I'll pass on that

As noted, other options are swingers, oLTR, open marriage, etc.

Pick what suits you best.

Not IME

I've had girls like that and we still had good sexual chemistry. But I still wanted to fuck other women because I like variety and the other girls will usually have something my favorite doesn't

Also noticed that when I shagged other girls my drive for my main stays in tact or sometimes goes up. In a weird way me fucking other chicks makes me value her more because I can visibly see the contrast in the value she brings to my life compared to other girls

Right. When you fuck other girls it re-interests you in sex with your main chick.

It's why oLTRs, open marriages, swinging, etc. work.

OP specifically says he wants to do "monogamy" but retain his sex drive for his chick.

Well, I can always shag other chicks

I rather have a peaceful and sexual relationship with one girl and some variety with others. Guess I have Madonna/Whore or something

Doesn't help answer the question the thread is about.

But having a main chick I always have to re-conquer sounds miserable to me. Been there done that

Aggravation + passion vs. placidity + boredom... those are the choices if you're doing monogamy.

Not saying the way I go about things is the best or superior but it seems to work for me. I think every man needs to sit down and really think about what he wants out of his relationship(s) in relation to his own values and personality

You are the leader and you can design your love life however you feel is best, even if it doesn't neatly fit into what is traditionally expected of you

Yep. To recap:

1. You can do monogamy "aggravating girl that regularly injects passion / sex drive into relationship"
   
   
2. You can do monogamy "peaceful girl but you get bored and don't want to fuck her anymore"
   
   
3. Or you can do some variant of non-monogamy (one-sided monogamy, "monogamy" + cheating, swinging, oLTR, open marriage, etc.)

Those are the choices.

Maybe there are people out there doing "my chick and I never argue, we're completely monogamous, and we still have an enormous sex drive for each other after N years being together" but it's extremely rare IME and you'd need to look at specifics of the relationship to figure out what's keeping the sex drive up.

Chase

 

[Skills]

I didn't say not taking other girls!

Regal Tiger was asking about how to not lose your sex drive for the chick...

Agree, but being monogamous context... My point is i personally have not yet seen that from former players without cheating is an idealistic fantasy... But open minded to find out real honest cases...

Again, not responding to "how do I make myself not want to fuck other girls."

I don't think @Regal Tiger even asked that.

Chase is the title of the post? How you guys do monogamy... Most former players cheat... and think is monogamy...

As noted, other options are swingers, oLTR, open marriage, etc.

Pick what suits you best.

Of course

Right. When you fuck other girls it re-interests you in sex with your main chick.

Not always it can affect it too due to nre to new girl

It's why oLTRs, open marriages, swinging, etc. work.

Work for some backfire with others IMHO there is no really perfect set up..i try them all...

OP specifically says he wants to do "monogamy" but retain his sex drive for his chick.



Doesn't help answer the question the thread is about.

Agree

Aggravation + passion vs. placidity + boredom... those are the choices if you're doing monogamy

Agree

Yep. To recap:

1. You can do monogamy "aggravating girl that regularly injects passion / sex drive into relationships

Agree... Op needs to be clear is how you guys do monogamy... The answer is the above, but high chance of cheating nulling monogamy

 

[TomInHo]

@Chase thanks for the very detailed response

I didn't say not taking other girls!

Regal Tiger was asking about how to not lose your sex drive for the chick...

Again, not responding to "how do I make myself not want to fuck other girls."

I don't think @Regal Tiger even asked that.

When I read the original post it did seem like @Regal Tiger is looking for solutions that don't require taking other girls a.k.a cheating

My sex drive is drying up more and more everyday and I just want some new pussy lol

But I won't cheat cuz then I wouldn't be able to use one of my fun one liners about [now almost] never being monogamous but never cheating

So yeah... What can I do to drive away the demons/delusions[?] As well as increase my sex drive for my girlfriend?

His main goal seems to be for him to remain faithful to his girl. To not fuck other women while retaining his sex drive for his chick

Right. When you fuck other girls it re-interests you in sex with your main chick.

It's why oLTRs, open marriages, swinging, etc. work.

Yes and no

Because the girl I had the best sexual chemistry with in a relationship was ironically not aggravating. The sex with her was incredible for a long time and we rarely had any drama

But I wasn't exclusive to her and was still fucking other girls and I can not remember ever being sexually bored with her or not wanting to fuck her. I just wanted to fuck other girls too

Now here is something I find interesting tho

Aggravation + passion vs. placidity + boredom... those are the choices if you're doing monogamy.

Again just stating my experience here.

But the one time I actually tried monogamy, it was with a woman that sometimes aggravated me.

Unlike what you say about this "aggravating girl that regularly injects passion / sex drive into relationship". I did not gain sexual attraction to her when she aggravated me. I actually lost it

She was annoying me so much I didn't want to fuck her.

And when I did fuck her I was just over it and sometimes felt disgusted. I was giving her "husband sex" i guess lol. Love making devoid of any passion

Maybe you and your friends have different experiences but when I need to "re-conquer a woman" I get irritated and want to stop fucking her. I would rather spend my time with someone sweet and compliant because for some weird reason that just turns me on

BUT funny thing is.....

When we broke up and I fucked other girls my sex drive for that aggravating girl magically returned lol

Yep. To recap:

1. You can do monogamy
   
   
2. You can do monogamy "peaceful girl but you get bored and don't want to fuck her anymore"
   
   
3. Or you can do some variant of non-monogamy (one-sided monogamy, "monogamy" + cheating, swinging, oLTR, open marriage, etc.)

So that experience taught me that my personal recap could be...

1. You can do monogamy "aggravating girl and get so annoyed with her you want to fuck someone else"
   
   
2. You can do monogamy "peaceful girl but you get bored and don't want to fuck her anymore but still like her as a person"
   
   
3. Or you can do some variant of non-monogamy (one-sided monogamy, "monogamy" + cheating, swinging, oLTR, open marriage, etc.)... with whatever girl turns you on the most

All arrows point to eventually I'm gonna fuck someone else regardless so I've just embraced it

This is the harsh truth but I truly believe if you fuck a bunch of girls you are lying to yourself that you can ever truly be monogamous.

Once you taste abundance it's hard to go back to fucking one woman no matter how amazing or aggravating she is. Regardless who you pick, the drive to fuck someone else will get so strong it will be hard to resist

Sure, you may be able to put it off for a while but being forever faithful to one girl for the rest of your life just doesn't seem realistic

Especially once you've become skilled with women and can sex with someone new without tons of effort

Maybe there are people out there doing "my chick and I never argue, we're completely monogamous, and we still have an enormous sex drive for each other after N years being together" but it's extremely rare IME and you'd need to look at specifics of the relationship to figure out what's keeping the sex drive up.

I agree there

Also think tho "my chick and I argue all the time, we're completely monogamous, and we still have an enormous sex drive for each other after N years being together" is not realistic as well long term

One person is eventually going to get so irritaed they will exit the relationship

Also I know couples like the above that are together but aren't monogamous either. Or some even completely stopped having sex with each other but stayed together for logistical reasons

But tbh I don't really know anything. Just stating what I've observed with myself and others, so could be completely wrong

I just don't think @Regal Tiger being both faithful and sexually satisfied with only one woman without boredom or loss of sex drive for her is realistic forever

 

[Chase]

Hey man,

Yes and no

Because the girl I had the best sexual chemistry with in a relationship was ironically not aggravating. The sex with her was incredible for a long time and we rarely had any drama

But I wasn't exclusive to her and was still fucking other girls and I can not remember ever being sexually bored with her or not wanting to fuck her. I just wanted to fuck other girls too

Now here is something I find interesting tho

Yeah, that's how any kind of non-monogamy works basically.

The other women keep your testosterone levels & sex drive up.

Then assuming your main is still sufficiently attractive to you / sexy / into sex you channel some of that back into her.

Again just stating my experience here.

But the one time I actually tried monogamy, it was with a woman that sometimes aggravated me.

Unlike what you say about this "aggravating girl that regularly injects passion / sex drive into relationship". I did not gain sexual attraction to her when she aggravated me. I actually lost it

She was annoying me so much I didn't want to fuck her.

And when I did fuck her I was just over it and sometimes felt disgusted. I was giving her "husband sex" i guess lol. Love making devoid of any passion

Maybe you and your friends have different experiences but when I need to "re-conquer a woman" I get irritated and want to stop fucking her. I would rather spend my time with someone sweet and compliant because for some weird reason that just turns me on

BUT funny thing is.....

When we broke up and I fucked other girls my sex drive for that aggravating girl magically returned lol

lol

Well, yeah, the formula for aggravation doing that is

"Girl aggravates you but then turns it sweet again and you find yourself going 'Man, this girl is actually a little special, ain't she?'"

If the second part isn't happening (and you're just saying "She isn't worth this..." then, later: "Well she's nice again but she's still not worth all this, goddamn") she isn't high level enough for you to be worth tolerating the level of aggravation she causes. You won't get the sex drive boost; you will just lose it because you're perpetually annoyed.

There has to be a balance of her being desirable enough of a girlfriend + apologetic enough post-drama that it offsets whatever level of / frequency of drama. Elsewise she is just a shitty girlfriend where the cost for maintaining her is too high and you are going to want to get rid of her.

So that experience taught me that my personal recap could be...

1. You can do monogamy "aggravating girl and get so annoyed with her you want to fuck someone else"
   
   
2. You can do monogamy "peaceful girl but you get bored and don't want to fuck her anymore but still like her as a person"
   
   
3. Or you can do some variant of non-monogamy (one-sided monogamy, "monogamy" + cheating, swinging, oLTR, open marriage, etc.)... with whatever girl turns you on the most

All arrows point to eventually I'm gonna fuck someone else regardless so I've just embraced it

This is the harsh truth but I truly believe if you fuck a bunch of girls you are lying to yourself that you can ever truly be monogamous.

Once you taste abundance it's hard to go back to fucking one woman no matter how amazing or aggravating she is. Regardless who you pick, the drive to fuck someone else will get so strong it will be hard to resist

Sure, you may be able to put it off for a while but being forever faithful to one girl for the rest of your life just doesn't seem realistic

Especially once you've become skilled with women and can sex with someone new without tons of effort

Agreed re: "can you ever be totally monogamous forever after you've fucked a bunch of chicks?"

Well, you are going to take other chicks... that is just how it goes.

I agree there

Also think tho "my chick and I argue all the time, we're completely monogamous, and we still have an enormous sex drive for each other after N years being together" is not realistic as well long term

One person is eventually going to get so irritaed they will exit the relationship

I know 3 playboys with high notch counts who have chicks they have 4+ kids with and have been with their women for 12+ years, still fucking them a lot and still into their chicks.

They do not argue "all" the time but all their chicks push them on stuff and at times have caused them so much aggravation they would 100% have been out of there in a flash if not for the kids.

(I also know a playboy in a settled down relationship with kids who was in a sexless marriage and getting 100% of his needs met through cheating... he even had a second fiancée for a while while trying to divorce his wife but went back to her when he lost the custody battle because he didn't want to lose his kids. No idea whether he's back to banging the wife now because when you ask him he just laughs it off and evades the question, lol)

Maybe the asterisk on there if you are going for 10+ years is "gotta be kids involved or you are just not going to bother past a certain point."

Makes sense biologically... we are not wired to remain long-term with one woman who fails to produce offspring for us... there's wiring in there that is probably saying, "Keep moving, this womb is barren, stop wasting good seed on this chick", especially if you have a lot of options.

Also I know couples like the above that are together but aren't monogamous either. Or some even completely stopped having sex with each other but stayed together for logistical reasons

Sure.

But tbh I don't really know anything. Just stating what I've observed with myself and others, so could be completely wrong

I just don't think @Regal Tiger being both faithful and sexually satisfied with only one woman without boredom or loss of sex drive for her is realistic forever

Totally faithful forever?

Yeah I don't know about that.

But if he wants to keep his sex drive up for his chick, well, he's got the strategies here.

Chase

 

[JasonH]

It’s hedonic adaptation:

Hedonic treadmill - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Happens regardless of hotness level, and yes, general “sexual chemistry” I guess would be included too. I should’ve picked a better term.

It’s not lay count. There are dudes out there with 1 lay who get sick of their wives and stop fucking them. There’s a whole board on Reddit on dead bedrooms filled with people in sexless marriages where they haven’t fucked in years or decades.

Sex drive is conquest/reconquest. It’s why you can fuck the shit out of a new girl all weekend and still not have enough but a chick you’ve been seeing six months once or twice in a weekend is more than enough. But also why when you fuck an ex you fuck like bunnies for a while (then once you feel like you’ve “got her” the sex drops off and you get bored again).

The actual recipe for maintaining sexual attraction long-term is having a woman who is at the edge of your ability to retain. Frequently frustrating/irritating, pushing you to the point of being like “Fuck this, why am I putting up with this chick? I’m outta here!” and then she makes it up to you, get sweet and sexy again, and you fuck like bunnies for a while.

Then at some point you start to get bored (maybe she’s too sweet for too long), desire to fuck her falls, until she gets really frustrating again, pisses you off, makes you decide “That’s it, this time I am ditching her!”, then she gets sweet again and makes it back up to you and you fuck like bunnies again.

That’s why I see all these dudes being like “I just want a drama-free relationship” and I shake my head and go, “It’s gonna be nice and calm and also BORING AS FUCK and you’re gonna have to be cheating or swinging or running an oLTR.” And that’s always how it is.

Every one of my pals with triple digit lays who’s married now and still fucks his wife a lot after 10+ years has one of these chicks who drives him crazy sometimes and makes him want to divorce her then gets sweet and ropes him back in and they fuck a whole bunch again.

Maybe than “sexual chemistry” we’d call it “relationship push-pull” or something.

Chase

Hi @Chase ,
What's the similar deep motivation from the woman's POV? because women don't have that conquest drive like us men do. What keeps her excited and horny for us long-term years on into a relationship?

I've seen women I know stay in relationships with their boyfriends, you can tell their a bit bored, and their boyfriends are putting more effort into the relationship. Perhaps they have tamed him but they still see future potential (money, house, travel) with their boyfriends.