Socializing How to defend yourself against extremely witty, fast, “talk-over” guys in SOCIAL CIRCLE

[Kaida]

Every so often I meet certain guys that I simply cannot compete with on comebacks. Even though I’m a decently witty guy. (Edit: This is a social circle / group setting with girls around.)

These dudes talk loudly over you, come up with clever wisecracks out of thin air, and talk incredibly fast so when you try and talk back slowly you already look overwhelmed

These guys are almost always short / skinny (and almost always black too… weird). I’m assuming that instead of training and getting physically capable, these guys use their wit as the way they get dominance over people. Their ability to wisecrack is the axe they’ve been sharpening all their life. I really think these guys just havent gotten punched in the face enough.

And it works extremely well. The things they say are actually funny most of the time, so it gets everybody on their side very quickly. Their entire strength comes from the fact that they have a reputation as the funny guy and everyone loves them, so it makes them incredibly audacious even if you look physically imposing like me.

Sometimes if someone like this is targeting me, they do a few small pings and quickly back off with something like “Haha I’m sorry don’t hurt me big boy”.

Once they realize I have social grace and wont punch them in the face just cuz of an insult, they get bolder and start making more wisecracks. I’ve noticed that the insults are usually aimed at devaluing my physical presence (i.e gymrat jokes, etc)

How do I beat these guys, especially when theres other people around? Their reputation and their ability to make the people around them laugh is their biggest strength.

I can remain poker faced all I want to their jokes, but if everyone else is laughing and I have nothing else of equal wit to say, I already look like I lost.



Side note: Imagine being physically imposing and also having high level verbal wit like Andrew Tate… you’d literally be unfuckwithable.

 

[Skills]

Every so often I meet certain guys that I simply cannot compete with on comebacks. Even though I’m a decently witty guy.

These dudes talk loudly over you, come up with clever wisecracks out of thin air, and talk incredibly fast so when you try and talk back slowly you already look overwhelmed

These guys are almost always short / skinny (and almost always black too… weird). I’m assuming that instead of training and getting physically capable, these guys use their wit as the way they get dominance over people. Their ability to wisecrack is the axe they’ve been sharpening all their life. I really think these guys just havent gotten punched in the face enough.

And it works extremely well. The things they say are actually funny most of the time, so it gets everybody on their side very quickly. Their entire strength comes from the fact that they have a reputation as the funny guy and everyone loves them, so it makes them incredibly audacious even if you look physically imposing like me.

Sometimes if someone like this is targeting me, they do a few small pings and quickly back off with something like “Haha I’m sorry don’t hurt me big boy”.

Once they realize I have social grace and wont punch them in the face just cuz of an insult, they get bolder and start making more wisecracks. I’ve noticed that the insults are usually aimed at devaluing my physical presence (i.e gymrat jokes, etc)

How do I beat these guys, especially when theres other people around? Their reputation and their ability to make the people around them laugh is their biggest strength.

I can remain poker faced all I want to their jokes, but if everyone else is laughing and I have nothing else of equal wit to say, I already look like I lost.



Side note: Imagine being physically imposing and also having high level verbal wit like Andrew Tate… you’d literally be unfuckwithable.

Some guys you just won't be able to.. . Like if me and you go at it, no way...as anything else the more you do the better, but for seduction don't see the point...

 

[West_Indian_Archie]

What's the context?

Speaking as an American..

This is typical Black/Brown bar/club/party situation. Like every time I go out.. The more time you spend in "urban" circles the more you'll recognize the jokers and see the jokes coming. Taking in a steady diet of Black comedy, Black Twitter, and other stuff like that will help. But it won't substitute from being in the culture.

My go to's

1) Getting AMOG'd when you're with a girl?

Oh man you got jokes! But how come you're not hitting on the girl?

C'mon do better.

Then shift to her.

How's he doing sweety? Is he making you wet?

And keeping exposing his schtick as a way for him to pickup girls. Jokingly, of course.

But the more you make the invisible visible, the harder it is for Game Chappelle to keep going trying to get at your target.

2) You're in a big group and he's stealing spotlight.

Same process with the AMOG scenario.

Oh you got jokes.
Crack on the pretty girl.
Crack on the big dude.

What's different here is that you're directing the action.

Socially savvy chicks will catch on, if it's important to catch on.

Option 2 - Usually a little side conversation and eye coding with the target works if that's your aim.

If you want to be king of the hill, the only move is to practice.

 

[Kaida]

Some guys you just won't be able to.. . Like if me and you go at it, no way...as anything else the more you do the better, but for seduction don't see the point...

The question is more of how to defend against this when they’re targeting me.

I’m not really trying to compete on the aspect of whos wittier. I just want to be able to shut them down so I retain the respect of everyone watching. You feel me?

When I get into confrontations with guys like this I get completely lost in what to do. Especially since it seems everyone is laughing at what they say

 

[Skills]

The question is more of how to defend against this when they’re targeting me.

I’m not really trying to compete on the aspect of whos wittier. I just want to be able to shut them down so I retain the respect of everyone watching. You feel me?

When I get into confrontations with guys like this I get completely lost in what to do. Especially since it seems everyone is laughing at what they say

Give samples

 

[Warped Mindless]

Side note: Imagine being physically imposing and also having high level verbal wit like Andrew Tate… you’d literally be unfuckwithable.

I’m going to write a post dealing with the rest of your questions later but I wanted to address the part I quoted…

my buddy is JACKED and a really decent stand up comedian. Lots of wit, charm, and seduction skills. He still gets dudes who wants to verbally spar with him and sometimes, I matter how jacked and witty you are, those other guys will be more witty and not afraid to take verbal stabs at you.

 

[Warped Mindless]

If you are in the club why are you even giving these dudes the time of day?

“cool bro.” And then take the girls hand and physically turn her away from him or you yourself turn away from him and out your attention back on the girl.

Stop trying to “compete” with these dudes and simply refuse to acknowledge their existence.

 

[Kaida]

Give samples

Back when I was in track there was this short skinny black guy with a great wit that everyone loved. He was also on the team for years before me so everyone liked him.

He didnt like me for some reason, so he’d keep taking stabs at me (I was also a lot more socially uncalibrated then so I’m sure I came off as I “didnt get it” sometimes. Now I’m able to make friends with people like this though)

Example:

Him: Get your big body muscle minion ass out of here

*shows everyone this picture*

(I’m not even that big, massive exaggeration)

Everyone: *Laughing*

Me: *Poker Face* That shit was ass

Him: Your dreads are ass, they look like a mop on ur head, uglahh

————————————————————

When I do the poker face thing it seems to effect some people in the audience. But overall I still just look like a guy who cant compete.

I do have above average wit and combacks I can use against most people, but against guys like this I’m eventually going to

 

[Kaida]

If you are in the club why are you even giving these dudes the time of day?

“cool bro.” And then take the girls hand and physically turn her away from him or you yourself turn away from him and out your attention back on the girl.

Stop trying to “compete” with these dudes and simply refuse to acknowledge their existence.

Its school / social circle settings. If it was a place like the club or another cold approach spot I would do exactly as you said

 

[kinsej9010]

Back when I was in track there was this short skinny black guy with a great wit that everyone loved. He was also on the team for years before me so everyone liked him.

He didnt like me for some reason, so he’d keep taking stabs at me (I was also a lot more socially uncalibrated then so I’m sure I came off as I “didnt get it” sometimes. Now I’m able to make friends with people like this though)

Example:

Him: Get your big body muscle minion ass out of here

*shows everyone this picture*

(I’m not even that big, massive exaggeration)

Everyone: *Laughing*

Me: *Poker Face* That shit was ass

Him: Your dreads are ass, they look like a mop on ur head, uglahh

————————————————————

When I do the poker face thing it seems to effect some people in the audience. But overall I still just look like a guy who cant compete.

I do have above average wit and combacks I can use against most people, but against guys like this I’m eventually going to

"Keep on talkin and you bout to get yo ass beat by a ugly ass minion (while smiling)"

I recently experienced this at a poker table. I was winning and the chip leader and this older guy obviously was hating. On one of the hands, I 'chickened out' and folded after someone bet. The next card come up and I would've hit a straight. (It was a big pot),

I loudly claim 'ah fuck'. The guy starts to 'go in' on me.

"Look at this chicken that can't even bet. BAWK BAWK."
I just laugh and say 'keep on talking shit and this chicken gonna take all your chips and bawk bawk you the fuck out the table'.
And he just kinda weakly said man don't take my chips.

But this kind of worked because he knew I was a good player (obviously cause I was the chip leader) and it got into his head.

Of course these things are all situational but it helps to have a reputation as someone that's good at X and then comeback with a witty statement. That way the person who's teasing you looks like a child trying to take down someone that's a league above you.

Like a college basketball player talking shit to a NBA veteran. People watching would be entertained but also know there's no chance.

 

[Kaida]

"Keep on talkin and you bout to get yo ass beat by a ugly ass minion (while smiling)"

I recently experienced this at a poker table. I was winning and the chip leader and this older guy obviously was hating. On one of the hands, I 'chickened out' and folded after someone bet. The next card come up and I would've hit a straight. (It was a big pot),

I loudly claim 'ah fuck'. The guy starts to 'go in' on me.

"Look at this chicken that can't even bet. BAWK BAWK."
I just laugh and say 'keep on talking shit and this chicken gonna take all your chips and bawk bawk you the fuck out the table'.
And he just kinda weakly said man don't take my chips.

But this kind of worked because he knew I was a good player (obviously cause I was the chip leader) and it got into his head.

Of course these things are all situational but it helps to have a reputation as someone that's good at X and then comeback with a witty statement. That way the person who's teasing you looks like a child trying to take down someone that's a league above you.

Like a college basketball player talking shit to a NBA veteran. People watching would be entertained but also know there's no chance.

I dunno. It worked in your context because you don’t really know those people and likely don’t see them as often.

But in a social circle like mine I think I’d just get the reputation as a meathead who just throws around threats instead of engaging them verbally.

Eventually someone is going to test me on those threats, and so I’m either going to have to beat that guy up or have my threats mean absolutely nothing anymore.

 

[Gladiator]

Stop talking to them.

Manosphere has made it incredibly hard for guys by expecting them to be non-reactive, acting cool, unfazed etc

IMO, it's all BS.

If I don't like someone's behavior or someone in general, I don't talk to them and completely ignore them. It may come across rude but if he talks to me in a group setting, I can simply look through him without uttering a word or even making a tiny facial expression. I don't give them any time of my day. You don't have to be liked by everyone and you don't need everyone's approval. You maybe seen as someone uncool, gets easily butt hurt etc but who cares? Only you cos what matters to you is important than what other people think.

Even if someone calls you out for that or even if that person again tries to poke you to get your reaction, just talk to someone else. Don't invite him to parties that you host, don't greet him when you meet, don't make eye contact with him, don't text him, if someone brings up him in a discussion, don't say anything, if he makes fun of someone else and it's funny, don't laugh at that - you're communicating that you don't like that behavior. Let others laugh, you have a straight face.

Some guys realize their behavior and they start being nice to you and you give them equal or lesser reaction. This is basically frame control. You're teaching him what you like and what you dislike. Reward good behavior and punish bad behavior. Simple.

This takes practice and if you're someone goofy in general, you give in sometimes and even laugh at their jokes but don't do that. Behave as if that person doesn't exist in the group. You don't have to be witty to behave like this.

 

[RedNeck]

I dunno. It worked in your context because you don’t really know those people and likely don’t see them as often.

But in a social circle like mine I think I’d just get the reputation as a meathead who just throws around threats instead of engaging them verbally.

Eventually someone is going to test me on those threats, and so I’m either going to have to beat that guy up or have my threats mean absolutely nothing anymore.

If you can’t beat the pros at their own game, change the game.

It seems you can’t outwit this guy. At the same time you don’t want to be a butt of the joke, then kill the joke .

- Guy: blah blah blah
- Everyone: laughs
-You: You know what I would really appreciate if you don’t joke about XY with me again. I am not butt hurt but I just don’t like these jokes.I know you are kidding

- Everyone: come on don’t be so serious.

-You: I am not serious… I just don’t like this kind of jokes

You might not be winning in this situation, but in the long term, you will win. He will definitely stop joking with you. Win for you as no one will be laughing at you.
or
He will keep doing it. Then you can go ballistic on him, and everyone will know he is an annoying idiot because you expressed your boundaries and he is not respecting them.

See how Tom Cruise Scold a guy in calm you. You can do something simaliar

 

[Gladiator]

What I wrote above is my go-to option. People generally don't take a piss at me in social circle since I'll always have a come back but there are times when I'm not in mood, hungover or haven't slept well or my mind is working slow, then I have some canned lines.. they're not canned really cos that's how I respond. You can have these in your back pocket and say it for anything:

- Suck my dick (with an unamused face)
- Your mom tells me I'm good though (with an I don't believe you look)
- Last night your mom told me you've still not grown up

-- for that minion joke above, you could use the same.. you could've said- your mom said she likes minions.. so cute (with a shit eating grin)

 

[Will_V]

Back when I was in track there was this short skinny black guy with a great wit that everyone loved. He was also on the team for years before me so everyone liked him.

He didnt like me for some reason, so he’d keep taking stabs at me (I was also a lot more socially uncalibrated then so I’m sure I came off as I “didnt get it” sometimes. Now I’m able to make friends with people like this though)

Example:

Him: Get your big body muscle minion ass out of here

*shows everyone this picture*

(I’m not even that big, massive exaggeration)

Everyone: *Laughing*

Me: *Poker Face* That shit was ass

Him: Your dreads are ass, they look like a mop on ur head, uglahh

————————————————————

When I do the poker face thing it seems to effect some people in the audience. But overall I still just look like a guy who cant compete.

I do have above average wit and combacks I can use against most people, but against guys like this I’m eventually going to

The mistake would be to take this seriously. If he's really a short skinny dude and you're jacked, it's obviously just cope so you are already on the front foot while he's reaching forward trying to put you off balance.

At the end of the day, the short guy who makes fun of the big guy while the big guy stays unfazed, chuckling along and occasionally jabbing back in good fun is not the sort of thing that makes panties wet or garners respect from other guys, regardless of how it feels in the moment.

Just find some way to jab back with a minimum of effort.

'Look who's talking!'

'Show me your arms man' do a bicep curl next to him 'dude you should totally armwrestle me I think you'd win, you'd flatten me!'

pat him on the back with a bit of gusto, squeeze his bicep while you talk about how strong he is, move in and out of his personal space while talking to other people, just non-threateningly physically dominate him while looking like you're thoroughly enjoying yourself and playing to the crowd so everyone enjoys it. That's terrain he can't compete on.

At the end of the day he doesn't have what you have and that's what makes him try to put you down, so rub it in his face and bring that pain every time he tries to make fun.

 

[Skills]

As I see it the main problem is you being in a social circle... So the threat of violence or violence could be a problem.... It seems he is going after your looks, map hair, muscles.... I personally would use the gay angle "you are always commenting and paying too much attention to my muscle and hair, I know what the problem is you like me but I am not homo is ok nothing wrong with that but come out the closest already, stop being mad that I don't go that way"... If you want to learn how to be Witt YouTube rosting stuff on comedians and watch Italian Mafia shows, Italians good at this.... Or go to incel forums, incels, black pillers good at this, some of the best.... Or just make regular posts, like this with samples and people can post comebacks till you get good at it... But again for seduction waste of time..

Socializing - Why do seducers get picked on with amog, fights, disrespect....

So you are wondering why do people are picking on me with fights, sometimes rude comments, some times bad looks, some type people nitpicking on you.... Well is very simple (some times is strangers or even people in your circles women and men alike).... It is an inner frustration with the lack...

www.skilledseducer.com

 

[Bill]

Rather than viewing social interaction as a zero sum game and competition, view it as a collaboration with no stakes, which will automatically make you “win”, as less reactivity and more comfort is a sign of being higher in a hierarchy.

 

[Gladiator]

as less reactivity and more comfort is a sign of being higher in a hierarchy.

Agree but your answer and some of the other answers seem to be ignoring the age group of target audience.

From OP, I'm guessing they're 18-20 year olds. Being non-reactive, less reactive, violent or flexing gets the OP totally roasted.
They're a social circle and those bullies are apparently "friends". So, you need to "belong" to the group to be part of them.

view it as a collaboration with no stakes,

OP needs to play their game by being ridiculous or totally ignore them. Trying to be collaborative will get him in more trouble.

 

[Kaida]

They're a social circle and those bullies are apparently "friends". So, you need to "belong" to the group to be part of them.

The example I gave up there was over a year ago.

The reason I ask the question now is because theres a guy in my social circle who has done the same thing to other members in the group and I’m trying to learn how to defend against it.

 

[Gladiator]

The example I gave up there was over a year ago.

The reason I ask the question now is because theres a guy in my social circle who has done the same thing to other members in the group and I’m trying to learn how to defend against it.

I've known such guys. They're not sexual threats.

Their goal in the group is to get attention and bring down value of guys who they see as sexual threats. So, you treat them as "Silly & Cute".

@Skills gave an excellent example.. treating them like gays.. I'd take the same route or I'd snap at them like I snap at little kids or treat them as non-masculine with those mom jokes, like I mentioned above. (Imagine two adults talking in a party and kids come running to them asking for something.. then the man would say to the kid.. No, I'm busy talking to X.. go play with Johnny.. I'll come in sometime - that's the frame you need to have)

Reason I also suggested to totally ignore them is cos it's just a waste of your time. Every now and then I run into such guys in different social circles but I don't have time to deal with their bullshit while I can be having fun or talking to some chics.