I think I need to hire a professional to jumpstart my PUA career

[Starboy]

Vision, i want to know that my goal is not a posturing goal, but a goal based on i see a lot of similarities in you and me in many ways (specially that post on the banging teenagers when in college, that we did not do)

I used to think totally like the above and share many of the ways you share and even more, i personally never really got burned till i started pushing and pushing the limits on my 10 year relationship, in other words i got greedy....That got was a christian relatively low lay count and i got burned at the end (but more in this later)

At one point even I had the rev. write a collab and his article mentions a lot of your views in order to find the right girlfriend... https://www.theskillsmethod.com/ultimate-guide-get-keep-girlfriend-featuring-revlifestyledesign/ if you ever read that our list is similar to what you mention and wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy more of some laundry list from the relationship to the dad, to socio economics....

As i kept dating and evolving and dating and dating and dating and dating...... I realized that there were some women with a high lay count that were amazing girlfriends and despite the lay count and the sexual skills they were amazing girlfriend and is not as you say as black and white....

I developed a system were i did not judge, invited more sexual openness, and no judgmental frames this in turn relaxed the girl and allowed them to put their guard down and to share stuff that nobody from best friends, to family member to anybody else knew, crazy shit! (all of this happened kind of accidental)....

The problem is when i was with your believe system even if you think "you got this" a slight micro expression and tell will betray you and as much as you think you know everything they will hold back or may put up a bait and switch on you...

There are cluster b crazies like topcat says that have a high lay count.... But then there are those that i call "ethical sluts" that are freaks that will open up sexually to the right dude, and they will be loyal, good girlfriends, sexual experience and even if they have a high lay count they will not be incline to cheat on a healthy relationship and even if you are having issues...

I have also gotten burned from women with a very low lay count, remember women with a low lay count at times also have the "wondering" factor, but i don't really care about any of this...

My method is i date multiple women, and i judge them with time and how they treat me, the past, intuition.... This become easier if you go with an open mind and you screen... As they open up you will find out the lay count, lay count now a days is not a true sign of relationship success... A bigger sign of relationship success is the history of cheating... I put more emphasis on the history of cheating > lay count.... or character > lay count....

more healthy women in the west work like this: - get a boyfriend> break up > mini cock carousel/or place holder dude> get a boyfriend> break up> mini cock carouse/place holder dude... Sometimes is not even a cock carousel most time is a "place holder" dude they are sleeping with till they find a dude...

As much as the red pillers make people want to believe women are opening their legs left and right is not even so.... most women are not even comfortable sleeping with 2 guys, they screen hard as fuck...

Again i had women that had low lay count, bad character/honesty factor/shadiness and i had women of a stage of higher lay count (also age plays a factor a women in their 30s will have a higher lay count of one teeneger, but she will also know what she wants and will appreciate you more/more loyalty more character)

What i do i get into pick up momentum rack up lays, get a mini rotation, were i am evaluating everything as i am banging and interacting then one of them excels, i keep banging everybody then what i call comparative advantage happens, and i date her, while sarging on the side a little bit....

I always thought higher lay count= girl will cheat at some point in future maybe before or after 2 year drop. Lay count is always stressed so much especially from here when it comes to choosing girls for a relationship. We're always encouraged to only date conservative girls,but I thought these girls wouldn't be that fun in bed and they won't have the sex appeal of more experienced women.

It's kind of a relief to know that you can still date women who have some more sexual experience and still have them be a loyal partner. The only date women with 2 to 4 girl laycount and never had a fuckbuddy or hookup rule to me sounds impractical and unrealistic especially if a women reaches past a certain age and lives in a big city.

 

[Gunwitch]

I have a roadblock in confidence, and that is intimate experience. Especially with city girls my age; I look at them, and I am like wow! Look at how much experience they have. This triggers AA and even if I do approach It will usually flop and I struggle to convey sexual intent. I usually hit on younger girls but then I flirt with a kind of creepy vibe- and even then I still have little experience to offer them anyway. I have good hardware down there and I am fit at 31. I am looking at high priced escorts. Does anyone have experience with this as a tactic to help PU?

Nah don't be doin nothin like that.

Escorts are for 3 things:

Virgins, to learn what they're fighting for.

MGTOWs who aren't aspies or secretly gay.

Guys who've had enough sex with enough women that it won't distort their reality.

You've had some experience. You don't plan on or want to end up using escorts for your sex life I assume, you want to be a pua? Yet you also don't have enough experience to shrug off easy no effort pussy without getting addicted, or thinking you're in love with one of the women and getting drained financially etc.

Gotta beat that AA, first things first. You need to reprogram the first thoughts you have when you see a woman to be lust and desire, not fear of rejection socially and/or anxiety over lack of a game plan etc. That will cure your vibe and relaxation issues FAR more effective than dealing with fuck Vipers who'll show you things (and energy/vibe) you shouldn't see til you go to prison.


Gun

 

[Vision]

hey @Vision i respect what you write on here. Your intuition on relationship management is solid,

Thanks, I appreciate that.

however i think where the wires are getting crossed here between you and @Skills is that you seek committed partners in monogamous relationships (or one-sided? i’m not sure). For this sort of arrangement I’d say 100% a girl with less desire or experience with new dick is probably best. The headache of managing such a woman wouldn’t be worth it.

Yep, I do committed relationships, unless I'm in between and I meet a girl who doesn't fit my standards. Then I usually don't even talk about it.

However, and I’ll put myself in such a category, some of us here would be bored to tears with such a woman. I wouldn’t see the appeal personally. I like freaks and as long as she’s not causing me problems and remains submissive/compliant she can stay with me in some sort of open arrangement. I think @Skills may be in this camp. I wouldn’t want to keep such a woman in a monogamous arrangement, as it’s not what she’s built for.

Yeah, I've dated a few freaks and it's usually a turn off to me. I just like to be dominant in bed and if she's trying to do some freaky shit, it's just really unattractive to me.

Probably just some kind of sexual preference thing.

I’m also starting to notice two camps of freaks.

You have “chaotic” types who are emotionally unstable and usually say they want to settle down and probably truly want it, but their neuroticism makes it impossible long term. Cluster B types..

Then you have the stable, confident kind, who can basically get dick when they want it, wont when they don’t, are highly independent and will only submit to a man if he really is on his shit when it comes to dominance. These ones you’ll probably end up settling in some form of swinger relationship with if it’s your cup of tea..

I’m madly attracted to this second kind.

Seducer’s fall into different camps and I think this is what Skills is getting at with his Maddona/Whore post. For better or worse we like whores..

Interesting... there could definitely be a lot of truth behind that one.

So whore would be what you're into and maddona would be what I'm into and all seducers fall into these categories?

Okay...

Vision, i want to know that my goal is not a posturing goal, but a goal based on i see a lot of similarities in you and me in many ways (specially that post on the banging teenagers when in college, that we did not do)

I would hope that you're posting because you either want to help me or you're fulfilling some intellectual curiosity. Although, I could think of a number of other reasons why you might want to post.

I'll leave your intentions to you.

I used to think totally like the above and share many of the ways you share and even more, i personally never really got burned till i started pushing and pushing the limits on my 10 year relationship, in other words i got greedy....That got was a christian relatively low lay count and i got burned at the end (but more in this later)

At one point even I had the rev. write a collab and his article mentions a lot of your views in order to find the right girlfriend... https://www.theskillsmethod.com/ultimate-guide-get-keep-girlfriend-featuring-revlifestyledesign/ if you ever read that our list is similar to what you mention and wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy more of some laundry list from the relationship to the dad, to socio economics....

As i kept dating and evolving and dating and dating and dating and dating...... I realized that there were some women with a high lay count that were amazing girlfriends and despite the lay count and the sexual skills they were amazing girlfriend and is not as you say as black and white....

I'm sure that's true.

I developed a system were i did not judge, invited more sexual openness, and no judgmental frames this in turn relaxed the girl and allowed them to put their guard down and to share stuff that nobody from best friends, to family member to anybody else knew, crazy shit! (all of this happened kind of accidental)....

Yeah, I do the same things... it's not accidental on my part though. I learned this from PUAs of past days and still use their content (I think a lot of it is better than anything I've seen from recent people).

I set frames from the beginning...

Frames like...
- Women are sexual predators
- She has a high sexual drive
- I'm nonjudgmental
- She is sexually aggressive
- She doesn't care about the judgments of society and their rules
- She's adventurous
- She goes after what she wants

I often have women tell me things that they don't share with anyone as well. I think it's pretty normal when you use a sexual framing model.

The problem is when i was with your believe system even if you think "you got this" a slight micro expression and tell will betray you and as much as you think you know everything they will hold back or may put up a bait and switch on you...

Yeah, I understand how it works. Thanks for the lesson.

There are cluster b crazies like topcat says that have a high lay count.... But then there are those that i call "ethical sluts" that are freaks that will open up sexually to the right dude, and they will be loyal, good girlfriends, sexual experience and even if they have a high lay count they will not be incline to cheat on a healthy relationship and even if you are having issues...

I have no doubt that's true. Do I want to be with such a girl in a relationship? I think there would be a host of other questions that I would be asking myself to know the answer to that.

I have a really high lay count so I have to, at the very least, have compassion for women who do. But I also know what kind of psychological things that's done to me, it's done to others, and it has done to a lot of women I've dated... I also know the psychological state that lead me to have copious amounts of sex with strange women, which also makes me pause for concern when I find out a woman has done it.

So I couldn't really answer the question of whether I'd want to be in a relationship with her without seeing some of her patterns and then going from there.

I have also gotten burned from women with a very low lay count, remember women with a low lay count at times also have the "wondering" factor, but i don't really care about any of this...

My method is i date multiple women, and i judge them with time and how they treat me, the past, intuition.... This become easier if you go with an open mind and you screen... As they open up you will find out the lay count, lay count now a days is not a true sign of relationship success... A bigger sign of relationship success is the history of cheating... I put more emphasis on the history of cheating > lay count.... or character > lay count....

Yeah, that makes sense.

I look at a lot of things... I like to look at their IG account and ask myself, "would I be proud to have this woman in my life?"

I don't care if she's loyal if she's showing her butthole for the world to see on IG, she's not going to make it into my life long term.

more healthy women in the west work like this: - get a boyfriend> break up > mini cock carousel/or place holder dude> get a boyfriend> break up> mini cock carouse/place holder dude... Sometimes is not even a cock carousel most time is a "place holder" dude they are sleeping with till they find a dude...

I think a lot less women are doing the cock carousel than the red pill community would want you to believe.

Based on the research I've seen, it's not 80% of women banging 20% of dudes... it's more like 20% of women banging 20% of dudes and then there's a continuum that goes down the ladder from there.

Obviously, it's easier for most women to have sex when they want it than it is for most men. But I don't think women are going out in huge percentage numbers, riding the cock carousel, like some would have you believe.

As much as the red pillers make people want to believe women are opening their legs left and right is not even so.... most women are not even comfortable sleeping with 2 guys, they screen hard as fuck...

Hah, didn't even see this before I wrote the above but it looks like we're in agreement there.

Again i had women that had low lay count, bad character/honesty factor/shadiness and i had women of a stage of higher lay count (also age plays a factor a women in their 30s will have a higher lay count of one teeneger, but she will also know what she wants and will appreciate you more/more loyalty more character)

Yeah, she also might have less options (so she's not in abundance), she also has a biological clock ticking, she's also probably getting pressure from friends and family, if she doesn't have kids. There are a lot of reasons a guy might want to date a woman in her 30's...

Honestly, I don't know what it's like to date women in their 30's. I haven't dated a woman over 25 in like 10 years. But I'm sure they can be good.

What i do i get into pick up momentum rack up lays, get a mini rotation, were i am evaluating everything as i am banging and interacting then one of them excels, i keep banging everybody then what i call comparative advantage happens, and i date her, while sarging on the side a little bit....

Yep, abundance is a beautiful thing.

 

[Gunwitch]

Why are some of you guys turning this into a cry fest about women cheating on you?

Totally derailing the guys question and topic.

Toughen up.

Guys asking if he needs a whore to jumpstart HIS ego.

Not if YOUR weak ass macho ego can handle fucking a woman who's ever had another penis in her theoretically, being you're a KJ.

Some of you guys make me so mad, blind leading the blind, betray yourselves in every other sentence with your totally "care too much" status jockeying about sex, ego and dominance. To have ever really lived any decent sex life or you wouldn't even give a shit about these things.

By the way scroll up Egor I did give you a legit reply here, and actionable advice I can help you with if you want. Not some queero KJ theory shit.


Gun

 

[Vision]

Why are some of you guys turning this into a cry fest about women cheating on you?

Totally derailing the guys question and topic.

Toughen up.

Guys asking if he needs a whore to jumpstart HIS ego.

Not if YOUR weak ass macho ego can handle fucking a woman who's ever had another penis in her theoretically, being you're a KJ.

Some of you guys make me so mad, blind leading the blind, betray yourselves in every other sentence with your totally "care too much" status jockeying about sex, ego and dominance. To have ever really lived any decent sex life or you wouldn't even give a shit about these things.

By the way scroll up Egor I did give you a legit reply here, and actionable advice I can help you with if you want. Not some queero KJ theory shit.


Gun

Hey man, I get it if you want us to have this conversation on another post, since we hijacked his.

You can just say that though. You don't need to act like a HERO OF MY LIFE and call us queero KJs.

It just sounds like you're overcompensating bro.

 

[Gunwitch]

Hey man, I get it if you want us to have this conversation on another post, since we hijacked his.

You can just say that though. You don't need to act like a HERO OF ALL TIME and call us queero KJs.

All i'm saying is you and Skills take your bromance about how no woman will ever cheat on you, cause you are such alpha male KJs in private maybe.

Original poster wasn't asking about how dominant you are, or asking you two to have a buttwife conversation about whatever experiences you've had. Again take that in private maybe. Guy asked a legit question, and you two went in to buttlove mode with each other. SHOW SOME RESPECT or get owned. Get the picture?


Gun

 

[Fuck This]

Nah don't be doin nothin like that.

Escorts are for 3 things:

Virgins, to learn what they're fighting for.

MGTOWs who aren't aspies or secretly gay.

Guys who've had enough sex with enough women that it won't distort their reality.

I'll add : Men in an LTR with a dead bedroom

I'd tell the OP that learning to identify DTF women and frequenting where they are found is the best roadway to sexual confidence. Lower your looks/age standard and get your dick wet. In college I got dumped on a Thursday and on Saturday had an ONS with probably my lowest rated female ever. The next Thursday I met the woman with whom I had my longest relationship ever .

Scorecard for if she is DTF

What does a DTF woman look like? Use these 10 Pluses and ten Minuses PLUS (add one for each) From out of town. Away from being judged by friends and relatives. Might be in town for a conference, travelling for business, on her way to see relatives. She’s drinking. Lowering her inhibitions...

www.skilledseducer.com

These slam dunks don't have to be first time strangers. They can be women who have shown interest in you but you put THEM in the friend zone...