My brain has a kill switch on approaching

[Superlife]

Synopsis: I have been grappling with being unable to cold approach for several years.
As soon as I'm walking towards her I find myself walking past.
It's this automatic response I can't shake. It's like my brain won't even let me get to the point of being nervous (best not to feel uncomfortable. You will be burned again. And again. You've already been burned and burned some more. Don't do it.) So I don't. The initial impulse is completely and immediately smothered. before I can even have an emotional reaction. My subconscious would rather be emotionally flatline then on a roller coaster.

As I write this I realize my brain keeps going over the various rejections and failures I've had with women over several years. You can say, well you learn from your mistakes, but when there's not even a slim success during that long period of time..

I've been watching a lot of videos from coaches and I see a lot of the mistakes I've made in the more recent past with women
but that doesn't help me on a subconscious level now.
It's like the damage is done from several years of bs, crappy interactions with girls, failure after failure FOR YEARS personally and professionally.

A number of years back I was burned by my ex wife big time. I was also horrified by the way I dealt with her (no physical abuse but she changed quickly and I just lost complete attraction to her. I don't want to hurt anyone like that ever again but I also don't think I could stop myself either if in the same situation again ... so yeah there's that FEAR. Don't get me wrong. She did not treat me well either by any stretch.).
.
I'm a decent looking guy. Despite my age I physically attract hot young women all the time.

One came out of nowhere in a store last week and I gave her an aloof vibe (it was so sudden I didn't have time to think) - she then stuck around at a table feet away pretending to look at the table, basically pushed her yoga pant clad porn star ass in my direction and I actually popped a stiffie on the spot.

I walked a couple aisles away. On some level it freaked me out.
Needed to get composure. Despite the fact I have to be a clear communicator at work I'm sure I would have been stumbling through my communication. I went looking for a few minutes later but she was gone). I feel like I have most of the tools yet I can't get it off the ground.

I have to add though I have no social life. I've had friends over the years but they moved away or pulled dick moves and that was it for that. I'm stuck in a job right now that doesn't allow me to do my one hobby that gets me out with other people. Things like sports not great at - tried to sign up for volleyball but here it's pretty much just with teams of people you know.. catch 22...

I've looked into Complex post traumatic syndrome. Think this might be it. Not sure though. I've had counsellors over the years but obviously the progress has not been anywhere it should be. Not sure who to talk to.

I know this is complex but I'm desperate to be honest and I could really use suggestions. Thank you for reading.

 

[James D]

If approaching is that bad... then how about not approaching at all?

There are other ways to get girls, maybe you should focus on those.

You said you're decent looking guy who attracts hot young women all the time, right?

So you probably have the raw material to succeed at dating apps for instance, with some tweaks like professional pics and a ripped body or something.

Social circle is another one you can leverage. Will take time tho but the learning which comes from socializing and building a network is worth it.

Bottom line: assuming sleeping with girls or getting a girlfriend is your goal, there are others ways.

Cold approach's merit rests in the efficiency and immense possibilities it gives you to meet women BUT it's not the easiest way of meeting women.

If you don't think it's for you, I'd say drop it, at least for some time, and go for the lower hanging fruits.

 

[Will_V]

Synopsis: I have been grappling with being unable to cold approach for several years.
As soon as I'm walking towards her I find myself walking past.
It's this automatic response I can't shake. It's like my brain won't even let me get to the point of being nervous (best not to feel uncomfortable. You will be burned again. And again. You've already been burned and burned some more. Don't do it.) So I don't. The initial impulse is completely and immediately smothered. before I can even have an emotional reaction. My subconscious would rather be emotionally flatline then on a roller coaster.

As I write this I realize my brain keeps going over the various rejections and failures I've had with women over several years. You can say, well you learn from your mistakes, but when there's not even a slim success during that long period of time..

I've been watching a lot of videos from coaches and I see a lot of the mistakes I've made in the more recent past with women
but that doesn't help me on a subconscious level now.
It's like the damage is done from several years of bs, crappy interactions with girls, failure after failure FOR YEARS personally and professionally.

A number of years back I was burned by my ex wife big time. I was also horrified by the way I dealt with her (no physical abuse but she changed quickly and I just lost complete attraction to her. I don't want to hurt anyone like that ever again but I also don't think I could stop myself either if in the same situation again ... so yeah there's that FEAR. Don't get me wrong. She did not treat me well either by any stretch.).
.
I'm a decent looking guy. Despite my age I physically attract hot young women all the time.

One came out of nowhere in a store last week and I gave her an aloof vibe (it was so sudden I didn't have time to think) - she then stuck around at a table feet away pretending to look at the table, basically pushed her yoga pant clad porn star ass in my direction and I actually popped a stiffie on the spot.

I walked a couple aisles away. On some level it freaked me out.
Needed to get composure. Despite the fact I have to be a clear communicator at work I'm sure I would have been stumbling through my communication. I went looking for a few minutes later but she was gone). I feel like I have most of the tools yet I can't get it off the ground.

I have to add though I have no social life. I've had friends over the years but they moved away or pulled dick moves and that was it for that. I'm stuck in a job right now that doesn't allow me to do my one hobby that gets me out with other people. Things like sports not great at - tried to sign up for volleyball but here it's pretty much just with teams of people you know.. catch 22...

I've looked into Complex post traumatic syndrome. Think this might be it. Not sure though. I've had counsellors over the years but obviously the progress has not been anywhere it should be. Not sure who to talk to.

I know this is complex but I'm desperate to be honest and I could really use suggestions. Thank you for reading.

Things like these are complex to deal with because everyone comes with different personalities and life experiences. And we aren't therapists (at least I'm not).

What I can say is you need a social life. It's very few people who can get by in life - having all the self esteem, opportunities and women they need - while living an isolated life. There are all kinds of ways to do this - join any sports/activity group, go to meetups, do some training courses, etc.

Make sure you don't fail to strike up at least a brief conversation with people who work at the places you go shopping or get coffee, especially if they are women - without any agenda, just to enjoy talking.

On top of that, start acquiring small wins in life. Go to the gym, start some 'side hustle', set small goals and knock them over. This is important to get your testosterone up and self esteem in order.

Basically, your self expression is buried under guilt, pain, loneliness and desperation, etc. It has to be freed. And one way to do that is by rebuilding your frame of reference out of small positive experiences, and retraining your instincts.

 

[Chase]

@Superlife,

Check out this post by @Carousel; it might be just what you're looking for:

Body-oriented therapy and its application to PU

This post will deal with various therapies that go further than cognitive-behavioral therapy (CBT). You actually don't need to understand very much of the theory here to do the exercises, but I do provide a lot of theory as there are guys who are interested in a deeper understanding. I have...

www.skilledseducer.com

As a side note, my first reaction on reading the post was how fun/funny this would be to coach.

You go out with a guy, send him to approach a girl, he walks past her, then you run up to her and tell her, "Hey, this guy wanted to say hello to you! Hey! C'mere, man, here's the girl! Come on, you two talk!" Do that to a guy once or twice and he'll be making his own approaches after that no problem, just to avoid the embarrassment of having it done to him

Anyway, once you've gone through Carousel's post, I'd suggest completing the Newbie Assignment, even if you've done some of these before:

Newbie Assignment

Introduction If you're brand new to the idea of approaching getting better with women and dating as a skill set, not to worry - most people in most parts of the world don't think of it that way yet, either. The great news is, anything can be learned as a skill - be that thing painting, writing...

www.skilledseducer.com

It's as much about building the habit and trying out different approach strategies to give you different reference points as anything.

One other thing to keep in mind: going from totally cold (not approaching at all) to jumping all over approach invitations when they suddenly appear in the wild is very hard to do. Few guys are good at this. The easiest way to be responsive to approach invitations is to already be in a habit of approaching and warmed up. If you're not approaching regularly you will struggle to get into gear just because a girl pops up near you and gives you a 5-second approach invitation.

This is not something to beat yourself up over.

However, if you want to be approaching girls, you need to build a habit around approaching girls.

Chase

 

[Bill]

You can desensitize yourself to talking to attractive women at strip clubs.

 

[Zoro]

Meditation was a big factor in helping me do my very first approaches.

Another one was going out with a friend who was into daygame and decent at it. I would either watch him or approach with him. That experience made me see how it was not a big deal.

Here’s a helpful bit of info. Even if you’re visibly nervous, you can still get the girl. I’ve mumbled, fumbled, and shaken and still got dates.

Also accept that sometimes you’re going look and feel like a fool. Also not a big deal.

 

[Superlife]

If approaching is that bad... then how about not approaching at all?

There are other ways to get girls, maybe you should focus on those.

You said you're decent looking guy who attracts hot young women all the time, right?

So you probably have the raw material to succeed at dating apps for instance, with some tweaks like professional pics and a ripped body or something.

Social circle is another one you can leverage. Will take time tho but the learning which comes from socializing and building a network is worth it.

Bottom line: assuming sleeping with girls or getting a girlfriend is your goal, there are others ways.

Cold approach's merit rests in the efficiency and immense possibilities it gives you to meet women BUT it's not the easiest way of meeting women.

If you don't think it's for you, I'd say drop it, at least for some time, and go for the lower hanging fruits.

If approaching is that bad... then how about not approaching at all?

There are other ways to get girls, maybe you should focus on those.

You said you're decent looking guy who attracts hot young women all the time, right?

So you probably have the raw material to succeed at dating apps for instance, with some tweaks like professional pics and a ripped body or something.

Social circle is another one you can leverage. Will take time tho but the learning which comes from socializing and building a network is worth it.

Bottom line: assuming sleeping with girls or getting a girlfriend is your goal, there are others ways.

Cold approach's merit rests in the efficiency and immense possibilities it gives you to meet women BUT it's not the easiest way of meeting women.

If you don't think it's for you, I'd say drop it, at least for some time, and go for the lower hanging fruits.

If approaching is that bad... then how about not approaching at all?

There are other ways to get girls, maybe you should focus on those.

You said you're decent looking guy who attracts hot young women all the time, right?

So you probably have the raw material to succeed at dating apps for instance, with some tweaks like professional pics and a ripped body or something.

Social circle is another one you can leverage. Will take time tho but the learning which comes from socializing and building a network is worth it.

Bottom line: assuming sleeping with girls or getting a girlfriend is your goal, there are others ways.

Cold approach's merit rests in the efficiency and immense possibilities it gives you to meet women BUT it's not the easiest way of meeting women.

If you don't think it's for you, I'd say drop it, at least for some time, and go for the lower hanging fruits.

I actually just started looking at dating apps .. I'm in a small city which, y'know, isn't the best but yea worth a shot. I see the value of a social circle but yes that will take time to build. Like I say, I'm quite restricted in activities mainly because of my job but also the location I'm in. But if I want it bad enough..

 

[Superlife]

Things like these are complex to deal with because everyone comes with different personalities and life experiences. And we aren't therapists (at least I'm not).

What I can say is you need a social life. It's very few people who can get by in life - having all the self esteem, opportunities and women they need - while living an isolated life. There are all kinds of ways to do this - join any sports/activity group, go to meetups, do some training courses, etc.

Make sure you don't fail to strike up at least a brief conversation with people who work at the places you go shopping or get coffee, especially if they are women - without any agenda, just to enjoy talking.

On top of that, start acquiring small wins in life. Go to the gym, start some 'side hustle', set small goals and knock them over. This is important to get your testosterone up and self esteem in order.

Basically, your self expression is buried under guilt, pain, loneliness and desperation, etc. It has to be freed. And one way to do that is by rebuilding your frame of reference out of small positive experiences, and retraining your instincts.

I failed at getting a social circle going in a major city over the course of several years despite going to several meetups. Got one friend that route but she wanted more than friendship after awhile.

Meetups believe or not actually were frequently cliquey - maybe I was reading it wrong but it often seemed like "not a certain age? Pass" or the same people would go frequently and either they would cling together or tbh I wouldn't care for some of them.

I found trying new activities and going to meetups too far outside my comfort zone after awhile as I wasn't seeing any wins, and I basically became a hermit.

I'm now in a small city which makes it more problematic as to opportunities (there's not even meetups here) but I get you about the importance of a social life and small wins. Definitely will keep working on. Thank you!

 

[Superlife]

@Superlife,

Check out this post by @Carousel; it might be just what you're looking for:

Body-oriented therapy and its application to PU

This post will deal with various therapies that go further than cognitive-behavioral therapy (CBT). You actually don't need to understand very much of the theory here to do the exercises, but I do provide a lot of theory as there are guys who are interested in a deeper understanding. I have...

www.skilledseducer.com

As a side note, my first reaction on reading the post was how fun/funny this would be to coach.

You go out with a guy, send him to approach a girl, he walks past her, then you run up to her and tell her, "Hey, this guy wanted to say hello to you! Hey! C'mere, man, here's the girl! Come on, you two talk!" Do that to a guy once or twice and he'll be making his own approaches after that no problem, just to avoid the embarrassment of having it done to him

Anyway, once you've gone through Carousel's post, I'd suggest completing the Newbie Assignment, even if you've done some of these before:

Newbie Assignment

Introduction If you're brand new to the idea of approaching getting better with women and dating as a skill set, not to worry - most people in most parts of the world don't think of it that way yet, either. The great news is, anything can be learned as a skill - be that thing painting, writing...

www.skilledseducer.com

It's as much about building the habit and trying out different approach strategies to give you different reference points as anything.

One other thing to keep in mind: going from totally cold (not approaching at all) to jumping all over approach invitations when they suddenly appear in the wild is very hard to do. Few guys are good at this. The easiest way to be responsive to approach invitations is to already be in a habit of approaching and warmed up. If you're not approaching regularly you will struggle to get into gear just because a girl pops up near you and gives you a 5-second approach invitation.

This is not something to beat yourself up over.

However, if you want to be approaching girls, you need to build a habit around approaching girls.

Chase

Hey Chase.. So along those lines.. After a long shitty road related to work I found myself dealing with anxiety induced insomnia.

Not long after starting my current job anxiety pangs would start up a few minutes after lying down to sleep. Nothing I tried to fix it helped until I came across some maneuvers recommended by a doctor on YouTube.

One was lying with your legs propped up against the wall. But I find the fetal position is enough, or just one knee tucked up to my stomach. It's been a lifesaver in truth. So yeah these suggestions could prove helpful, I will take a good look at them plus the newbie assignment. Thanks man!

(edit - I actually realize now that one cold approach experience probably had a serious consequence on my life and this is probably in the back of my subconscious. Someone from work somehow knew what I was up to when I was at a mall this one time where I actually did manage a couple of attempts (neither successfully) and it got around, smearing my rep and probably kept me from working with some important people.. Yes I'm a problem child.. )

 

[Superlife]

You can desensitize yourself to talking to attractive women at strip clubs.

Thanks for the idea man. Will give a go next time in the big city.

 

[Superlife]

Meditation was a big factor in helping me do my very first approaches.

Another one was going out with a friend who was into daygame and decent at it. I would either watch him or approach with him. That experience made me see how it was not a big deal.

Here’s a helpful bit of info. Even if you’re visibly nervous, you can still get the girl. I’ve mumbled, fumbled, and shaken and still got dates.

Also accept that sometimes you’re going look and feel like a fool. Also not a big deal.

Thanks for the tips... I realize it doesn't have to be a big deal, I know that on an intellectual level, but..

The idea of not worrying if I look nervous is definitely helpful, takes pressure off the whole, I need to be James Bond complex.

What kind of meditation are you doing? I've been meditating almost daily, I think it's helping my general state of mind but hasn't kicked my approach mechanism into gear.

I was walking through a store today and there was this beautiful woman who popped out of nowhere with a smile on her face and of course I just kept moving (there was this other couple like 10 feet away and even now, I'd be like, I'm not hitting on that chick in front of them... which I realize is also not a helpful way of thinking.. Taps into realizing, like you say it's ok to look dumb but when I'm in the thick of it it's extremely hard for me to accept that)..

 

[Superlife]

Things like these are complex to deal with because everyone comes with different personalities and life experiences. And we aren't therapists (at least I'm not).

What I can say is you need a social life. It's very few people who can get by in life - having all the self esteem, opportunities and women they need - while living an isolated life. There are all kinds of ways to do this - join any sports/activity group, go to meetups, do some training courses, etc.

Make sure you don't fail to strike up at least a brief conversation with people who work at the places you go shopping or get coffee, especially if they are women - without any agenda, just to enjoy talking.

On top of that, start acquiring small wins in life. Go to the gym, start some 'side hustle', set small goals and knock them over. This is important to get your testosterone up and self esteem in order.

Basically, your self expression is buried under guilt, pain, loneliness and desperation, etc. It has to be freed. And one way to do that is by rebuilding your frame of reference out of small positive experiences, and retraining your instincts.

Hey Will. So I wanted to update you on my situation, which tbh has shown next to no improvement since I posted in Mar 23.
I'm still trying to approach. I still have no social circle.

There are a number of roadblocks that make it very difficult to push forward and I was hoping to pick your brain a little more as I see you're posting about a similar vein. I am still in a small city.
Obstacles include
- an elderly relative I'm not comfortable moving away from
-a reputation by many as being anti-social (yeah I can be, but feel those being snubbed deserved it.. but.. double edged sword for my non existent social circle)
-a job that is fairly notable and thus I feel I have to be careful in the public eye. I also find it hard to believe I can trust anyone here to be a good wing. Partly because I'm in a small city and my job and partly because I've been screwed over by past friends

I continue to watch videos, read articles and this forum, as well as books. In fact I'm learning things, say about female psychology that shed light on past mistakes, which is great fodder for beating myself up some more (yeah I just was reading about depression signs which I definitely fall under. Chase's cbt comments apply well and I need to work on that admittedly).

Having said that, I know, despite my flaws, I have a lot of value. I believe I have decent social skills, but was unable to properly demonstate that because of desperation/self sabotage in my previous city, and my downward spiral was something severe. Now I'm in a small city with a high profile job and an anxious mind in which the idea of looking stupid is so mortifying (I intensely dislike doing new things that fall outside my comfort zone. it's a really tough nut to crack) I won't even really broach it consciously.
Lots of hot chicks at the mall today. One was standing right next to me in an aisle out of nowhere - surprised the fuck out of me (where did she come from??) - but instead some elderly woman asked for help choosing a phone cord after I grabbed one and I left. On my way out the store some other hot chick was giving me penetrating eye contact, like wtf.

But I left without a word. Despite my going to the mall for daygame. And I go out about 2 or 3 times every week to do so.. but nope.

Its good to look like I'm confident and get the ladies attention (while that's an honest comment in the context of this moment it's really a self criticism tbh). In the last city I was in - a big one - every interaction I had but one fizzled and all in a quite negative way.
I do not feel like I was leaving anyone better than I left them and does not make me feel good about myself.
Maybe it's just the CBT therapy I have to work more on. I've done it but it seems to only scratch the surface. Any thoughts you may have would be appreciated. I find it almost funny when I see someone say they had a dry spell for a year and they were a tough nut.

 

[gameboy]

Hey Chase.. So along those lines.. After a long shitty road related to work I found myself dealing with anxiety induced insomnia.

Not long after starting my current job anxiety pangs would start up a few minutes after lying down to sleep. Nothing I tried to fix it helped until I came across some maneuvers recommended by a doctor on YouTube.

One was lying with your legs propped up against the wall. But I find the fetal position is enough, or just one knee tucked up to my stomach. It's been a lifesaver in truth. So yeah these suggestions could prove helpful, I will take a good look at them plus the newbie assignment. Thanks man!

(edit - I actually realize now that one cold approach experience probably had a serious consequence on my life and this is probably in the back of my subconscious. Someone from work somehow knew what I was up to when I was at a mall this one time where I actually did manage a couple of attempts (neither successfully) and it got around, smearing my rep and probably kept me from working with some important people.. Yes I'm a problem child.. )

Sounds like you need to change jobs urgently imho.

Also being in that small town where theres a significant chance to be observed by work colleagues doesnt help probably.

Otherwise, +1 on doing the newbie assignment. I had bad AA too, but eventually got better at approaching!

 

[Superlife]

Sounds like you need to change jobs urgently imho.

Also being in that small town where theres a significant chance to be observed by work colleagues doesnt help probably.

Otherwise, +1 on doing the newbie assignment. I had bad AA too, but eventually got better at approaching!

I've actually been looking for other work, but so far no luck. I was unsuccessful not too long ago getting hired into no-experience more menial type work, despite numerous attempts, I'm guessing because of my age and that I have a profession-specific background. I'm looking for remote work but ..so far it seems like I'm boxed in to my current work.

The newbie assignment.. some of it, such as body language I've checked those boxes, and if it's not for dating I can approach strangers no problem. I also did the "ask girls for directions" to desensitize method but admittedly that was some years ago .. I see there's more to it though and yeah I see the merit of actually working the stages. TBH part of me feels like I should be past this (my ego's like "I've had 3 ways ffs!!").. it contradicts the self image I'm trying to live up to but yes being a no-sex loner is far from where I want to be so.. ( BUT the idea of just sitting down with a girl I don't know is unsettling so perhaps it's just not ego ).

Guess I'll just have to really pick my newbie assignment moments in my small town. Thanks for your input, appreciate it! (and glad to hear you've found your way through your AA!)

 

[Will_V]

Hey Will. So I wanted to update you on my situation, which tbh has shown next to no improvement since I posted in Mar 23.
I'm still trying to approach. I still have no social circle.

There are a number of roadblocks that make it very difficult to push forward and I was hoping to pick your brain a little more as I see you're posting about a similar vein. I am still in a small city.
Obstacles include
- an elderly relative I'm not comfortable moving away from
-a reputation by many as being anti-social (yeah I can be, but feel those being snubbed deserved it.. but.. double edged sword for my non existent social circle)
-a job that is fairly notable and thus I feel I have to be careful in the public eye. I also find it hard to believe I can trust anyone here to be a good wing. Partly because I'm in a small city and my job and partly because I've been screwed over by past friends

I continue to watch videos, read articles and this forum, as well as books. In fact I'm learning things, say about female psychology that shed light on past mistakes, which is great fodder for beating myself up some more (yeah I just was reading about depression signs which I definitely fall under. Chase's cbt comments apply well and I need to work on that admittedly).

Having said that, I know, despite my flaws, I have a lot of value. I believe I have decent social skills, but was unable to properly demonstate that because of desperation/self sabotage in my previous city, and my downward spiral was something severe. Now I'm in a small city with a high profile job and an anxious mind in which the idea of looking stupid is so mortifying (I intensely dislike doing new things that fall outside my comfort zone. it's a really tough nut to crack) I won't even really broach it consciously.
Lots of hot chicks at the mall today. One was standing right next to me in an aisle out of nowhere - surprised the fuck out of me (where did she come from??) - but instead some elderly woman asked for help choosing a phone cord after I grabbed one and I left. On my way out the store some other hot chick was giving me penetrating eye contact, like wtf.

But I left without a word. Despite my going to the mall for daygame. And I go out about 2 or 3 times every week to do so.. but nope.

Its good to look like I'm confident and get the ladies attention (while that's an honest comment in the context of this moment it's really a self criticism tbh). In the last city I was in - a big one - every interaction I had but one fizzled and all in a quite negative way.
I do not feel like I was leaving anyone better than I left them and does not make me feel good about myself.
Maybe it's just the CBT therapy I have to work more on. I've done it but it seems to only scratch the surface. Any thoughts you may have would be appreciated. I find it almost funny when I see someone say they had a dry spell for a year and they were a tough nut.

You'll have to simply find a way to take action and accept the consequences as you learn and grow. What's the alternative? That you end up suffering and then either way, at some point, the whole thing is over. When you're 80 or 90 and still living in regret, your bones are creaking and the old equipment isn't working so well anymore, do you think any of the people whose opinions you are worrying about are going to come by and congratulate you for not rocking the boat while you still could?

Life is not a complicated thing. It's a short time to live life the way we want to, the way we believe in. Pain comes in one form or another, and everything is risky. You have to choose the kind of pain that you can smile with. What's important is not to save yourself from pain and risk, but to live well while you still have the capability to do so. At the end of the day these are the people who others love and want to be around.

The things I can think of that have served me well to get out of the sort of bad loops you seem to be in:

1) start doing all the things that you always wanted to do, even outside of women, and conversely start putting an end to all the things you're doing that you don't want to. It's surprising how much the unconscious parts of you, your drives and ambitions, rise up when they realize that you and not your fears are in control, even in just a small way. And how much they all disappear and leave you cold when you allow yourself to be inhibited.

2) indulge and invest in the small relationships you might have with others, but on your terms. Invite someone out for a beer, give someone a ring, go and visit someone, give everyone one free ride on your attention - you don't have to see them again if you don't want to, but give them the best company you can while you're there with them. Loneliness is poisonous in general, but bitterness, especially when you are trying to meet and sleep with women, thoroughly destroys your vibe. You have to teach yourself that people are just sentient animals. If you can make friends with a dog or a cat, you can make friends with another person. They all just want a bit of company, a bit of validation, a bit of warmth and pleasantry. If you can stop judging them and just let them be who they are, and figure out a way to work with that, you'll be a lot happier of a man.

3) you'll just have to go and talk to girls man, and enjoy the results even when things go sideways. Girls are silly and cute, and nothing they do can really be of much consequence to you. The fear is always that other dudes are going to end up doing something - which basically never happens - but even if they do, at the end of the day, it's your job as a man to defeat the competition and your adversaries in whatever form they appear, or go down fighting. Life is competitive, and if you don't fight you're sure to lose. Do you want to defeat yourself, or would you rather let fate decide? It's all going to end one day, either way.

That's pretty much all I have to say. Again, life isn't complicated, there's decisions, there's wins, and there's losses, and one day it's over. Best to have fun and live out who you want to be, while you can.

PS you say your approaches have often ended negatively, how about some field reports, so we can pinpoint exactly where things are going wrong?

 

[loolapaluza]

One came out of nowhere in a store last week and I gave her an aloof vibe (it was so sudden I didn't have time to think) - she then stuck around at a table feet away pretending to look at the table, basically pushed her yoga pant clad porn star ass in my direction and I actually popped a stiffie on the spot.

Lol,despite i have a significant succes with socialization,this is still a huge problem for me. Sometimes you just dont have a time to think how to start a convo. I even tried to create a thread here about it,but i have troubles with English,so i cant formulate it properly.
As for me i just go with something basic-"Hi! How is your day going?/How are you? etc.With proper delivery it works good,then you just watch for reaction(is she trying to invest in convo,send some signals etc)

 

[loolapaluza]

Synopsis: I have been grappling with being unable to cold approach for several years.
As soon as I'm walking towards her I find myself walking past.
It's this automatic response I can't shake. It's like my brain won't even let me get to the point of being nervous (best not to feel uncomfortable. You will be burned again. And again. You've already been burned and burned some more. Don't do it.) So I don't. The initial impulse is completely and immediately smothered. before I can even have an emotional reaction. My subconscious would rather be emotionally flatline then on a roller coaster.

As I write this I realize my brain keeps going over the various rejections and failures I've had with women over several years. You can say, well you learn from your mistakes, but when there's not even a slim success during that long period of time..

I've been watching a lot of videos from coaches and I see a lot of the mistakes I've made in the more recent past with women
but that doesn't help me on a subconscious level now.
It's like the damage is done from several years of bs, crappy interactions with girls, failure after failure FOR YEARS personally and professionally.

A number of years back I was burned by my ex wife big time. I was also horrified by the way I dealt with her (no physical abuse but she changed quickly and I just lost complete attraction to her. I don't want to hurt anyone like that ever again but I also don't think I could stop myself either if in the same situation again ... so yeah there's that FEAR. Don't get me wrong. She did not treat me well either by any stretch.).
.
I'm a decent looking guy. Despite my age I physically attract hot young women all the time.

One came out of nowhere in a store last week and I gave her an aloof vibe (it was so sudden I didn't have time to think) - she then stuck around at a table feet away pretending to look at the table, basically pushed her yoga pant clad porn star ass in my direction and I actually popped a stiffie on the spot.

I walked a couple aisles away. On some level it freaked me out.
Needed to get composure. Despite the fact I have to be a clear communicator at work I'm sure I would have been stumbling through my communication. I went looking for a few minutes later but she was gone). I feel like I have most of the tools yet I can't get it off the ground.

I have to add though I have no social life. I've had friends over the years but they moved away or pulled dick moves and that was it for that. I'm stuck in a job right now that doesn't allow me to do my one hobby that gets me out with other people. Things like sports not great at - tried to sign up for volleyball but here it's pretty much just with teams of people you know.. catch 22...

I've looked into Complex post traumatic syndrome. Think this might be it. Not sure though. I've had counsellors over the years but obviously the progress has not been anywhere it should be. Not sure who to talk to.

I know this is complex but I'm desperate to be honest and I could really use suggestions. Thank you for reading.

As for your thread in general.
Try to make a babysteps.You need change your whole lifestyle and mindset,you cant change it quickly.
Dont do street approaches,you dont have a skillset for this,so go for stationary girls.
Groom yourself, take a good posture, make eye contact exersizes.
You can start with small chit-chats.Try it with personell(baristas,bartenders,waitresses,casshiers etc)Some basic shit-"Hi,how is your day going?" And watch for reaction. If your fundamentals are good and you are polite most interractions will be succesfull.
Dont drag yourself in long conversations,you just need some experience.
-Hi,how is your day going
-Im good blahhblah
-blahblah,ok it was nice to talk,gotta run
Soon you realize that starting conversation is no big deal,and if you dont like something you can just politely eject.
Plus if you live in small city you will soon gain reputation of cool,friendly guy.

When you get some experience you can do something more difficult.Go to a bar ,place yourself near woman and try some basic questions-"How is your night going?"Watch for the reaction(is she investing in conversation? is she gives you a signals? is she enthusiastic about interacting with you?)
If reaction is good-proceed,start asking personal questions.Then try to get contacts-"Hey you seems like an enteresting person,wanna get coffee sometime?
Use same pattern for streets
-find a girl
-place yourself somewhere near her
-initiate conversation,ask personal questions
-get contacts

 

[theReason]

a reputation by many as being anti-social

You say this, but what I hear is “I hold dear to me many shitty people, and they fuck with my self-esteem by framing me as anti-social. Small price to pay to be around assholes all the time.”

I would recommend shutting out all contact with anyone who treats you like shit, and then going with Will_V’s point #2 (his whole post is ).

One came out of nowhere in a store last week and I gave her an aloof vibe (it was so sudden I didn't have time to think) - she then stuck around at a table feet away pretending to look at the table, basically pushed her yoga pant clad porn star ass in my direction and I actually popped a stiffie on the spot.

Lots of hot chicks at the mall today. One was standing right next to me in an aisle out of nowhere - surprised the fuck out of me (where did she come from??) - but instead some elderly woman asked for help choosing a phone cord after I grabbed one and I left. On my way out the store some other hot chick was giving me penetrating eye contact, like wtf.

But I left without a word. Despite my going to the mall for daygame. And I go out about 2 or 3 times every week to do so.. but nope.

You will always miss approaches now and then. I only count my failures when I’m out specifically to approach. You can’t fault yourself for staying “on-mission” when on an errand.

In your position, I’d forgive myself for having “a lot of off-days,” and then just go out with the intention of “getting lucky and actually approaching a girl.”

You can’t expect yourself to approach unless everything lines up perfectly.

Do some people approach in every circumstance? Sure. But I don’t press myself to be that guy—I just want to maximize the number of times I take action when presented with ideal circumstances.

Having said that, I know, despite my flaws, I have a lot of value.

I'm a decent looking guy. Despite my age I physically attract hot young women all the time.

You’re getting a lot of looks because of your self-imposed sexual repression. Your “shyness” gives you a “byronic flaw”-“edge” that obtains you approach invitations.

Just don’t open too shyly, women may not hear you.

Here’s a helpful bit of info. Even if you’re visibly nervous, you can still get the girl. I’ve mumbled, fumbled, and shaken and still got dates.

But, as Zoro said, even that can work.

If you’re out, you “want” to approach, but ideal circumstances are not presenting themselves:

You just have to lower your standard a little bit, “assume what you can’t see about this girl is absolutely amazing,” because the amount of time the universe gives you to formulate your approach is not enough time to develop a crush on her.

I've been meditating almost daily, I think it's helping my general state of mind but hasn't kicked my approach mechanism into gear.

my approach mechanism

I want to specifically extol this phrasing. This is exactly how it works, there is a mechanism already in your brain that gets you in front of a girl and talking to her, and you just need to figure out what “does it” for that mechanism. Inner game (meditation; mindset)? Outer game (fashion; your walk)? Milfs? Big asses? Slutty clothes? Fancy clothes? Boy clothes? Girly behavior? Two-sets? Barely-legal girls?

Don’t use these as search terms—I’m talking gauging your reactions when encountering them in real life.

 

[Superlife]

You'll have to simply find a way to take action and accept the consequences as you learn and grow. What's the alternative? That you end up suffering and then either way, at some point, the whole thing is over. When you're 80 or 90 and still living in regret, your bones are creaking and the old equipment isn't working so well anymore, do you think any of the people whose opinions you are worrying about are going to come by and congratulate you for not rocking the boat while you still could?

Life is not a complicated thing. It's a short time to live life the way we want to, the way we believe in. Pain comes in one form or another, and everything is risky. You have to choose the kind of pain that you can smile with. What's important is not to save yourself from pain and risk, but to live well while you still have the capability to do so. At the end of the day these are the people who others love and want to be around.

The things I can think of that have served me well to get out of the sort of bad loops you seem to be in:

1) start doing all the things that you always wanted to do, even outside of women, and conversely start putting an end to all the things you're doing that you don't want to. It's surprising how much the unconscious parts of you, your drives and ambitions, rise up when they realize that you and not your fears are in control, even in just a small way. And how much they all disappear and leave you cold when you allow yourself to be inhibited.

2) indulge and invest in the small relationships you might have with others, but on your terms. Invite someone out for a beer, give someone a ring, go and visit someone, give everyone one free ride on your attention - you don't have to see them again if you don't want to, but give them the best company you can while you're there with them. Loneliness is poisonous in general, but bitterness, especially when you are trying to meet and sleep with women, thoroughly destroys your vibe. You have to teach yourself that people are just sentient animals. If you can make friends with a dog or a cat, you can make friends with another person. They all just want a bit of company, a bit of validation, a bit of warmth and pleasantry. If you can stop judging them and just let them be who they are, and figure out a way to work with that, you'll be a lot happier of a man.

3) you'll just have to go and talk to girls man, and enjoy the results even when things go sideways. Girls are silly and cute, and nothing they do can really be of much consequence to you. The fear is always that other dudes are going to end up doing something - which basically never happens - but even if they do, at the end of the day, it's your job as a man to defeat the competition and your adversaries in whatever form they appear, or go down fighting. Life is competitive, and if you don't fight you're sure to lose. Do you want to defeat yourself, or would you rather let fate decide? It's all going to end one day, either way.

That's pretty much all I have to say. Again, life isn't complicated, there's decisions, there's wins, and there's losses, and one day it's over. Best to have fun and live out who you want to be, while you can.

PS you say your approaches have often ended negatively, how about some field reports, so we can pinpoint exactly where things are going wrong?

Thanks for your reply Will. Very detailed and well thought out and I really appreciate it. It's food for thought and I'm going to have to mull your ideas over, including the tip to do things I've wanted to do... (which tbh mainly involves money) and investing in relationships. I'm trying to find a new job but that's a tough row to hoe. I need this income so I can stay close to an elderly relative.

If you can stop judging them and just let them be who they are, and figure out a way to work with that, you'll be a lot happier of a man.

Yeah I need to work on that lol. I've felt let down by family and friends (including very old ones). That's another tough one. I see it as, especially in the more difficult cases, as acceptance of bad behaviour. Example...Not like my ex was screwed by my best bud, but part of the issue - he helped extinquish the little budding flame I managed to light, being a pua lifestyle. Well.. a lifestyle period really.

PS you say your approaches have often ended negatively, how about some field reports, so we can pinpoint exactly where things are going wrong?

The encounters I mentioned weren't just approaches, of which there were only a few and happened years ago (as did the other situations. Yes I've been perma stalled). The other instances were hot girls I somehow ended up alone with at Meetups (I didn't know it was just going to be the two of us in either case) and my game did not fly. Whatever game I seemed to have that got me married had fizzled by then. Also a girl I saw briefly who threw herself at me in that same period, well we worked together and that didn't end well either. I was separated at the time and she got a scarlet letter (also my bud I mentioned, visiting in town at the time, decided to shame her briefly at her desk... she left the job not longer after). I know, I shouldn't have even told any of my friends. Lesson learned.

But the good news is, I have started the newbie assignment with an accompanying journal that's in the journal section... so with that and the advice from you and others here.. well, here's hoping. At least I've taken a step forward after so long. Thanks again!

 

[Superlife]

Lol,despite i have a significant succes with socialization,this is still a huge problem for me. Sometimes you just dont have a time to think how to start a convo. I even tried to create a thread here about it,but i have troubles with English,so i cant formulate it properly.
As for me i just go with something basic-"Hi! How is your day going?/How are you? etc.With proper delivery it works good,then you just watch for reaction(is she trying to invest in convo,send some signals etc)

Hopefully I'll get to this point soon, where, in PUA lingo, I can properly calibrate to social cues (have I read too much pickup stuff? Lol. But better to plainly describe it actually!). Yeah that makes complete sense to me. I'm at least a bit away from being able to do that yet I think but that's part of the plan..