PUA and neuroticism

[Dragonetti]

While there is a grain of truth in the OP, the author’s claims about 150+ and suggestions that he is a natural (after starting a thread just recently asking what a natural is, or what natural game is) are doubtful.

Simply because the illusion that naturals don’t discuss among themselves on how to lay specific girls is akin to the pedestalization of women that doesn’t ascribe a 10 rating to any because such women “don’t exist.”

The author probably isn’t a natural (most likely since if he was he wouldn’t be here) and, what’s more, has never hung out with successful naturals, or at least for any considerable length of time.

Again I sense insecurity behind this incredulity. I never even suggested I was a natural, I was surmising/investigating what the term referred to.

I didn't come here to make you feel smaller, my man! I am in my 30s, which means that ~150 amounts to less than 10 women a year since my late teens. I don't think this is hard to believe or even that much

I guess the explanation is that my relationships are short (shorter than I would like, I have trouble keeping girls around), which results in high turnover

Did me prefacing my post with something as simple as that cause people to reflexively going into defensive mode? Maybe it's 135, I dunno. Much to think about

 

[Chase]

@HoofHearted,

Why? What's so great about it?

And I don't think there's actually a 'community', anymore there are 8th grade boys hanging around behind the middle school gym (don't get me wrong, I'm floating around back here too)...

And I don't really think there are elders, or hierarchies, or 'advanced' guys, either... all part of a collective roleplay imo.

I would be curious to understand the merits of the article better.

It aptly describes a pattern I've seen play out dozens of times:

• "Self-made" successful seducer finds the seduction community (or whatever you care to call it)
• Comes barrelling in, gets a bit shocked at some of the issues some guys are having, which seem super basic
• Decides to mete out some advice, and is surprised when people respond his advice is too basic or won't work
• Attracts criticism from senior members or criticizes their approaches himself
• Misunderstandings all around, and general mistrust between the hardcore "came up in the community" guys steeped in methods and dogma vs. naturals who seem like they're breaking all the rules and are offensive to community sensibilities

I much prefer a community with various guys using and sharing various methods, including naturals, mPUAs, all kinds of students, etc. But I'm a bit of a seduction junkie -- I tend to find useful things you can learn from any guy who is good. The more guys sharing their own diverse-yet-effective approaches, the better, if you ask me.

Chase

 

[HoofHearted]

The more guys sharing their own diverse-yet-effective approaches, the better, if you ask me.

Interesting, very middle-of-the-road, maybe even an equanimous position. None of my questions to you are loaded, purely exploratory, though the questioning may reveal some suspicions I have about certain concepts.

What about when "techniques" or perspectives undermine or diminish connections between people? (Maybe a second order moral question-- is it better to have 'quality' connections or experiences with the people [women] that you interact with? -- And I really do not know, by the way. For my part, in a practical sense, I just know it seems to -feel- better).

Do you often feel you see needless sophistication? And, if you do, the root of why something simple might be presented in a sophisticated way?

Have you ever intuited repetition in concepts across domains? Say, if you got really great at interpretative dance, to a masterful level... would it inform anything about what you have learned about what you are calling "seduction"?

Do you feel you often see post-hoc rationalizations, skewed by perspective, for events that were obtaining for external reasons outside of locally described action?

I ask these questions to you because I find a lot of value and insight in your articles.

 

[HoofHearted]

And, also, from such a position as described (watching), you who have seen so many cycles go by... what actually sticks? What holds true? What has been firmly tested by time and repetition in this business?

 

[Chase]

Interesting, very middle-of-the-road, maybe even an equanimous position. None of my questions to you are loaded, purely exploratory, though the questioning may reveal some suspicions I have about certain concepts.

What about when "techniques" or perspectives undermine or diminish connections between people? (Maybe a second order moral question-- is it better to have 'quality' connections or experiences with the people [women] that you interact with? -- And I really do not know, by the way. For my part, in a practical sense, I just know it seems to -feel- better).

Do you often feel you see needless sophistication? And, if you do, the root of why something simple might be presented in a sophisticated way?

Have you ever intuited repetition in concepts across domains? Say, if you got really great at interpretative dance, to a masterful level... would it inform anything about what you have learned about what you are calling "seduction"?

Do you feel you often see post-hoc rationalizations, skewed by perspective, for events that were obtaining for external reasons outside of locally described action?

I ask these questions to you because I find a lot of value and insight in your articles.

I enjoyed these questions. Response here:

Answering Some High-Level Questions About "The Game"

Do you still get those same ‘connected’ feelings when you use game? What if you want them? Is ‘game’ overcomplicated? Plus more questions on the meta. Over on the forum, member HoofHearted – a guy who is a thinker and clearly an independent-minded type of fellow – asked me a handful of what I’d...

www.girlschase.com

And, also, from such a position as described (watching), you who have seen so many cycles go by... what actually sticks? What holds true? What has been firmly tested by time and repetition in this business?

This question's a bit broad. Are you asking about patterns guys go through? Underpinnings of successful romancers even as methods / trends in outer game come and go? Etc.?

If the former, I have some discussion of fairly consistent patterns I've observed in these articles:

Satisficing and Seduction; or, Why You Probably Won't be a Bachelor Forever

I’m going to wade back into theory on this one, a la “Picking Up Girls and the Game of Asymmetric Returns.” Only this time, we’ll be looking at the end game of picking up, instead of the middle game. Worth noting that some of the examples in this article are as well inspired by Nassim Taleb’s...

www.girlschase.com

The Civilized Man

We've had some rather heated debates on the discussion boards quite recently - and what better job can a forum do than to stimulate thought-provoking debate? - with one debate in particular centering on a report from one of the readers on a sexual encounter he had with a married woman. In the...

www.girlschase.com

Why Do Guys So Often Take Girlfriends Right After Major Pickup Breakthroughs?

Like clockwork, a guy makes a breakthrough in game – then gets a girlfriend. And before he solidifies his gains, the gains are gone. Why’s this happen? I talked to Hector the other day about a phone coaching student of his. His student had just begun to break through a barrier he’d been stuck...

www.girlschase.com

Why People Settle Down: The 3-Step Settling Curve

I recently was privy to a conversation between a handful of women in their early- to mid-thirties. They were for the most part quite attractive and confident, and their careers were solid and their paychecks healthy. The conversation went something like this: Girl 1: I’m someone who thought...

www.girlschase.com

What's the Endgame for a Playboy?

You won't stay young, wild, and energetic forever. So what happens to the old playboy when age catches up to him? Does he just fade away? Under my article "Male vs. Female Mating Motivations Laid Bare", a reader comments: hard question to ask, but it just seems having children or getting married...

www.girlschase.com

If the latter, I labored to make both my book How to Make Girls Chase and my course One Date & The Dating Artisan timeless on that front, focused on underlying principles that do not change. The first is pure how-to; the second is heavily science-based (1092 references throughout the whole course). Doing the same thing with the book I'm writing now ('Pillars'); that one is up over 500 scientific citations already and is probably going to be above 1500 when it's fully written. I've covered bits and pieces of attraction throughout a variety of eras and across species as well as modern humans to better highlight how universal many parts of courtship & mating are. Any of those would be good places to start.

Chase

 

[HoofHearted]

Your seemingly endless ability to deliver value is astounding and second to none.

We all could take a few cues from that.

 

[Chase]

Cheers man!