Sexual Tension

[Bboy100]

Hi guys,

So, I've been going on a lot of dates recently, and none of them seem to go onto a second. The girls always seem to like me, and enjoy my company DURING the date, but when I text them to go out again, I get no response. Today, I finally got a reply instead of nothing and she told me she wanted to be "just friends". So clearly, I'm missing escalation windows or I'm just not creating any type of sexual tension to begin with.

And now it dawns on me. Even though I'm finally starting to learn to create an emotional connection with girls and I'm doing it consistently, it always feels like this "friendly" "safe" convo. Like what platonic friends would do. I was honestly hoping my fundamentals would be enough to create a sexy vibe, but that's clearly not yet the case.

And I've noticed that I have no idea how to create sexual tension and what it even is. So pretty much any information on the topic would be useful. But here are some guiding questions:
What does it feel like? I know that it should feel somewhat like butterflies in my stomach, and there should be a feeling of tension. But I don't understand if I start out feeling a little bit of it, and it gradually ramps up, or if its instantaneous. How does the feeling differ from attraction...or just plain lust/horniness?
How do I get a women to feel it?
Is the feeling always mutual? If not, how do I recognize that women are feeling it?
At what point should I start trying to create it?
Being that I still don't have a sexy vibe, should I try to kiss her on a first date? Or should I continue intentionally delaying it to preserve my intrigue/mystery.
In general, if I think there's a chance I'll see her again, and there's no sexy vibe/sexual tension yet, should I try to escalate anyways?

 

[ray_zorse]

Think of that feeling when you stare into someone's eyes and it gets uncomfortable to the point you want to look away. That's tension. In the ideal case it's sexual tension.

I would start with something a bit easier, which is sexual framing. I.e. bringing up the subject of sex in relation to what they're saying. E.g. she says "it is dark in this restaurant", you say "oh yes, I know what you get up to in a darkened room"... so you keep it kinda subtle and/or deniable but get her thinking of sex, you don't mention sex between you (actually I sometimes break this rule but only because I'm deliberately pushing the boundaries for self amusement) but let her think of it herself, which she surely will. Also look up chase framing. With some solid sexual and chase frames you can disqualify yourself as friend, which is very important to my style cos I maintain a very light, playful, flirty and fun vibe which could be mistaken as "the entertainer guy" if I did not use a lot of sexual humour and teasing. I'm not so good at the dark, brooding, sexual tension filled vibe, though I want to get better at it so I can change up my style based on my energy level. I would say Franco uses a lot of sexual tension though, based on his recent posts about touching or not.
Ray

 

[Franco]

Bboy,

How do I get a women to feel it?
Is the feeling always mutual? If not, how do I recognize that women are feeling it?
At what point should I start trying to create it?

One thing that I still do on dates that helps set a more "explicitly" romantic/sexual tone is give her a direct compliment at one point during the date. Usually, I'll save this compliment for a moment when the conversation suddenly dies and somehow we've both ran out of open threads to discuss. It doesn't happen to me quite as often anymore, but if you're newer, it's probably easy to occasionally exhaust topics of interest and suddenly try to find something to fill the gap to talk about.

Instead of filling the gap, just give her a very sexy smile with "bedroom eyes" and say something like, "you know, you have a very cute(/sexy) smile. I love it." If you do it correctly, this should definitely be extremely flattering to her, especially if the date has been going well up until this point and she likes you. This also helps remind her that you're more than just platonically interested in her -- a platonic "friend" isn't going to give her direct compliments like that.

Experiment with whatever compliments you would like to give, but make sure the compliment is very direct and points out something uniquely attractive about her. Chances are that she's aware it's one of her more attractive features, and she'll get slightly aroused by the fact that a sexy man like yourself had the balls to point it out.

- Franco

 

[Bboy100]

Think of that feeling when you stare into someone's eyes and it gets uncomfortable to the point you want to look away. That's tension. In the ideal case it's sexual tension.

I've definitely have felt some sort of tension in that situation. But I've always felt the exact same sort of tension when I'm looking into someone's eyes in a completely non-sexual situation. Even when I look into a man/boy's eyes, (I did this a lot when I was still doing the "eye contact" stage of learning to approach) tension always feels exactly the same. I've never distinguished between "types" of tension when looking into someone's eyes.


Ok, so I can already tell I'm over analyzing this but here's what I'm thinking:

Chase Framing and Sexual frames sound cool, but I'm having several problems with them.
1. I have a really difficult time actually coming up with examples of them. Given the dark room comment, I wouldn't have been able to think of a reply like yours. I would have just interpreted it as its meant to. Or at best, I would have teased her, but in a non-sexual way. So I guess I'd have to ask...how do you make them up? Cause I doubt you go home and think of them prior to meeting women. I'm sure they're just something you naturally say at this point.
2. I'm having a hard time figuring out when its overtly sexual and when its correctly done. Because tbh, all the examples I've ever seen have seemed super overt and obvious to me. And not at all subtle like Chase frames/Sexual frames are supposed to be. Clearly, I still have a skewed perception, and it seems to me that everything goes "too far" even when its a perfectly acceptable thing to say. Unfortunately, this also means that I really have no idea where the boundary actually is, because to me, it looks like I'm pretty much always crossing it.
3. On a similar note to #2, I'm unsure of when to actually start using Chase/Sexual frames, cause if I use them from the very start, it could be a little creepy/come on too strong? If I use them after a frame's already been set, I feel like her thought process might be "woah, where did that come from? That was super random, and not what we were talking about at all".

 

[Lotus]

Clearly, I still have a skewed perception, and it seems to me that everything goes "too far" even when its a perfectly acceptable thing to say. Unfortunately, this also means that I really have no idea where the boundary actually is, because to me, it looks like I'm pretty much always crossing it.

You have to go well beyond the line of acceptable before you can calibrate the perfect amount. It's going to take substantially longer to calibrate trying to get as close to the line as possible vs going way past it.

I'm trying to incorporate more sexual innuendo and it backfires quite often... and people give me the WTF just came out of your mouth looks haha

just give her a very sexy smile with "bedroom eyes" and say something like, "you know, you have a very cute(/sexy) smile.

Going back to what Franco said.. you may being be crossing the line verbally but the execution may not be there, and the execution is more important then what you actually say.

a platonic "you know, you have a very cute smile"

vs

a sexy "you know, you have a very cute smile"

will be interpreted completely different

 

[ray_zorse]

Bboy100, I very well remember how difficult chase & sexual framing was when I first started out. The key thing here is experience and practice and doing a lot of approaches.

I also found it useful to read stickied LRs as they usually contain conversation examples. One that really impressed me was Richard (Zphix) IIRC, he's talking to a cute hairdresser and she says "I'm just looking at you, turning over some ideas" and he replies very sexually "I bet you are!", the meaning is not lost on her.

Another thing I've heard of people doing is watching TV and yelling out sexual responses to whatever the characters say, apparently this can be a team / competitive sport but you will have to find some PUAs in your area or do it solo haha.

Also an interesting comment from fsc "I wasn't attracted to her, she was nice but I was mainly talking to pass the time. I had to work overtime to block all the sexual responses popping into my head." This is my experience too. Sex and chase framing, with practice, just naturally becomes part of who you are. I've been in seduction about 9mths but you can get this skill down in 3~4mths if you do a lot of approaching/dating.

Basically I have a huge library of sexual and chase frames that I have used in the past and which can be adapted to new situations with a little creativity. "I know what you get up to when you leave your boyfriend at home / in the back row of class / in the back of the school bus / in a darkened room / when teacher is not looking / etc etc"... or "I would (blank) but I am worried you will take me (blank) and tie me up"... or "I had better not (blank), in case you get me drunk and take advantage of me"... these last few are chase frames.

Anyway, the time to use these is as early as possible in the interaction, ideally you should be hitting her hard with the sexual innuendo before you ask her on a date, this tells her you are a sexual man and screens out time wasters.

Some caveats. Firstly I have had clumsy sexual frames fall flat, in one case actually putting her off, making me look lame and tryhard / uncalibrated and ruining the date, well shit happens, if you don't try you never get better. But quite a few of your sexual frames won't come off initially. Just take note of your mistakes and be more subtle (or LESS subtle) next time.

Another thing to calibrate to is inexperienced, shy, or conservative girls. Sexual and particularly chase frames can cause quite a lot of offence if not delivered jokingly or flirtily enough and/or are too obvious and/or jar with her self image, there's a fine line between chase framing and just calling her a slut, haha. I also had a case with a conservative Filipina in a group who was really enjoying my steering the convo onto sexual topics and taking the sex and chase frames in the fun, flirty way they were intended (women absolutely love when you single them out for this kind of attention), but white knight/cockblock dude in the group got offended, saying I was implying she was a slut and that it's offensive in her culture etc, so I had to charm him a little and defuse the situation. If in doubt, with Asian or conservative chicks follow Chase's advice and accuse them of seeking boyfriends or even marriage, not just sex. I often say things like "so how many boyfriends do you have?" or "texting all your boyfriends again".

Ray

 

[Bboy100]

Thank you so much guys! This has definitely been really helpful. Tbh, the whole concept of sexual framing still kinda intimidates me, but fuckit, I guess there's no getting around it. I just have to go out there, do it, probably mess up a few times then finally get good at it. Haha

Just a few more things to note:

Franco, I really like your compliment idea. From a technical standpoint, its pretty easy to do relative to chase/sexual frames (i.e. I don't actually have to think of a witty response on the spot). Surprisingly, I actually don't get very many lulls in conversation anymore, but I still get one or two. That seems like a great way to fill them. Just one question though, once I deliver the compliment, would you guys recommend I pause again and let it sink in, or quickly move onto a new topic like I would with Chase frames?

On Calibration: With a few exceptions, I'm pretty much dating college girls only atm. Typically, they're ages 18-22. A lot of them haven't even been in clubs and have zero experience with men being direct with them (other than horny drunk guys trying to grind on them at partys lol ). In fact, a lot them flake on me or ask if the can bring a friend cause they've probably never been on a real 1 on 1 date in their lives. Should I assume they're conservative and try to be more subtle? Or should I treat them like an older and relatively more experienced girl?

Also, when I think of Sexual Frames, it almost makes me think of the kid in middle school who always made EVERYTHING sexual and thought it was really funny. Or "that's what she said" jokes. I feel like we're not talking about the same thing here though. How are the two different?

 

[Franco]

Bboy,

That seems like a great way to fill them. Just one question though, once I deliver the compliment, would you guys recommend I pause again and let it sink in, or quickly move onto a new topic like I would with Chase frames?

I would definitely wait until she at least responds verbally. Once she does, you can smile for a bit longer, or you can move directly into a new topic. Once you've delivered the compliment (and it's obvious she's taken the "full flattery" of it), it's cool to just continue on to the next topic.

She might even be more giddy through the rest of the conversation!

- Franco

 

[ray_zorse]

Bboy100 its nice to be appreciated. About the kid in middle school it's important not to be that kid, the entertainer / class clown. This often comes from neediness, and wanting to be noticed. So when you deliver a sexual frame it's important to be at least somewhat sexual about it. I mean, be flirty and lighthearted, smile etc, but look her dead in the eye and hold strong EC as you say it, remember you are delivering an accusation of sorts, "I am a sexual man and I know that you are a sexual woman. You cannot hide your sexual side from me -- I know better than that." For chase frames you also want to change the subject just as it sinks in, however I am not good at that, my chase frames are often so outrageous that we both dissolve into giggles, but this may be okay since either way she doesn't get to reject the frame. Oh, one more tip: Attainability must be in place before chase framing, so if she is auto rejecting you cannot use chase frames to bring her back (lesson bitterly learned, hahaha). Also be wary of chase framing over text. Subtle sexual frames okay though.
Ray

 

[Drck]

Good answers, also try this approach:

1. Be more serious about getting her to the bed, while worrying less about emotional connection. You are getting too attached to these girls, you have too many nice feelings - which makes them to shift you to a friendly zone. Girls don't need more friends (guys who are having great conversations but don't do anything), they are looking for lovers (guys who can talk, but who rather move things forward)

2. Have you ever talk to a girl and you got this great feelings, good vibes, perhaps your balls start tingling and your boner awakens? That is a good sexual tension. Chances are high that she feels the same. If you can't feel it while you meet a new girl, you are probably jerking off too much, and/or you might be too anxious. Relax, learn to meditate, then try again. As far as her, look for some obvious signs: She gets nervous, plays with her hair, her face gets blushed, her pupils are wide open, she keeps looking deeply in your eyes, she is touching you, leaning on you...

3. Girls usually mirror you, they mirror your feelings and overall mood. Experienced girls are very good at it, even if she doesn't mirror you she usually understands quite well, it is like an unspoken language. Well, it is actually a language, your body/face talk some 80%, while the words are rest. She can 'read' tone and depth of your voice, speed of your words, the way you look at her, your facial expression, your overall body language...

So if you feel one way, she most likely feels the same way. She knows when you are nervous, she knows when you are (really) confident and when you fake it, she knows when you are horny. Sometimes she even knows that you are just thinking sex...

So the best way to setup any sexual frame is to believe that you are sexy, be relaxed and be very confident. That's your 80%. The rest is in your words...

For example, if one guys is very nervous and insecure, and he tries to tease her with words, it just doesn't come out right. If another guy however feels great about himself, he's confident and relaxed, and he's thinking sex, he doesn't even have to use many words to express his sexual frame...