What Is a "Bad" Approach (Neo-Direct)?

[Chase]

A few years back @Teevster (Alek Rolstad) and I came out against a disturbing low- / no-game trend we have been seeing in a lot of newer guys approaching girls. The trend revolves around making generic looks-based direct opener compliments to girls, with basically no push-pull or flirtation whatsoever, making no attempt to hook the girl whatsoever, and basically just speed-running the phone number.

We called this approach 'neo-direct' because it is technically a form of direct game, except that it is just a newer and far crappier form of direct.

Unfortunately newer guys have been reading "neo-direct = bad" without fully understanding what kind of approach we are saying is bad, then worrying to themselves that maybe THEY are using the forbidden bad approach technique!

Then they are getting self-conscious, not approaching as much, restricting themselves from doing or saying things they want to say on approach, etc.

That is not the effect we were going for, and I don't want guys to have that happening to them, so this post is to clarify what neo-direct is & also what you should do (especially as a beginner).


WHAT IS A BAD / NEO-DIRECT APPROACH?

For an approach to qualify as 'neo-direct', I would say it has to have these parts:

1. Generic looks-based compliment opener ("Excuse me but you're really beautiful/cute")
2. Flat, uninspired delivery on the opener/approach (i.e., no energy, enthusiasm, vitality, excitement)
3. Goes for the phone number grab in under a minute ("Can I get your number?")

Extra neo-direct bonus points if the guy:

• Compliments her (unearned) multiple times throughout the approach
• Completely skips any kind of attempt to flirt, tease, get compliance, or lead at all
• Makes no effort to create a hook point before asking the girl out
• Doesn't even actually ask her out; just goes straight for the number

Basically, the "feel" of neo-direct is that the guy is just nervously putting himself out there, "shooting his shot", hoping the girl will accept him basically on looks alone. "Here I am, I think you're pretty, do you also think I'm pretty and can I get your number?" --> that is basically the vibe of a neo-direct opener. Instead of "I am the prize", she is the prize. It sucks.

If you want to see what one of these approaches looks like, here's an example + a breakdown of what the guy does wrong in the thread that follows:

x.com

x.com

SCARED YOU'RE DOING NEO-DIRECT? HERE'S HOW NOT TO!

You can:

1. Open with any non-direct opener (situational, playful-nonverbal, indirect-direct, compliance, etc.). This is NOT neo-direct.
   
   
2. Create a GENUINE compliment, just for her. This is NOT neo-direct.
   
   
3. Compliment her on literally anything other than her genetic looks. This is NOT neo-direct.
   
   
4. Use a generic looks-based compliment opener YET come in with absolutely contagious energy and a ton of dominance. This is NOT neo-direct!
   
   
5. Follow up your opener (even a generic uninspired looks-based one!) with game (push-pull, teases, flirtation, cold reads, compliance requests, etc.), which you use to reach a hook point. This is NOT neo-direct!
   
   
6. Ask her out on a high point, when she is laughing and engaged and clearly feeling you, and do NOT ask for her contact info UNTIL she has agreed to the date request. This is NOT neo-direct.

You only need to do one of those to make it not be neo-direct.

Here is the easiest way to simply never do neo-direct:

• Either do not pay girls generic looks-based compliments, OR
• If you must use generic-looks based compliments, be EXTREMELY sincere and enthusiastic in your delivery, AND
• Either way, talk to her for at least two minutes before you ask her out (and make sure you ask her out first, not just go "Can I get your number?")

If you just do those things you will automatically be head and shoulders above all these idiots who are going onto social media posting videos of their 'rizz' (where they make these atrocious approaches and get blown out or get brush off numbers where the girl gives the guy her number just to get rid of him then never responds).

It is not hard; you do not need to be paranoid --

Just don't use generic looks-based compliments OR be super-duper enthusiastic and really MEAN it when you do AND talk to her for two minutes before you ask her out (and don't ask for numbers before you ask girls out. Don't put the cart before the horse).

That's it. That's all you have to do to not be guilty of the MORTAL SEDUCTION SIN of NEO-DIRECT.

Not too hard, right?


BUT WAIT, WHAT IF I ACCIDENTALLY DO SOME NEO-DIRECT?

Then I'm afraid we must excommunicate you from the seduction community, my son.

Henceforth you are banished to the realm of social media rizz wizards, and will forevermore be known as a 'rizzling'.

...

Nah, just jerking your chain there.

Look: if you're brand new and you're really scared and you go approach a girl and some clumsy neo-direct is all you can get out, FINE. At least you are approaching! It's a lot better than NOT approaching.

But once you have a few approaches under your belt, we just want to make sure you're getting out of ineffective approach strategies and over to more effective ones as quick as can be.

No need for you to stay stuck in 'rizz-land' bombing with girls and not knowing why any longer than you need to.

If all you can muster at first is neo-direct, then go do neo-direct.

Once your nerves are a bit under control and you're ready to start running stuff that is more likely to hook girls in and turn into contact info that turns into dates and lays, start working that neo-direct kink out of your game and shift to a better approach.

Chase

 

[AspiringStoic]

A few years back @Teevster (Alek Rolstad) and I came out against a disturbing low- / no-game trend we have been seeing in a lot of newer guys approaching girls. The trend revolves around making generic looks-based direct opener compliments to girls, with basically no push-pull or flirtation whatsoever, making no attempt to hook the girl whatsoever, and basically just speed-running the phone number.

We called this approach 'neo-direct' because it is technically a form of direct game, except that it is just a newer and far crappier form of direct.

Unfortunately newer guys have been reading "neo-direct = bad" without fully understanding what kind of approach we are saying is bad, then worrying to themselves that maybe THEY are using the forbidden bad approach technique!

Then they are getting self-conscious, not approaching as much, restricting themselves from doing or saying things they want to say on approach, etc.

That is not the effect we were going for, and I don't want guys to have that happening to them, so this post is to clarify what neo-direct is & also what you should do (especially as a beginner).


WHAT IS A BAD / NEO-DIRECT APPROACH?

For an approach to qualify as 'neo-direct', I would say it has to have these parts:

1. Generic looks-based compliment opener ("Excuse me but you're really beautiful/cute")
2. Flat, uninspired delivery on the opener/approach (i.e., no energy, enthusiasm, vitality, excitement)
3. Goes for the phone number grab in under a minute ("Can I get your number?")

Extra neo-direct bonus points if the guy:

• Compliments her (unearned) multiple times throughout the approach
• Completely skips any kind of attempt to flirt, tease, get compliance, or lead at all
• Makes no effort to create a hook point before asking the girl out
• Doesn't even actually ask her out; just goes straight for the number

Basically, the "feel" of neo-direct is that the guy is just nervously putting himself out there, "shooting his shot", hoping the girl will accept him basically on looks alone. "Here I am, I think you're pretty, do you also think I'm pretty and can I get your number?" --> that is basically the vibe of a neo-direct opener. Instead of "I am the prize", she is the prize. It sucks.

If you want to see what one of these approaches looks like, here's an example + a breakdown of what the guy does wrong in the thread that follows:

x.com

x.com

SCARED YOU'RE DOING NEO-DIRECT? HERE'S HOW NOT TO!

You can:

1. Open with any non-direct opener (situational, playful-nonverbal, indirect-direct, compliance, etc.). This is NOT neo-direct.
   
   
2. Create a GENUINE compliment, just for her. This is NOT neo-direct.
   
   
3. Compliment her on literally anything other than her genetic looks. This is NOT neo-direct.
   
   
4. Use a generic looks-based compliment opener YET come in with absolutely contagious energy and a ton of dominance. This is NOT neo-direct!
   
   
5. Follow up your opener (even a generic uninspired looks-based one!) with game (push-pull, teases, flirtation, cold reads, compliance requests, etc.), which you use to reach a hook point. This is NOT neo-direct!
   
   
6. Ask her out on a high point, when she is laughing and engaged and clearly feeling you, and do NOT ask for her contact info UNTIL she has agreed to the date request. This is NOT neo-direct.

You only need to do one of those to make it not be neo-direct.

Here is the easiest way to simply never do neo-direct:

• Either do not pay girls generic looks-based compliments, OR
• If you must use generic-looks based compliments, be EXTREMELY sincere and enthusiastic in your delivery, AND
• Either way, talk to her for at least two minutes before you ask her out (and make sure you ask her out first, not just go "Can I get your number?")

If you just do those things you will automatically be head and shoulders above all these idiots who are going onto social media posting videos of their 'rizz' (where they make these atrocious approaches and get blown out or get brush off numbers where the girl gives the guy her number just to get rid of him then never responds).

It is not hard; you do not need to be paranoid --

Just don't use generic looks-based compliments OR be super-duper enthusiastic and really MEAN it when you do AND talk to her for two minutes before you ask her out (and don't ask for numbers before you ask girls out. Don't put the cart before the horse).

That's it. That's all you have to do to not be guilty of the MORTAL SEDUCTION SIN of NEO-DIRECT.

Not too hard, right?


BUT WAIT, WHAT IF I ACCIDENTALLY DO SOME NEO-DIRECT?

Then I'm afraid we must excommunicate you from the seduction community, my son.

Henceforth you are banished to the realm of social media rizz wizards, and will forevermore be known as a 'rizzling'.

...

Nah, just jerking your chain there.

Look: if you're brand new and you're really scared and you go approach a girl and some clumsy neo-direct is all you can get out, FINE. At least you are approaching! It's a lot better than NOT approaching.

But once you have a few approaches under your belt, we just want to make sure you're getting out of ineffective approach strategies and over to more effective ones as quick as can be.

No need for you to stay stuck in 'rizz-land' bombing with girls and not knowing why any longer than you need to.

If all you can muster at first is neo-direct, then go do neo-direct.

Once your nerves are a bit under control and you're ready to start running stuff that is more likely to hook girls in and turn into contact info that turns into dates and lays, start working that neo-direct kink out of your game and shift to a better approach.

Chase

Thanks a lot @Chase for writing this!

This makes it abundantly clear what you and the others were referring to and wanting us to avoid.

And yes due to AA sometimes when I see a girl, I don't try thinking of anything unique, I just want to jump in as quickly as possible before all the "why I should not do it" thoughts get me.

So yes, I think I do use a generic "you look nice/pretty/stylish" opener on those occasions. But after the open, I still follow up with cold reads, teases etc that make it specific to that particular girl.

And now I see what you mean. Going for her number without even pitching a date and making a solid plan for it is lame. Have never done that.

That video you linked was priceless. Now I know exactly what you mean and now I know I am definitely not doing those kind of approaches. And now I understand why this was something you were cautioning guys against. Calling that "rizz" is atrocious. LOL!

Also I don't use Tiktok and Twitter etc so I did not know how popular these short videos were nowadays on these platforms. Just looked around now and understood that there are so many of them out there. Thanks again for making all this super clear.

I now get what Neo-Direct really means and that I no longer need to worry because I am not doing neo direct though sometimes I do use generic openers.

 

[Kvothe]

Thanks for writing this Chase.

One of the unfortunate aspects of being a thought leader is that anything you say gets taken as dogma...

I've been guilty of following the neo direct paranoia causing me to approach less. So this definitely is a nice post for others too I imagine.

 

[Chase]

@AspiringStoic,

Also I don't use Tiktok and Twitter etc so I did not know how popular these short videos were nowadays on these platforms. Just looked around now and understood that there are so many of them out there. Thanks again for making all this super clear.

Yeah, they're everywhere... giving cold approach a bad name!

Actually it's even weirder than that... guys post these lame rizz videos, but then you read the comments and every other guy is like, "Whoa, she was FEELING you, bro! Way to GO!"

It's like when you're a newbie and you approach some girl and it doesn't go anywhere at all, and you're just like, "Awww..." then you walk back to your non-game buddies and their minds are blown and they think it was the most amazing thing in the world.

"Holy shit dude, you just walked right up to that girl! And she stopped and talked to you! WHOOAAAA!!!!"

The bar is honestly pretty darn low when it comes to wowing the average man with an approach.

(which is also kinda cool in a way. But then also reminds you once again how very niche this community is)

I now get what Neo-Direct really means and that I no longer need to worry because I am not doing neo direct though sometimes I do use generic openers.

Perfect.


@Kvothe,

Thanks for writing this Chase.

One of the unfortunate aspects of being a thought leader is that anything you say gets taken as dogma...

I've been guilty of following the neo direct paranoia causing me to approach less. So this definitely is a nice post for others too I imagine.

It's a weird thing. Seems to function similar to the 'purity spirals' you see in ideological corners.

Someone decides XYZ thing is not a sign of a 'true [whatever it is]' and everyone rapidly seeks to prove how 'not XYZ' they are.

Neo-direct was never meant to be some kind of stricture for advanced members of the community. I don't think there's any way you or any guy anywhere near your level (or really, anyone past the beginner stages, even) is going to fall into the trap of doing this stuff.

I was calling it out because I don't want beginner guys getting sucked in by all these rizz videos guys are posting all over and thinking that is good game (then going out, doing that, bombing their asses off, and concluding "doh I guess cold approach doesn't work, durr must be my looks").

Anyway, in your case -- get back out there approaching again

Nothing for you to worry about.

You're one of our Skilled Seducers of the Month!

Odds of you going neo-direct are zero.

Chase

 

[James D]

Epic post!

 

[Skills]

Yeah this much better... @Chase i would edit original post and either link this or add an edit at the end and copy this... Unfortunately imho the original post was kinda unintentionally confusing

 

[Chase]

Came across a good example of a solid approach vs. neo-direct approaches... via @SpectreDaygame on X:

x.com

x.com

Set: number closed​

​

Stood at the traffic light and saw this fairly tall, pretty girl (a low 7, I'd say) crossing to my side of the street.​

​

I opened her about the colour contrast between her clothes and her handbag. She gave me polite smiles and immediately entertained the conversation. I'd say she was a low to medium level maybe-girl. She did look to the side a few times which I pointed out to her by straightaway asking:​

HIM: "Am I holding you up?" (said calmly with my body being slightly turned a way from her and with a cheeky smirk)​

​

HER: "Oh, no, no, it's fine!"​

​

When I did a Stack in my classical way of pointing out how calm and cool she seemed considering she was just being approached by a man, she mentioned that this had in fact happened a few times to her. But usually guys would just say something quick and weird and she would then leave. <-- she is describing men making lame neo-direct approaches then promptly ejecting​

​

HIM: "Oh is that so?"​

​

HER: "Yes, because I am not looking for anything right now, so... I just walk away from them..."​

​

HIM: "Well, you are still standing here right now."​

​

HER: "Oh... yeah... true... tehehe"​

​

HIM: "I personally believe that good things in life cannot be searched for anyway. They can only be found."​

​

HER: "Oh, yes agreed!"​

​

I then led the conversation to a different form of Stacking towards her occupation, what she was up to right now, etc. I think that is when I reached a light Hook point because she then started to ask me about what I was doing for a living and what I was up to now. I did a bit more banter which was great fun and sensed that there was some energy coming back from her side although I don't think I really managed to get it all the way over into a properly flirtatious frame from her side. I don't remember how exactly it went down before but then at some point she said this:​

​

HER: "But yeah, actually I am not looking for anything right now."​

​

HIM: "Oh, so we have moved on to the word 'actually', now, huh?"​

​

HER: "Hahahaha, well... yeah."​

​

HIM: "So we went from 'not, at all' to 'actually'... mmm that's dangerous... I think you know what you're doing here... look, I gotta go, but how about this: you give me your number and I'll suggest you something where we can go for a drink and you can decide if you're up for it, or not."​

​

HER: "Yes, sounds good!"​

​

She then readily gave me her number and we parted ways. Will send her a feeler in about an hour.​

Notice that:

1. He opens with a sincere compliment on her fashion (not a generic looks-based compliment)
   
   
2. He goes through his stack, making observations and handling her tests as he goes
   
   
3. She notes herself how different his approach is to the lame neo-direct ones other guys have made on her
   
   
4. He does NOT immediately go after the phone number right after opening
   
   
5. Rather, he banters for a bit, then paces and leads her onto the date, setting the date up as her "deciding if she's up for it or not" later on

Girls easily tell the difference between a decent approach vs. a lame one.

... and they appreciate it. And are a lot more likely to come out onto dates with the guys making decent ones, generally speaking.

Chase

 

[Stark]

But usually guys would just say something quick and weird and she would then leave. <-- she is describing men making lame neo-direct approaches then promptly ejecting

Summarizes neo-direct to a T.

I'm not sure how a guy feels he's high-value by blurting out 'You're cute/hot' and leaving quickly if she doesn't comply with a smile/enthusiastic response.


As you describe, it's 'lame'.

----

I've been hearing from girls that I approach (a genuine opener followed by SAC pings) these days that 'they have never been approached this way' and hence they decided to come out again to meet me on a date.

They say it's Usually the guys at the bar asking if they can buy a drink or some similar chicken stuff.

They classify daygame neo-direct as 'creep'. The Asian girl in my last report used that exact word to describe guys who had tried hitting on her in the daytime.

Later during texting - She said when I approached her, she thought 'He's definitely confident'.

 

[AspiringStoic]

This is a great thread. I feel like this has clarified the entire concept of Neo Direct and Spam Approaching and why Chase and some experienced seducers were so vehemently cautioning against it. To add to the explanation and contrast neo-direct to actual good game I thought I would post this here. Randomly came across this channel on YT. Very low number of subscribers but in this video, I think he does everything that @Chase listed above as things that one should be doing.

@Chase would love to know your thoughts on this. Would this be an example of actual good game and openers? I think you can watch from 3:30 minute mark in the video. All his openers are super specific and delivered really smoothly I think.

 

[Chase]

This is a great thread. I feel like this has clarified the entire concept of Neo Direct and Spam Approaching and why Chase and some experienced seducers were so vehemently cautioning against it. To add to the explanation and contrast neo-direct to actual good game I thought I would post this here. Randomly came across this channel on YT. Very low number of subscribers but in this video, I think he does everything that @Chase listed above as things that one should be doing.

@Chase would love to know your thoughts on this. Would this be an example of actual good game and openers? I think you can watch from 3:30 minute mark in the video. All his openers are super specific and delivered really smoothly I think.

Yes, he is not doing neo-direct. Definitely better than what the neo-direct guys are doing.

If you want me to critique what he is doing: he’s doing all right! He’s trying — he’s making an effort compared to what neo-direct guys are doing. If he keeps at it he will get it down.

He is making some mistakes:

• He is stating that his opener is high investment on his part (had to interrupt lunch with his friend to run over to her, or is very busy but stopped to talk to her), but then is not giving a reason that matches (“Had to do that because you look really feminine” “Because you looked athletic” — these are just comments, they are not compliments)
  
  
• Taking too long to get to the point, sort of puttering around with the opener. Notice girls keep saying “thank you” repeatedly because they do not know what else to say. He needs to deliver a proper compliment then get to the intro ASAP
  
  
• Compliments also need to be more clearly compliments. Like when he tells the girl “People don’t dress like his anymore” that is (like other stuff he says) not really an obvious compliment.

Like, girl #1 (feminine girl) you want to open more like, “I saw you walking here and I just had to tell you… you have the most elegantly feminine style I have seen all day. I’m Joe.”

Girl #2: “You know I was having lunch with my friend but I saw you walking with this killer walk and I was like I’ve got to go compliment her on that walk. I’m Joe.”

Girl #3: “I saw you walking here and it’s like you stepped out of a 17th Century painting, these clothes are so beautiful and old school. Really nice. I’m Joe.”

You want clear compliments that are also strong enough to justify having run over or interrupted what you were doing to go talk to her.

(if you don’t want strong compliments, then you need to frame your openers as if you “just suddenly noticed her” and approached)

I didn’t watch beyond the third girl, but yeah, that is the gist of it.

Not bad, but needs to calibrate his openers better (and probably be a bit more energetic. He is doing this slow thing to show he’s uncrushed, which is good, but you want to be a little higher energy on the opener than that, especially when it is a high investment street stop).

Chase

 

[KJ Francis]

If he keeps at it he will get it down

Lol he said he's been coaching for ten years so maybe we can get him to join the forum

He is stating that his opener is high investment on his part (had to interrupt lunch with his friend to run over to her, or is very busy but stopped to talk to her), but then is not giving a reason that matches (“Had to do that because you look really feminine” “Because you looked athletic” — these are just comments, they are not compliment

It seems he's trying to do a false time constraint as a rule in every approach. And he explains later the femininity thing is so he can screen her to put the pressure on her to qualify herself with the whole "does the personality match the looks" thing. Classic Mystery line. He later put up a Mystery pic and criticized him for pushing through shit tests instead of bailing after two, but he's missing that is nightclub bitch shield environment. Maybe he's also putting her on the spot too quick? A3 before A2, screen/qualify before teasing/flirting.

and probably be a bit more energetic

I am really glad you replied because I noticed he slowed down really slow and thought it was to get her out of her rush vibe and into his relaxed vibe after he's jumping in front of her. I thought it was a good idea but it seems you're saying pace her energetic vibe instead.

Anyways thanks Chase. I just moved and am about to dive into approaching more so I love seeing critiques so I don't go on the wrong path and waste time doing the wrong things.

Oh and he said "excuse me" a lot and also "this is really random" which I believe are also said to be not good ideas.

Good find @AspiringStoic pretty cool to see infield and detailed breakdown of someone who's at least halfway decent.

 

[KJ Francis]

Also is the newbie assignment "I thought you were cute and wanted to meet you" neo direct and best ditched after using it after that early beginner stepping stone?

I like it because you can use it with anyone and it reduces AA a bit due to not having to think so much but maybe that's the point - training wheels only?

 

[Chase]

@KJ Francis,

Lol he said he's been coaching for ten years so maybe we can get him to join the forum

Ah. Well..

It seems he's trying to do a false time constraint as a rule in every approach.

Yes, he's using one on every opener I saw.

Delivery-wise though, tonally, he comes across like he is excusing himself.

You want your FTCs to sound HIGH VALUE, almost like you are dismissing the girl: (shrugging) (she's a lower priority) "Hey real quick because I've got to get going, but blah blah blah" (breaking eye contact to the side to look elsewhere because she is not even important to you before returning to look at her again)

And he explains later the femininity thing is so he can screen her to put the pressure on her to qualify herself with the whole "does the personality match the looks" thing. Classic Mystery line. He later put up a Mystery pic and criticized him for pushing through shit tests instead of bailing after two, but he's missing that is nightclub bitch shield environment. Maybe he's also putting her on the spot too quick? A3 before A2, screen/qualify before teasing/flirting.

Well in that case this Mystery in-field would no doubt utterly horrify him, considering this girl launches about half a million shit tests at Mystery and Mystery plows through all of them:

I am really glad you replied because I noticed he slowed down really slow and thought it was to get her out of her rush vibe and into his relaxed vibe after he's jumping in front of her. I thought it was a good idea but it seems you're saying pace her energetic vibe instead.

Pace, then lead.

Tactics Tuesday: Pace Her Reality (& Guide Her Emotions)

You’re with a group of three girls you’ve just met at a nightclub, and you’ve really hit it off with one of the girls, this girl Ava. She’s cute, perky, and a whole lot of fun. Suddenly, you’re yanked out of an engrossed conversation with Ava by a fracas nearby; one of the other girls in the...

www.girlschase.com

She is walking down a street, in a higher energy mode. If you come in very slow, it is basically a big compliance ask. Some girls will go for it and get genuinely into it, but a lot of girls will be trying to exit gracefully ("thank you, thank you, that's very kind of you, okay now I need to go") -- I noticed none of the approaches this guy showed continued past the first bit of chitchat. Not surprised at that.

Another thing this guy appears to be doing is very intentionally using lots of pauses.

Like, way too much.

I get that he is trying to build compliance and slow down the vibe by making these girls wait, but it really hurts the vibe.

Anyways thanks Chase. I just moved and am about to dive into approaching more so I love seeing critiques so I don't go on the wrong path and waste time doing the wrong things.

Oh and he said "excuse me" a lot and also "this is really random" which I believe are also said to be not good ideas.

Good find @AspiringStoic pretty cool to see infield and detailed breakdown of someone who's at least halfway decent.

Yeah. You can get away with an "Excuse me", that's fine. You just want to make sure to nail the tonality.

Imagine a policeman stopping you with a polite "Excuse me" vs. some street vendor who wants to tell you something. Even if the police officer is being polite, he still says it with authority.

The "this is really random" line I hate with a passion; it is so overused every girl knows it means its opposite. It's like approaching with "I do this ALL THE TIME but anyway let me pay you a compliment."

(the reason guys use this is because their openers are too weak for the investment they're obviously putting in to approach, so they need to try to explain to the girl somehow why they're making the approach; "really random" is a mini-pattern interrupt to make the girl's brain go "Well, okay, but that reason you gave doesn't seem like reason enough to do what you did... oh it's random? I'm not sure what that means. Okay, maybe there's just something here I don't get." Better than nothing but stronger / better delivered openers makes the whole "explain your incongruence as the result of randomness" thing unnecessary)

Chase

 

[AspiringStoic]

@Chase Thanks a lot for the breakdown and sharing your inputs.

You want clear compliments that are also strong enough to justify having run over or interrupted what you were doing to go talk to her.

(if you don’t want strong compliments, then you need to frame your openers as if you “just suddenly noticed her” and approached

This!! You touched upon something here that I struggle with from time to time.

My walking sets fall into 2 categories.

1. I see the girl clearly. She is definitely pretty/beautiful or clearly wearing something stylish so I know exactly what I am going to say. So I catch up to her , stop her and clearly say I was

" waiting for my friend/walking home/running some errands and saw her from over there and I had to come meet her because she was xyz!"

In these kind of approaches I am very congruent and since she clearly stands out, my high investment in "going out of my way" to meet her is explained in my opener and I really own it.

2. Now there is a second category. I see her from afar or from the back or its very crowded and I don't see her face but I get a hunch that she looks good and then I catch up to her and first try to get a "peek or glance at her" then decide she is pretty and then open. In this secnario, I find it very odd to use the I saw you over there and came here kind of opener. I want to make it sound like I was walking in that direction anyway and "just noticed her".

But if I do this, I always feel then why am I stopping her?? If we are walking in the same direction, I should logically just walk with her and open. And also if I stop her and then the convo does not last long, then I feel I am obligated to walk in the same direction as her, after the interaction ends because I just told her in my opener that I was heading that way.

I hope this makes sense. How do I handle this scenario? How do I make it sound like I was walking this way anyway and just noticed her, and how do I justify stopping her if we are walking in the same direction and how do I not awkwardly obligate myself to continue walking in the same direction after the interaction?

Any tips on this kind of scenario would help a lot. Thank you once again @Chase !

 

[Aussiedude]

So to clarify Neo-Direct is when you give a generic compliment and then basically go straight for the instagram/number without really having a chat?

Because I kinda use the generic you look nice/cute opener. And then if they're like wearing all black I might say all black suits you etc. but then I try have a more genuine chit chat for 5 - 10 minutes. And then ask if they have insta etc. I feel like thats fine? I feel like the interactions I'm having a pretty decent when we're talking for 5 - 10 minutes. All pretty genuine, not too generic sort of stuff.

 

[Chase]

@AspiringStoic,

2. Now there is a second category. I see her from afar or from the back or its very crowded and I don't see her face but I get a hunch that she looks good and then I catch up to her and first try to get a "peek or glance at her" then decide she is pretty and then open. In this secnario, I find it very odd to use the I saw you over there and came here kind of opener. I want to make it sound like I was walking in that direction anyway and "just noticed her".

But if I do this, I always feel then why am I stopping her?? If we are walking in the same direction, I should logically just walk with her and open. And also if I stop her and then the convo does not last long, then I feel I am obligated to walk in the same direction as her, after the interaction ends because I just told her in my opener that I was heading that way.

I hope this makes sense. How do I handle this scenario? How do I make it sound like I was walking this way anyway and just noticed her, and how do I justify stopping her if we are walking in the same direction and how do I not awkwardly obligate myself to continue walking in the same direction after the interaction?

Any tips on this kind of scenario would help a lot. Thank you once again @Chase !

A few solutions without changing the opener:

1. Walk a few steps then take out your phone and pretend you're getting a call. "Hey Stevie, on Mainline Boulevard. No I didn't get it yet... are you coming out?" Stop walking as you're on the fake call and let the girl just go on. This is the lowest effort ejection that still looks very smooth.
   
   
2. If she rejects you outright ("Sorry, I'm in a rush" etc.), you can act "wounded" and stop in place, put your hands over your heart, and throw a mock sad expression on. This lets her walk on and you can do a little dramatic "hanging your head low" skit then walk off in whatever direction you want smiling to yourself.
   
   
3. Walk a short while longer next to her then peel off into a side street or a nearby shop/store. More effortful though and in the odd chance she turns the same way now you've got to keep the ruse going (so "fake phone call" is way preferable). Another reason to dislike this is the extra social discomfort of "two people who failed to click continuing to walk next to each other."

One solution with if you're willing to change the opener slightly is to catch up to her, open, then stand still and keep talking to her (i.e., do not keep walking in the same direction as her). Either she will stop, comply, and engage or else she will keep going. If she keeps going, no need to deal with how to exit. If she stops, you can talk for however long it goes on, then head off in any direction once it ends.


@Aussedude321,

So to clarify Neo-Direct is when you give a generic compliment and then basically go straight for the instagram/number without really having a chat?

Because I kinda use the generic you look nice/cute opener. And then if they're like wearing all black I might say all black suits you etc. but then I try have a more genuine chit chat for 5 - 10 minutes. And then ask if they have insta etc. I feel like thats fine? I feel like the interactions I'm having a pretty decent when we're talking for 5 - 10 minutes. All pretty genuine, not too generic sort of stuff.

That would fall under:

Follow up your opener (even a generic uninspired looks-based one!) with game (push-pull, teases, flirtation, cold reads, compliance requests, etc.), which you use to reach a hook point. This is NOT neo-direct!

So, yep -- not something I would classify as neo-direct!

Chase

 

[Aussiedude]

A

@AspiringStoic,



A few solutions without changing the opener:

1. Walk a few steps then take out your phone and pretend you're getting a call. "Hey Stevie, on Mainline Boulevard. No I didn't get it yet... are you coming out?" Stop walking as you're on the fake call and let the girl just go on. This is the lowest effort ejection that still looks very smooth.
   
   
2. If she rejects you outright ("Sorry, I'm in a rush" etc.), you can act "wounded" and stop in place, put your hands over your heart, and throw a mock sad expression on. This lets her walk on and you can do a little dramatic "hanging your head low" skit then walk off in whatever direction you want smiling to yourself.
   
   
3. Walk a short while longer next to her then peel off into a side street or a nearby shop/store. More effortful though and in the odd chance she turns the same way now you've got to keep the ruse going (so "fake phone call" is way preferable). Another reason to dislike this is the extra social discomfort of "two people who failed to click continuing to walk next to each other."

One solution with if you're willing to change the opener slightly is to catch up to her, open, then stand still and keep talking to her (i.e., do not keep walking in the same direction as her). Either she will stop, comply, and engage or else she will keep going. If she keeps going, no need to deal with how to exit. If she stops, you can talk for however long it goes on, then head off in any direction once it ends.


@Aussedude321,



That would fall under:



So, yep -- not something I would classify as neo-direct!

Chase

Yes ok great, will have read of those other articles.

 

[KJ Francis]

You want your FTCs to sound HIGH VALUE, almost like you are dismissing the girl: (shrugging) (she's a lower priority)

Gotcha. Thanks Chase.

Mystery plows through all of them:

That was cool to see. It seems she is hooked too. Like not dismissive and still focused. Even though she's still evaluating, they've both got a challenging smirk like they're really just playing a game.

@bkw I think you were doing the "I know this is random but" thing. Chase touched on it above.