When Should You Start?

[Chase]

I’ve seen this come up a bit here, especially with younger guys.

It’s pretty natural for someone to stumble on Girls Chase or another resource, start poring over it, and say, “I’m going to start doing this 30 days from now.” Some guys do hold to this, and I’ve seen a number of guys on the boards who said they started reading the material and began 30 days later, or 90 days later, or a few even a year or two after they seriously started reading pickup material. I won’t fault anyone for this, particularly since we all have different priorities in our lives and I have no idea what yours are.

However, I’ll say this: if (big “if” here) you are wanting to start now, and debating whether you should (and there are no other significant considerations, like, “I’d better make sure I get into the major I want” or “I have to complete this 80-hour-a-week project at work before I do”), then the best advice is “Start as soon as humanly possible.”

I’ll tell you from my own experience – I waited to start learning girls seriously until 4 years after I’d decided to. I’d had it in my head after high school at 18 that I was going to move to a beach town, get a job and an apartment, and hit the nightclubs hard until I figured out how to get girls coming home with me and sleeping with me, and then I got discouraged, went home, and worked at a tire shop for the next year before starting university instead, and I didn’t seriously consider trying to get good at girls like a skill set again until I was almost 22. Had I followed through with my plan and found a job and an apartment in the beach town and hit the 18+ clubs on weekends and taught myself to chat up women and to pull, I’d have had a very different next year, and a very different 4 years in university, too.

These days my attitude is, “If I’m thinking about if I should start doing something that isn’t going to totally wreck my finances or schedule, and there is at least a small part of me that wants to, the answer is YES.” I’ve discovered that the worst thing that can happen is you stop doing it, only now you have more experience doing it, and if you want to give it another go later it’s easier.

However, many of the things I’ve considered and said, “Well, I’m thinking about it, so I guess I might as well do it,” have ended up being things I stuck with and that changed my life for the better:

• “Buddy wants me to travel overseas with him. I’ve never left the continent before. Should I do it?” → YES

• “I’ve got this super hot, dream girlfriend, she’s everything I want; but I’m still just a beginner at pickup… should I tell her I want to be with her but am not a one-girl guy, even if it means I risk losing my dream girl?” → YES

• “My job wants me to take a position where I’ll spend two weeks at a time at a tiny Air Force base in the middle of North Dakota and only two weekends a month back in civilization – should I do it?” → Well, maybe no here… since in this case no part of me actually WANTED to

• “My job wants me to move out to California – I don’t know anyone there, and I’m not the California sun-and-fun surfer dude musclehead type at all, which means it’s almost certainly going to put me out of my element. Should I take the offer?” → YES

• “Guys keep bugging me to set up my own blog on pickup and stuff, but who even reads blogs, I know I sure don’t… should I do this ridiculous thing?” → YES

• “My relationship with my girlfriend is in the pits, my job is getting ready to lay me off since I won’t agree to relocate somewhere boring, and I’ve outgrown the city I live in – should I leave my home country and embark into the great unknown, unsure where I will end up and leaving behind the corporate path I’ve started on?” → YES

… and so on and so forth. Every “YES” I’ve said has resulted in tremendous growth of the sort I can’t imagine experiencing had I stayed put. I notice when I touch base with people from my past they’re all almost all doing the same things and in the same place… it’s like they’ve been living in stasis the past decade plus.

Which would be fine if they had all found their dream lots in life, but the thing is, where you are right now is almost always going to be a combination of luck and happenstance, with a little of your own preferences and motivation driving you there. If you want a life that is more constructed around what you want, dream of, and desire, that entails taking more big risks and big steps off into the unknown and spending more time off the beaten path. You can always circle back to old things you used to do later, but you can’t always find opportunities to do new things you want to do if you turn them down the first few chances you get.

Moral of the story: if you think you want to start now, and some part of you wants to start now, and you don’t have any VALID reason not to do so (i.e., based in something an objective third party would call valid, rather than putting it off because you’re afraid, which you will be with anything new)…

Then start now. Future you will thank you wholeheartedly later on when he looks about and notices he’s got way more cool things and exceptional people and enticing options in his life than everyone else from his past who’re still all doing largely the same things they were doing when you started taking your risks (i.e., today).

Chase

 

[Lithuanian]

Hey Chase,

I wanted to pick up girls through all my university years, but I was too shy or didn't know how to, therefore always failed with girls. After graduation I was looking for a job (it's very hard with my profession) and didn't find in my city, therefore I tried my luck in finding a job in another city (capital of Lithuania). I happenned to be in the right place and the right time, so I managed to get a job there. But salary which was offered to me was very small, so I couldn't afford to live in this city (too expensive). Since this city was just 100 km (62 miles) away from my hometown, I decided to travel to work every day from my hometown. I found a girl which was also doing that evey day and I became her permanent passanger.

But the fun started not with this girl. Because traveling to another city every day is quite expensive, she posts to FB about her traveling and takes various strangers with her for small fortune. Some of those strangers happen to be girls (mainly students), so I started talking every time attractive girl travels with us. I was quite unsuccesful at the beginning, but accidentaly found your blog. Since then almost every girl gives me her phone number and I went to one date. Last week I was talking to very attractive girl and afterwards my driver noticed and told me I was super confident with girls as if she was jealous. So I guess I'm improving a lot.

Therefore all changes happened to me were very positive, because I decided to do something, which others wouldn't normally do. And thanks to you Chase, I'm getting succesful with girls. Keep up the good work!

 

[ray_zorse]

Although I spent a month and a half focusing on fundamentals, the time I feel I really started pickup was when I did my first cold approach. She ran away but I was elated. The huge surge of adrenaline that accompanied the decision to approach her gave me a massive rush... I experienced it as AA at the time, but looking back it was pure gold.

I'm actually currently seeing one of the first girls I cold approached, not sure exactly when, but she would have been in the first weeks. I had to NEXT her several times due to slow progress, but anyway if I'd waited any longer I might not have met her, and that'd be bad. So guys... every day you don't approach, you could be missing out on a lot!!

Ray

 

[Sub-Zero]

I’ve seen this come up a bit here, especially with younger guys.

It’s pretty natural for someone to stumble on Girls Chase or another resource, start poring over it, and say, “I’m going to start doing this 30 days from now.” Some guys do hold to this, and I’ve seen a number of guys on the boards who said they started reading the material and began 30 days later, or 90 days later, or a few even a year or two after they seriously started reading pickup material. I won’t fault anyone for this, particularly since we all have different priorities in our lives and I have no idea what yours are.

However, I’ll say this: if (big “if” here) you are wanting to start now, and debating whether you should (and there are no other significant considerations, like, “I’d better make sure I get into the major I want” or “I have to complete this 80-hour-a-week project at work before I do”), then the best advice is “Start as soon as humanly possible.”

I’ll tell you from my own experience – I waited to start learning girls seriously until 4 years after I’d decided to. I’d had it in my head after high school at 18 that I was going to move to a beach town, get a job and an apartment, and hit the nightclubs hard until I figured out how to get girls coming home with me and sleeping with me, and then I got discouraged, went home, and worked at a tire shop for the next year before starting university instead, and I didn’t seriously consider trying to get good at girls like a skill set again until I was almost 22. Had I followed through with my plan and found a job and an apartment in the beach town and hit the 18+ clubs on weekends and taught myself to chat up women and to pull, I’d have had a very different next year, and a very different 4 years in university, too.

These days my attitude is, “If I’m thinking about if I should start doing something that isn’t going to totally wreck my finances or schedule, and there is at least a small part of me that wants to, the answer is YES.” I’ve discovered that the worst thing that can happen is you stop doing it, only now you have more experience doing it, and if you want to give it another go later it’s easier.

However, many of the things I’ve considered and said, “Well, I’m thinking about it, so I guess I might as well do it,” have ended up being things I stuck with and that changed my life for the better:

• “Buddy wants me to travel overseas with him. I’ve never left the continent before. Should I do it?” → YES

• “I’ve got this super hot, dream girlfriend, she’s everything I want; but I’m still just a beginner at pickup… should I tell her I want to be with her but am not a one-girl guy, even if it means I risk losing my dream girl?” → YES

• “My job wants me to take a position where I’ll spend two weeks at a time at a tiny Air Force base in the middle of North Dakota and only two weekends a month back in civilization – should I do it?” → Well, maybe no here… since in this case no part of me actually WANTED to

• “My job wants me to move out to California – I don’t know anyone there, and I’m not the California sun-and-fun surfer dude musclehead type at all, which means it’s almost certainly going to put me out of my element. Should I take the offer?” → YES

• “Guys keep bugging me to set up my own blog on pickup and stuff, but who even reads blogs, I know I sure don’t… should I do this ridiculous thing?” → YES

• “My relationship with my girlfriend is in the pits, my job is getting ready to lay me off since I won’t agree to relocate somewhere boring, and I’ve outgrown the city I live in – should I leave my home country and embark into the great unknown, unsure where I will end up and leaving behind the corporate path I’ve started on?” → YES

… and so on and so forth. Every “YES” I’ve said has resulted in tremendous growth of the sort I can’t imagine experiencing had I stayed put. I notice when I touch base with people from my past they’re all almost all doing the same things and in the same place… it’s like they’ve been living in stasis the past decade plus.

Which would be fine if they had all found their dream lots in life, but the thing is, where you are right now is almost always going to be a combination of luck and happenstance, with a little of your own preferences and motivation driving you there. If you want a life that is more constructed around what you want, dream of, and desire, that entails taking more big risks and big steps off into the unknown and spending more time off the beaten path. You can always circle back to old things you used to do later, but you can’t always find opportunities to do new things you want to do if you turn them down the first few chances you get.

Moral of the story: if you think you want to start now, and some part of you wants to start now, and you don’t have any VALID reason not to do so (i.e., based in something an objective third party would call valid, rather than putting it off because you’re afraid, which you will be with anything new)…

Then start now. Future you will thank you wholeheartedly later on when he looks about and notices he’s got way more cool things and exceptional people and enticing options in his life than everyone else from his past who’re still all doing largely the same things they were doing when you started taking your risks (i.e., today).

Chase

Yeah this is great stuff chase, i have a question though. What of said person is in his 30's or 40s and is not like how you explain in your article about being non ordinary if you're an older man? What if he is a regular 30 or 40 something year old guy and stumbled on this site late?

What can he do?

 

[Mr.Rob]

@money

Unfortunately, for older guys, start 20 years ago is not a real answer so start immediately would be the next best thing.

Or just get in the fetal position and cry because of whatever excuse you have you could also do that.

Haha yeah that's about the only two options you have.

By the way you're not the first over 30 guy to come across seduction material. Fuck limiting beliefs, don't tell yourself stories that aren't resourceful for you growing into whoever you want to become.

Just be glad you found out about seduction material now instead of 20 years later when you're 50 years old.

 

[NarrowJ]

I found this site when I was 33, and my mindset was more or less: "Well fuck, I found this about 15 years too late. Guess I better get to it right away then... no time to waste now!!"

So yeah, the older you are then I'd say the sooner you should get started!


J.J.

 

[sneaky_charm]

My God, thank God you said yes to this one!

“Guys keep bugging me to set up my own blog on pickup and stuff, but who even reads blogs, I know I sure don’t… should I do this ridiculous thing?” → YES

- Sneaky

 

[ray_zorse]

Yeah dudes the first cold approach mentioned above occurred when I was 38, interestingly had been in the friendzone for a year or two of a hot 24yo who said I was too old for her, haha can't believe I ever took this to heart. I NEXTed her sometime after becoming a high value man (she's nice but doesn't create the right emotions in me, too bad for her, she should have tried harder while she had the chance... she now calls, texts and emails constantly but I don't respond except a brief email some months ago to say hi). In fact, I'm now 39 and young girls love a confident older man, so I did not lose much by starting late. Also, Money, I'm not that successful or established, although I'm lucky enough to have the resources I need to create the impression I am. For example I told my 32yo gf yesterday that I'm a student and she was real surprised, so I back pedalled slightly and explained I work for a research institute that pays me to work and study (sounds a lot better doesn't it, although not technically true since my scholarship finished last September)... just work on putting the right slant on things and withholding stuff she doesn't need to know, you'll be golden
Ray

 

[sneaky_charm]

just work on putting the right slant on things and withholding stuff she doesn't need to know, you'll be golden

Having doubts about my value, I needed this today. Thanks! I forget this just too often, but what exact words I use to convey what I do matters a lot, it appears. If I use the wrong words, without being careful, the person totally misinterprets who I am.

 

[Witcher]

Hi Chase

I’ve seen this come up a bit here, especially with younger guys.

It’s pretty natural for someone to stumble on Girls Chase or another resource, start poring over it, and say, “I’m going to start doing this 30 days from now.” Some guys do hold to this, and I’ve seen a number of guys on the boards who said they started reading the material and began 30 days later, or 90 days later, or a few even a year or two after they seriously started reading pickup material. I won’t fault anyone for this, particularly since we all have different priorities in our lives and I have no idea what yours are.

.....

Chase

I get started on every basics aspect of pick up, i becam a better conversationlaist, balanced my Cocky and funn attiude, i invite girls sometimes (wich much or less succcess).

I worked on my mindset esseptially the M/W complexe.

But the only probleme it seems ican go ahead of is: going approaching girls. It's not fear, but more laziness, idid many times direct approache on girls, i'am not that fearfull of that. But since i live in a country where there is a lot of ASD and robery, this approach have many failures. But even then i don't go appraoching girls in the casual style.
And this laziness is vene greater now since i joined the biggest studenbt organisation in my country that let me meet a lot of girls.

Second, sinece i'am very outcome oriented , because i "know " that i will get nothing from thsi girls on the street it's just a waste of time.
Do you have anu tipe on going aporoaching girls ? Something to motivate me to go doing that.

Thx

 

[ray_zorse]

Witcher dude it is 100% about confidence and the vibe you project. If you believe it is culturally unacceptable to approach girls on the street and you will "get nothing" then that is what will happen. Incidentally your phraseology indicates a value taking perspective, try approaching from a value-giving mindset. Compliment-eject is a useful exercise.

Be aware that approach anxiety has many forms and still hits you as an experienced seducer. I know what to look for and have worked through the usual excuses and TBH your post screams AA to me, whether you're aware of it or not. Search the Internet for "sashapua how to defeat approach anxiety forever", he has useful advice that works for me.

On the cultural side I refuse to believe there is any country or culture where cold approaching will not work, reason being that it is in our DNA and essential to the survival of our species and maintenance of genetic diversity, any culture that overrides this will not reproduce, and in any case no cultural blip is ever going to override billions of years of evolution.

As a concrete example Mr.Wes was becoming disheartened and dispirited about cold approach in Japan and saying it did not fit their cultural ideals/norms (I forget exactly what he said but check his journal), I hadn't been there since starting cold approach so for all I knew this could have been true. Well finally I had the chance to put it to the test last month and in only 5 nights grabbed innumerable dates (insta- and otherwise, several per day), a club makeout and a lay, and there are more chicks I didn't have time to meet & am engaged in text message flirting with, so I can conclusively say that cold approaching in Japan is like any other place.

Where are you located?

Ray

 

[Witcher]

Witcher dude it is 100% about confidence and the vibe you project. If you believe it is culturally unacceptable to approach girls on the street and you will "get nothing" then that is what will happen. Incidentally your phraseology indicates a value taking perspective, try approaching from a value-giving mindset. Compliment-eject is a useful exercise.

Be aware that approach anxiety has many forms and still hits you as an experienced seducer. I know what to look for and have worked through the usual excuses and TBH your post screams AA to me, whether you're aware of it or not. Search the Internet for "sashapua how to defeat approach anxiety forever", he has useful advice that works for me.

On the cultural side I refuse to believe there is any country or culture where cold approaching will not work, reason being that it is in our DNA and essential to the survival of our species and maintenance of genetic diversity, any culture that overrides this will not reproduce, and in any case no cultural blip is ever going to override billions of years of evolution.

As a concrete example Mr.Wes was becoming disheartened and dispirited about cold approach in Japan and saying it did not fit their cultural ideals/norms (I forget exactly what he said but check his journal), I hadn't been there since starting cold approach so for all I knew this could have been true. Well finally I had the chance to put it to the test last month and in only 5 nights grabbed innumerable dates (insta- and otherwise, several per day), a club makeout and a lay, and there are more chicks I didn't have time to meet & am engaged in text message flirting with, so I can conclusively say that cold approaching in Japan is like any other place.

Where are you located?

Ray

Hi Ray thx for the reply.

First , i want to tell that i completly agree with youy about the fact that AA can comes in many forms, and what i have is sure one of it's most subtle manifestations.

By the way , i seems that what i wrote before , made you misinterpret some things.
When i say that "Cold Approaching will not work " i don't mean that someone cop will come and send me in jail , or girls and society will banish me from my town, or that girls could not respond well to it. As said earlier i made it some tiels and it worked ,workd so well that i was expecting the positive reponse, that i was't able to continue the interractions.

What i mean is that , where i live girls get approached , approched a lot on the street , in the most creepy ways. Many of my western (and attractives) girls or that lives in the west, always comment on the fact hta when they hit the road, ther is ti much guys "bothering them". Aporoach , neagtices comments etc..
Wich means that , when you go approaching girls , here you have to do it well and with subtelity , or else you will get their auto-pilot response. So you will need to differntiate yourself very quickly.
For the classic "direct opener" it rarely works because of ASD, girls reject you immediatly in order to not look like a slut on the street esspetially in public places or universty.

And perhaps all this make me lazy because i know that i had to do well or not if i want to get a chance.
My friend who is one of the gretest leadies man of the country, and member of the old mASF so he know the seduction stuff, advised me that i can colad approache but not in the direct way. He use the same game as Alek based on discretion and "secret society" this make him trick all teh system of our semi-prudish society.

My Location:North africa -Algeria

The probleme is that i don't have too much probleme going on a very direct approache but i got burn most of the time, but i can't go "casual" while in fact i want the chick. But getting casual sicne my inexoerience with girls i do'nt master yet how to convey sexuality and interest in cover ways.

Perhaps my probleme is not approaching girls, but approaching in general. What i will try first is to see if i can approache other persons and get into conversation wiht them and see if i have the same fear or anything else.

Any comments?

 

[ray_zorse]

Yeah, I think you could be right, I know quite a few Algerian guys that I met during my internship in Tokyo, and all of them do well with women, must be the direct mindset you mention, even if the local girls are over it, it transplants well.

I agree to go situational, this is something I have been experimenting with lately, see my journal for loads of examples (I have currently banned myself from going direct, while I practice my sexy vibe and intense eye contact).

Another option is to go direct but very high energy and OTT "OMG you are so unbelievably hot you should be put in jail before you cause a car accident! ... DAMN girl, you are joining me for a coffee RIGHT AWAY ... (just start leading)".

Ray

 

[Chase]

Cheers @ Lithuanian and Ray for sharing your own tales here. More fuel to the fire.

@ Sub-Zero-

There’s still plenty you can do as an Average Joe-type older guy… it just limits your results somewhat to the more average older women and some average younger women, with the odd outlier high-sex-drive-hottie who’s available to anyone sufficiently-aggressive thrown in here and there for good measure

I wouldn’t put it off too much, just get to work approaching, while also improving your fundamentals. You’ll find as you improve these, the quality of girl you’re getting goes up too.

When I started out, I was overweight, dressed in baggy big-kid clothes, mumbled my speech, and had a 10-year-old’s haircut. I still bedded some really cute girls, though definitely had an easier time getting increasingly attractive women as my game and fundamentals improved. My average quality of girl – both physical attractiveness and personality-based – has improved as those aspects have.

@ Witcher-

That’s the problem almost everybody deals with, and it’s why almost no one does cold approach. I discussed it in-depth in this article: Picking Up Girls and the Game of Asymmetric Returns.

What’s the solution? How do you motivate yourself? I see a lot of guys recommend pump-up music and the like, but that never worked for me… the juice flows back out as quickly as it flows in in my case. For me, the first few years it was all about not wanting to do it but doing it anyway, as described here: Going Out to Meet Women Even When You Don’t Want To.

You certainly don’t have to push yourself to do this; it’s not a normal thing for a man to push himself to do difficult things that don’t offer immediate gratification. Most men will never do this. For most men, if they just work on their fundamentals and practice game when they run into women, sooner or later they’ll get girlfriends, and eventually they’ll find a girl they like enough and make a life with her, and that’s sort of how it goes.

If you aspire to really get this down, as a skill set, or to access higher calibers of women than you can currently get, then it becomes about discipline rather than motivation. Just as nobody wants to hit the gym religiously, most people fail out, but the few who hang in there and force themselves back to the gym time and again for the 12 weeks or so until it becomes habit end up making it a part of their lives and build ripped bodies. So too with pickup.

If you can’t get yourself to do it, it’s not the end of the world. If it’s important though, you need to get in the habit of doing things you don’t want to do until you’ve done them long enough that your brain stops coming up with excuses not to do them.

Chase

 

[godawful622]

I must say that this is alright but this is damn near impossible for me! I am 24 and I have never had sex a date or a girlfriend. Thanks anyway.

 

[ray_zorse]

Wow, this is an old thread. I don't login regularly anymore or get many notification emails since the system only sends you one and then stops until you login and view the topic... but anyway mate, just the fact that you are here indicates you are thinking about the issue and wanting to make changes. Look, we were all there at some stage just like you are... a few lucky dudes lost the V-card more or less by accident despite having no game and making a lot of mistakes and completely misunderstanding what went wrong... a few dudes weren't so lucky despite doing exactly the same things, leading to a progressive loss of confidence... so what! That's in the past now. Dudes who don't practice pickup or make any attempt to improve skills or understand women from more than just the conventional "dating advice" perspective... are doomed to have a shit time whether in a relationship or not, ever been kissed or what... you get my meaning? If you read Chase's ebook and follow the step by step advice such as the ebook exercises or the Newbie Assignment from the Getting Started board... you're golden. As an aside I am somewhat fat and unattractive and underconfident at the moment due to putting my energy into other important areas at the moment but the attitude you gain from EVER practicing pickup compensates for this a lot. It's all about positive attitude, hard work and solving problems.
cheers, Ray

 

[Yaxir]

On the cultural side I refuse to believe there is any country or culture where cold approaching will not work, reason being that it is in our DNA and essential to the survival of our species and maintenance of genetic diversity, any culture that overrides this will not reproduce, and in any case no cultural blip is ever going to override billions of years of evolution.

As a concrete example Mr.Wes was becoming disheartened and dispirited about cold approach in Japan and saying it did not fit their cultural ideals/norms (I forget exactly what he said but check his journal), I hadn't been there since starting cold approach so for all I knew this could have been true. Well finally I had the chance to put it to the test last month and in only 5 nights grabbed innumerable dates (insta- and otherwise, several per day), a club makeout and a lay, and there are more chicks I didn't have time to meet & am engaged in text message flirting with, so I can conclusively say that cold approaching in Japan is like any other place.

Where are you located?

Ray

Mate, you should come to Pakistan someday and teach me some of your tricks

it would be very interesting seeing you do cold approach here ( not that i'd encourage it, the country is way too conservative, just food for thought )

that last paragraph was exciting to read, holy shit how did you pull that off !!

i hope to be like that one day !