FR++ Who seduced who?

[Skater]

First session in a while.

Rolled out to a sort of alt-rocker bar/venue with a civilian friend after a sausage-party poker session (profit: -$1) where I had probably pumped state a bit too much.
We drove separately so I arrived a bit deflated and the familiar nerves hit upon entering. Quickly commented on a dude's hat or something; seemed to help.
Several enjoyable but non-game interactions later, I put in the first cold approach.

Notice 7 nearby with a very expressive face that looked familiar in some vaguely odd way has finished talking to someone and glanced briefly over.
Me: [catching her eye] "Hey, your face looks familiar." [strong attention-grabbing tonality]
Her: [sarcastic] "Yeah it would huh" (or something to that effect)
Me: [surprised but still strong tonality] "Yeah" + word salad (forgotten)
Her: blah blah I'm singer in the band that just played blah blah. [testy] "Wait what did you call my face"
Me: [autopilot] "Familiar" (note: opportunity to hook better here)
Her: [skeptical] "Oh ok"
Me: [amused by invalidated opener] "I just got here, didn't watch any bands. Feel like I've seen you outside of here though. What about my friend, do you know him?"
Her: "Actually he does look a bit familiar"
Me: "Well, you're familiar to me, he's familiar to you, and we're [gesture to me and friend]... familiar. It's a complete cycle."
Her: [whatever] "Cool"
Me: [blank]
Her: [turns away]

Lessons:

1. Ditch generic "have I seen you before" opener. In this case maybe "your face is very expressive." Didn't realize that characterization of face in moment, though.
2. Keep Fucking Talking. Need to upgrade my dollar-store mouthpiece a million times. Free association exercises should help.
3. Cut distance and square up. Once have attention should have turned to face and approached a bit.
4. Better EC. Can't remember if held and how much. Probably means not enough.
5. Get off opener. Once themes of familiarity played out I was done. Introduction could help. Little shook by her singer status though, tbh.

Next, kinda standing around while friend chats to some dude. Spot miniature 6 about to walk past. Fuck it I guess.
Me: [fabricating shitty opener] "You look sorta lost"
Her: [hooks HARD] word salad (forgotten); question (forgotten)
Me: [regret] lackluster conversation with some autopilot teases/banter but otherwise devoid of game

I suppose I opened for practice but regretted it almost instantly. She was less than aesthetically inspiring. No movement in the dong, a la Jeffy.
Considered ejecting with "nice to meet you!" (how the turned have tables) but didn't for lack of 8+ chicks and general inertia.
Asks at one point if I'm a "skater." I'm taken somewhat aback, didn't realize that was my style. Later decide to adopt this as my field-given PUA name in a sort of rebirth into the Game, hence the name change on this forum (the previous was uncreatively stolen from a fantasy book).
Continued talking till bar closed but couldn't bring myself to any Statements of Intent or truly overt escalation. How commendably honest of me.
Found out her friends had left her (on purpose). How nice of them. Pretty cold outside.

Her: [overtly] "What should we do now?"
Me: [hemming and hawwing] "Go home I guess. I'll drop you off by your car"
Her: some comment about being "hot" in the cold weather (first overt verbal escalation)
Her: [walking down dark street to my car] "This is where you kill me right"
Me: [amused] "Yeah then see over there, that's the river; that's where I'll dump you"
Her: [giggle]
Me: "It's actually cool, let's go check it out"
Her: [latches onto my arm] (first overt physical escalation)

We reach the river bank and somehow get embraced and face-to-face. Know she wants to kiss. (sigh)
Kiss for a bit before noticing some wheelchair hobo a bit down the trail. Find it hilarious but move off back near car.
Might as well try to get aroused regardless since that's a sticking point. Press her to wall and manage to pop a reasonable boner.

Me: [notice hobo wheeling past in distance] "There's our friend"
Her: "Just out for a stroll"
Me: "More like out for a roll" [insanely funny to me]
Her: [laughs] "Let's go in the car"

Reluctantly get in car (small and crammed) to escape cold. Make out more passionately with some light touching. Boner struggles to return.

Me: [gambit? retardation?] "Wasn't planning on this tonight"
Her: "On what?"
Me: [flash of 'genius'] "Getting seduced by you"
Her: "Wha-"
Me: [talking into her lips while kissing] "Yeah, YOU seduced ME"
Her: [protests] "No, you seduced me. You talked to me first" blah blah blah "You're on top of me now" blah blah blah
Me: [semi-jokingly resist and twist back to my frame, while on top of her] (argument continues for a bit, but is fun)
Her: "Seduction doesn't work without attraction. If I didn't find you attractive I wouldn't have stopped. Just would have laughed a bit and walked on"
Me: [taking subconscious offense on behalf of the seduction community] "No, seduction doesn't necessarily have anything to do with [physical] attraction" + whole-ass fucking logical exposition on seduction and attraction, careful to censor blatant PUA references
Her: [unconvinced] "So what you mean is that you don't find me attractive. You didn't once compliment me" blah blah
Me: [not admitting it] "Well" + selected equivocative phraseology

At this point she probably knew. I'm not even sure what I was fighting for.
She had mentioned going to her house earlier in the makeout but feels massively miscalibrated to suggest now and I didn't even necessarily want it anyway.
We continue to banter but the sexual vibe is basically dead. Just as well I suppose. Drive her to her car.

Me: [as she turns to get out] "Shall I walk you to your car miss?"
Her: [coy/playing along] "If you would like"
Her: [at her car] "I guess I'll see you around... Can I have another kiss?"
Me: [kiss her]
Her: [keeps looking at me shyly or expectantly or who the fuck knows]
Me: "Why are you looking at me like that? ... [might as well] You look like you want to continue this adventure"
Her: "I think I'd like to go home"
Me: [whew] "Fair enough"
Her: "Nice to meet you"/other goodbye words
Me: [turning to walk back to car] "See ya"

Chill for a minute back in car, mind blank. Couple moments later think about if I'm going to text her. Realize I never took her number.
Jump out but she's already gone. Burst out laughing. Realize I now, for the first time, truly consider myself a PUA (in training). Laugh harder.

Lessons:

1. For the love of god, don't approach sub-7s. Practice or no, it never leads to anything good. Or just open and "nice to meet you" for momentum-building.
2. I think she literally seduced me. Wasn't really intending on doing anything but she was fun to talk to and it sort of "just happened" (gasp).
3. Conversation from my side was weak. Only "worked" because she kept it alive. Like before, need to train the million-dollar mouthpiece.
4. Should have decided one way or another sooner rather than later (or never, actually). Either blown her out or pulled, not this weird twilight zone shit.
5. Women notice a lot. Like whether or not I complimented and other assorted things I thought went by unnoticed. Scary.
6. Investment is real. This was a total freebie and I wasn't feeling it. Partly precisely because it was so easy.
7. Physical dominance is mutually arousing and quite natural to perform when I'm mostly out of my head.
8. Get number sooner rather than later (or, again, never).
9. Pickup is ridiculously fun and funny.
10. I'm a pimp.

 

[mike james]

First off, you are hilarious dude

I can relate to your point on practice and attraction, but thats how I thought in the begging of journey. I have realized that experience and determination/consistency is crucial for success in this game.

I have found myself in this situation countless of times, where I have an opening with a girl, but Im not sure how much I actually like her or do I like her at all. That always resulted in me being too slow or hesitant hence losing the girl. At that time I thought that it doesnt matter, but now I see how big of a mistake this is.

If we go out to practice seducing women, we have to try and talk to lots of girls, and yes that means actually going for the close and closing, because when that girl you like comes, and you dont have the skills to lead her to desired outcome for both of you, she will think that youre a pussy, or you dont have experience with doing this, or that you dont like her (auto-rejection), and you will lose her forever.

Of course Im speaking from my personal experience combined with theory.

If you got a lot of lays, girlfriends and experiences with girls in general in your life, then you probably know all this.

But if you dont you need to get trough a lot of apples to know what good apple is.

Of course, go for the prettier girls if you have a chance with them, but dont forget that is waaay better to go home with a slightly less attractive girl for your standards, then to go home alone and jerk off.

Im quite new member of this approach and I guess you just have to find a way to have fun with her (which I think you did very well by self-amusing), and focus on something you like about her.

anyway, Im just offering my opinion, no hard feelings if you or someone else disagrees, I encourage everyone to point out my mistakes and improvements, and join the discussion. We are all here to learn and get better.

Keep going big dawg

 

[Skater]

First off, you are hilarious dude

Why, thank you, kind sir.

yes that means actually going for the close and closing, because when that girl you like comes, and you dont have the skills to lead her to desired outcome for both of you, she will think that youre a pussy, or you dont have experience with doing this, or that you dont like her (auto-rejection), and you will lose her forever

Very good point. Thanks for reminding me.
Perhaps a more enlightened goal than blowing out sub-7s would be to first approach the hot chicks (perhaps after some momentum-building). Then, if they all blow me out, going after the scraps as it were, rather than, like you say, going home and jacking off with my own tears as lubricant. I still have (enormous) entitlement issues around approaching the hotties so I want to make that a priority, but excluding the fatties (at least those not causing involuntary gag-reflex) would probably be a mistake too, as you point out.

If you got a lot of lays, girlfriends and experiences with girls in general in your life

Not really. I definitely need to get through a boatload more apples before having opinions

I guess you just have to find a way to have fun with her (which I think you did very well by self-amusing), and focus on something you like about her.

Agreed. I had so much fun I lost her, lol. She was pretty witty in response which I liked, so that's one compliment/qualification I could've used (but didn't lol) which would've been honest.
Maybe I'm just a dick, but I see why girls despise guys who are too easy and available. It's like, contemptible. I knew I could have it, so I didn't want it and was almost disgusted by the prospect of giving her a compliment, of any kind really. This and her uninspiring looks sealed my mastubatory fate.

Question for you: how do you resolve this sort of cognitive dissonance? Like, how do you drop Statements of Intent (e.g. "we better not end up alone together, girl") when you don't really mean them? Is it, or does it become, automatic? Or can you generate a brief attraction for her?

Appreciate the advice and time put into the reply!