A Lover Goes Beyond

[Lover]

Almost done with No More Mr. Nice Guy. Glad to see I do not suffer from complete nice guy syndrome but I definitely have tendencies on that end of the spectrum. I will be doing some of the exercises I have highlighted once I'm done with the book.

Wrapping up 2021
so despite not actively grinding, I got three new lays this year. One became a regular for almost six months. One was the hottest and almost the most boring sex ever. And the last one was the fastest ever from opening to fucking (30-40 minutes I think, maybe less) and one of the sexiest times. I also met a previous regular when I visited my hometown in the summer, missed that pussy and mouth...

There were two more from social circle I'm 95% sure I could have slept with if I had met them in private. But for some reason, I was turned off by them later. I think my overall impression was that I got to know too much about them before meeting them in private, not leaving much to mystery.

This summer when I didn't talk to one particular hottie, I have felt terrible every time I didn't open girls I felt attracted to or got IOI's from afterwards. It has been a mental battle to get out of my shell and become more selfish. But that insecurity also proved to be the right motivation this time. I have gotten more out of my shell, both sober and drunk, and I have interacted with lots of people in night life, at least more than I am used to. Gotta remind myself of the process more and the goals less...

The thing I have to experience AGAIN in 2022 is that stating my intent won't kill me. That is probably the thing that terrifies me the most and HAS for years. I have tried to imply it before, but for some reason that hasn't worked on the kind of girls I meet - usually social circle. I need more data to draw any conclusion.

2022 is going to be a fantastic year guys. I have developed so much this year. How can I not be excited for what's to come... I feel the same way when I cry a joyful tear, just without the tear. See you next year

 

[Lover]

Short night out with couple of friends in a pool bar. Low-energy vibe today.

An only-girls 3-set starts playing next to us an hour in, and they accidently get a ball off their table and I hand it to one of them, a brunette. She asks about the rules because her friends claim she made a foul move. I agree with her in a silly way until the others realize I'm telling her wrong rules lol. One of my guys suggest we play together. Cool it's on.

Their set is a blonde girl, thebbrunette girl and a fat girl. The blonde girl tells me almost right away the name of the brunette and that she's single and I didn't hear it from her. Cool, she was also the girl I'm most attracted too. But I wonder how many guys she says this too lol

I use this opportunity to work on my slowness - taking my time when I move around the pool table, make eye contact with the brunette and keep it for some seconds before I answer her questions. Since I played with the brunette on my team under the frame that we were bad losers, or rather competitive people, it also opened up opportunity to get to know her and touch her when we were passing the cue. Tease her, break her down and build her up as well - she feigns shock/disgust but does this back to me. Good, I like a challenge. And she knows I mean it in a good way. I tease her that we would totally have a love-hate relationship and she cracks up, couldn't believe I said that.

Got her snapchat and said goodbye to all of them with a hug. The other girls were cool as well and invited us to join along as they were hitting a bar but I had to leave

 

[Lover]

Wow... so I'm in contact with some old flames and meeting up with one of them next week when I visit my hometown. Will probably meet another when I go back to my current city. And who knows, the girl from last post seems like a possibility as well

But I feel my texting is somewhat awful. I overprovide good feelings and show less decisiveness than usual. Maybe I'm just rusty because of my dry spell. Then there is the NoPorn + LessFap. I think all this are making me overexcited (mentally and "down there") of the opportunities and I think it shows somewhat...

I really should meet more girls now that I don't have my usual "substances" (porn and masturbation) to dull my senses. And despite being busy most of the time it's not helping one bit to text in a more collected way. Only way is abundance of real girls it seems

 

[Lover]

Friday: talked to the blonde female bouncer at this venue where they played live music on a scene, like a mini concert. I was going to the bathroom, passed by her, smiled, then talked to her when I was done. Poked her shoulder, smiled again and opened. I don't remember details from the conversation and I end up leaving when I sense it's not going anywhere. She's giving short answers. And now I'm certain shebaffled that a stranger is actually talking to her for this long.

She approached me and my friends when we were leaving. I'm sure I missed a closing opportunity here. I think I wrote her off prematurely and didn't realize this until I'm writing it now. Don't write them off prematurely

Saturday: Went out with a friend to a bar close to his new place. No restrictions = filled with people. But due to circumstances I can't tell about, we only ended up with this story.

We get a beer each and spot two girls sitting at a round table. We ask if we can join and grab the remaining chairs. We talk to them for a long time. The first girl is brown, the other white. The brown is very talkative while the white has a hard time keeping a conversation. We all work in the same field and relate easily. My friend is good at conversing with people and make them feel comfortable. I guess at one point the roles of these girls in their friendship and I was right. I went to the bathroom after that and apparently they told my friend that it was amazing how I guessed their roles since they had been discussing their friendship earlier that day.

Later we find out that the brown girl is in a relationship. But the white girl is not interesting at all. I wish I had challenged her a bit about the boyfriend because they took three hours to get to the town. While this may not mean anything, it makes you wonder how serious it was. Plus I like to keep myself entertained.

We moved to a different bar, no better options. Talked to the brown girl about double standards in sexuality, slut shaming etc. I honestly had no purpose behind this except wasting time. The topic could have been anything else. I enjoyed the night nonetheless. I will try a more mysterious vibe next time, especially as a contrast to my talkative friends.

 

[Lover]

After dinner with former colleagues, I asked one of the new exchange workers to join me in a bar and she did. I met her last week at a birthday where we talked for a short bit.

She is one of those cute girls with a big genuine smile which I tend to get attracted to. From her clothing I can tell she has a slim figure and a decent bust. Yummy

I think we were in the bar for an hour at least. But God damn, was she interested to get to know me, and she was deep diving me as well.

I wasn't sure how it would land but at one point just after a high point I fumbled my hand into hers... and left it after 3 seconds or so. Had little eye contact as I did this, it wasnt convincing enough. I felt the tension, it was too much for me. It felt different compared to the time I did this with my ex where we knew each other for a long time before that date. Felt somewhat forced. But felt somewhat right too since I wanted to move past the social side of things and get into romantic/sexual territory. We continued as if nothing happened after a short break. Before this little stunt, I had been doing incidental touches which she never reciprocated though.

I imagine for another time I will ask her for a girl's hand, then look more confidently into her eyes and allow any tension to happen. And then say stuff like "you know... you are an interesting one". I need to move things into the romantic/sexual territory in some way and accept the tension.

We parted ways by exchanging numbers. Let's see how it plays out

 

[Lover]

New lay!

First meeting
Met this girl last weekend on a night out with friends. She's a friend of friends. I felt us vibing in a different way than I have tried with any other girl before. Her energy is different. The best way I can describe it: She's being her extroverted, bubbly self in a way where she's not looking for admiration or attention.

She gets drunk that night while I'm not drinking. I think I could have had a SNL with her but she was too drunk and made out with another guy from the group. This surprises me in that moment, but for some reason I feel like she's doing this because she was intimated of me and wanting me at the same time, and had a minor auto-rejection. It was like I knew this girl to the bone.

(That night, we were at a bar where I wasn't completely comfortable talking to strangers but I saw a woman with quite the cleavage sitting alone by the bar. And I know what to do next time)

Texting and meeting up
She has courage enough to add me on FB, and I write her the next day. We write back and forward. I go for a same-day meetup yesterday by asking her about spontaneity and letting her know I only have time that night for some time. She is giving what seems like token resistance, and I just persist because... with this girl, I actually want to. I don't sense she will reject me.

We agree to see how the evening goes, and catch up once we are done with our other plans. Still token resistance, still persisting. We meet 9:45 at a bar close to my place. We get in red wine mood, and I tell her let's grab some from my place. We do and sit outside in a nearby park. We talk about the other night for a bit. We talk about some of our commonalities, and she tells me what she noticed about me that night... how she also thinks I'm not looking for approval. She claims she's bad at doing the kind of talking we're doing (man to woman, I suppose?) And how it's out of her comfort zone. But she's not uncomfortable.

I take her hand at a high point. The vibe is verbally and physically more intimate.

It gets colder, and I suggest a second glass at my place. She goes along. It's 11 pm.

Back home
We sit on my couch. Catch up on the things we talked about on our way back. We talk for 10-15 minutes. The tension rises again, we touch each other more. More teasing. We make out on my couch. We go to my bedroom and wow, is this girl passionate.

We fuck twice, and it is almost 2 am when she leaves my place Wednesday night

 

[Alpha13SC]

He writes about the four "modes" which guys operate in when they interact with women they feel attracted to. And guess what????

I dived in on this book before. I think it should be mentioned that that mode is directly related to a direct style while indirect style gets you result as well.
IMO it's more about expressing your sexuality, and being congruent with your masculine side with an independent outcome approach.

Didn't read it completely tho. So I might miss some things.

 

[Lover]

I dived in on this book before. I think it should be mentioned that that mode is directly related to a direct style while indirect style gets you result as well.
IMO it's more about expressing your sexuality, and being congruent with your masculine side with an independent outcome approach.

Didn't read it completely tho. So I might miss some things.

My understanding is that he uses his sexually explicit escalation, mode 1, to create a sexual frame and screen girls for what type they are. It will work on two types according to the book: those girls that argue with you stuff like "men shouldn't use that kind of language, where did all the real men go" where you break down her good-girl front, and girls who are very into it and will simply go along with it. Girls who are not into mode one style at all will reject you and leave. I recommend you read "ooooh say it again", the 3rd book in the Mode One series to see some examples.

Personally I'm not in a place where I feel ready to do this sexually explicit stuff this soon in a conversation. But I agree with you that it's about expressing your masculine side and making things intimate/sexual when the window is open for that

 

[Lover]

From my last LR:

She gets drunk that night while I'm not drinking. I think I could have had a SNL with her but she was too drunk and made out with another guy from the group. This surprises me in that moment, but for some reason I feel like she's doing this because she was intimated of me and wanting me at the same time, and had a minor auto-rejection. It was like I knew this girl to the bone.

I was right about this. She told me yesterday that she wanted me pretty much from the moment we met, and how she was flirting with other guys in the group (singles and non-singles) because she thought she wasn't good or pretty enough for me. I guess she was just lucky that I felt drawn towards her as well

On some level, I am happy that some girls are intimated of me and thinking they are not good enough for me because it weeds out those who don't feel confident or self-assured enough, or if they don't feel like they deserve the best things or people in life.

It also makes me feel like I have some choice and abundance with girls if I run more "don't fuck it up and be more attainable" game with these girls.

This kind of power makes me more confident in my ability to go for even better girls

 

[TomInHo]

On some level, I am happy that some girls are intimated of me and thinking they are not good enough for me because it weeds out those who don't feel confident or self-assured enough, or if they don't feel like they deserve the best things or people in life.

Isn't it funny how as you become more attractive, you can lose girls because they think you're out of their league

High quality problems

 

[Lover]

2022 is almost over. After meeting the girl from my last LR, we became more than lovers. We are a couple now.

This is the first relationship where I felt a spark from the get-go. It feels much more right than any previous relationship. I moved fast because it was the natural thing to do, and we fell in love few months after meeting.

I feel like my past relationships are paying off in terms of running a relationship and getting into one. I know how to set healthy boundaries. I know when to listen to problems and when to help solving them. I am supporting her in becoming a better person but she's in complete charge of that process herself. Meanwhile she's showing me vulnerability and her raw emotions in a way I have never experienced before. I think the difference is that I am allowing myself to get infected with her love, which I did little with exes.

Furthermore, we have shown each other what it's like when we go for mutual pleasure instead of selfish pleasure. Meaning that, I'm the first she has done anal sex with because we care about each other's pleasure and not just our own. We have talked about things we should experiment for our mutual pleasure, and we will see how that goes

 

[Lover]

It's been a while

As some may have read, I broke up with my ex last week. I pretty much wrote everything there. One thing I will add is that since I nexted her the first time, I was pretty much checking out emotionally. This was my best relationship yet

The day after the breakup, I had already plans to go back to my hometown to visit my family for a week. This has been good for my recovery. I spent the time with my family, old friends and going to the gym again. My diet is becoming better, and I'm slowly losing body fat after I gained weight and got a more protruded belly. Also on a nofap streak for 7 days, and it's getting harder for every day (pun intended). I miss my ex, sure. However, I think I have developed some/more abundance mentality by being with her, and I'm not taking the brekaup as harshly as I was afraid of.

This has also been a great time for introspection of course

- For an LTR, I have further narrowed down what I want in a partner. And I know to vet for a longer time. If I had done this, I might have caught her low self-esteem issues before falling too hard for her and committing

- Where to meet girls now - the most important thing. I have tried the conventionel ways - social circle, online and night game - and got laid from the former two. I also tried day game, but this was too hard when I tried back then. Most of the time I couldn't get pass the opener or even open (approach anxiety). However, I'm not satisifed with my current results. My friends usually tell me when they hear about the girls I'm with that the girls are lucky to be with a catch like me. And for some reason, I tend to attract girls in relationships. I want to change that.

As things are right now, I lean towards day game this time around. I have for a long time kicked myself for not talking to girls that I was really attracted to, and I almost never met them elsewhere. So why not???

I even went to the grocery tonight, got eye contact with a girl some distance away and she had a hint of a smile. Then she walked all the way over close to me to look around the same place I was looking, to where she was in my peripheral. If that wasn't a huge approach invitation, I don't know what it was. Didn't talk to her, but I know in hindsight I could have opened situationally, even just to chat

For now:

1. go out on days I'm not busy, and create a habit of going out more
2. work on fundamentals once more

 

[Lover]

In "Overcoming Approach Anxiety", Chase says to stick to something for 12 weeks to make it a habit. And also, you have to overcome your fears by actively doing something to overcome them.

I have really had a great struggle to make anything a worthwhile habit in the last 9-10 years since this journey started. One part is that I have been bad at managing my time. But the other part is that I think my self-esteem hasn't been that great when I really think about it, and I didn't trust in myself to make things stick. Then going to the gym would be something I would do for 1-2 months before quitting for a long time again. I would also occasionally go out to meet women (except one summer where I went out with massive approach anxiety) and nothing significant happened in terms of getting girls

So, until new year's eve, I will focus on gym, diet and going out (day game) when I'm not at work. This is me making a commitment

I have long thought that I had pretty high self-esteem. But there are negative behaviours in the first half of the self-esteem article that unfortunately describes me somewhat. Combining with the above, I guess I'm not completely there yet regarding my self-esteem... but I will get there

 

[HoofHearted]

Hi,

I think you're on the right track and you seem like a smart guy who makes correct conclusions.

I just wanted to drop by and try to say something helpful about exercise that might be interesting. Let me just give two terms

Physical training-- Like weight lifting, or programmed sprinting. Intended to produce a physiological change, hurts the body so it can grow back stronger, is rather stressful and resource intense (food, rest, etc). We love training.

Exercise-- Doesn't really produce a physiological adaptation in the same way as exercising (maybe consider as yoga, compared to weight lifting). Some people might wonder 'why' do this. It's usually not a super interesting/intense activity on its own, and the maximum heart rate achieved during the activity is not super substantial. It doesn't really require more food or recovery.

I do think everyone should weight train, but that's a different point. I think the term above, 'exercise', can be a breakthrough for a lot of people. I would suggest adding hours of exercise to your day if you can (maybe 2 thirty minute walks?). Give up no other physical activity to do this. I have seen it change people. The subtle effects it can have your mind/mood/mentality may, over time, make you feel like a different person altogether. You might start noticing that, after you do this seemingly meaningless activity, for some strange reason your day(s) just get better...

That's my tip!

 

[Lover]

Hi,

I think you're on the right track and you seem like a smart guy who makes correct conclusions.

I just wanted to drop by and try to say something helpful about exercise that might be interesting. Let me just give two terms

Physical training-- Like weight lifting, or programmed sprinting. Intended to produce a physiological change, hurts the body so it can grow back stronger, is rather stressful and resource intense (food, rest, etc). We love training.

Exercise-- Doesn't really produce a physiological adaptation in the same way as exercising (maybe consider as yoga, compared to weight lifting). Some people might wonder 'why' do this. It's usually not a super interesting/intense activity on its own, and the maximum heart rate achieved during the activity is not super substantial. It doesn't really require more food or recovery.

I do think everyone should weight train, but that's a different point. I think the term above, 'exercise', can be a breakthrough for a lot of people. I would suggest adding hours of exercise to your day if you can (maybe 2 thirty minute walks?). Give up no other physical activity to do this. I have seen it change people. The subtle effects it can have your mind/mood/mentality may, over time, make you feel like a different person altogether. You might start noticing that, after you do this seemingly meaningless activity, for some strange reason your day(s) just get better...

That's my tip!

Appreciate the kind words and suggestions!

 

[Lover]

I am going out more
I have places I can walk to where there will be at least some girls I'm attracted to
Girls are checking me out more and I get eye contact with some

I am talking a little bit with strangers again, even if just for one or two sentences. It just feels like warm-ups.

I can feel I'm much more open to the idea of an empirical approach to this stuff, unlike before. I'm not caring about particular late-stage outcomes right now. Time to see what I'm made of

Also saving the new article about the NUT model for future reference

 

[Lover]

Bad week in terms of approaching. But I learned some things

The route I'm walking from home to work and back home again only allows me to open girls on the move on their way to work or study place. The route is also in streets where the space is more closed off, making it not so relaxing.

For approach practice, I will go to more open-spaced places when outdoors. Hopefully the environment is more relaxed.

And I will make stationary girls or girls that make eye contact my main targets

 

[Lover]

Story time
Lover went to a bar with his friends on a birthday this weekend. For this occasion, Lover got drunk like in old days at the pre-party, but nothing too bad. However, Lover felt bad soon after arriving at the bar and puked twice during that night.

Lover's preconceived thoughts about throwing up in public
1. Lover thought that unknown people would laugh out loud and humiliate him. However, this didn't happen.

2. Friends around him helped him out and were supportive. It didn't look like anyone felt it was a burden to be helping Lover out. But perhaps Lover's experiences with this stuff happening to friends made him feel like he would be a burden himself if it happened.

3. Lover always thought that puking in public would be embarrassing. But Lover didn't feel embarrassed. It has happened to someone in the room before. It's just human to have stuff like this happen, even if he didn't drink as much as he has been able to before without throwing up

4. Lover admitted to himself quickly that he honestly didn't care one bit how it made him look in that moment. He just wanted to feel better before, during, between and after throwing up.

What did Lover learn?
@ no 1: people may look, but they are so busy with themselves that they quickly look away

@ no 3 + 4: Feeling embarrassed in public and caring about how it made him look are things he apparently cares much more for than he thought. But this is all in his head with little experience to show for it. Lover generally likes to look like a big deal but this simple experience has humbled him a great deal.

How would it look if Lover, in public, just took his chances with meeting new women without caring too much about how it made him look?

And how would he feel if he's not even going to feel embarrassed about it?

And if people don't care either way, is he then free of public judgment if he just goes for a woman he finds interesting?

Maybe Lover still hasn't got a great idea of why he is struggling with cold approach, especially in day time. But maybe this experience has opened him up to some interesting introspection

Edit: maybe one of my goals should be challenging the beliefs I think I don't have, but which are actually holding me back. Apparently I still don't know myself well enough. Or maybe I'm lying to myself about how I really feel about things. Interesting times when you thought you had it all figured out...

 

[Lover]

Lover went to a social dance and didn't have any friends with him. There were a couple of acquaintances there. But he was more or less alone

After the lessons were over, a lot of other dancers, men in particular, came for the party. Lover was a bit exhausted and needed a break anyway. He got a bit insecure during the break since many men were experienced dancers, and he might have been the most inexperienced

Eventually he soldiered on and danced with some of the girls. He stopped caring too much about what he had to offer the girls because he knew he couldn't compare to the other men with years of experience. Instead he cared more about having a good time himself. And if the girl didn't like the experience because it was too simple... well, it felt like a rejection of his dancing skills, but he knew that he would improve this in the long run. And he risked that people would figure out he is a beginner, as if it's a bad thing

The lesson learned
What is so wrong with being the beginner?

To the eyes of others, nothing really. Nobody's telling me I don't belong there and that I'm not welcome lol

In my own head, I have mixed feelings. I feel courageous to be around more experienced people and still try my best. But I don't like being the most inexperienced lol. Comparing myself to others is just bad in many ways

I have to care less about how I am perceived by others. And I have to stop thinking that I can live to satisfy other people.

Instead, I have to accept I will look like a fool in the early stages of whatever I do, especially when other people are involved. Dancing, apparoaching etc.

And some people may be inconvenienced by that incompetence. But in the end, there will be incredible gains for me. And that's what matters. I want to be done living to please other people. And to do this, all I can do is to push myself to reach my goals and stay committed to the process.

 

[gameboy]

It's been a while

As some may have read, I broke up with my ex last week. I pretty much wrote everything there. One thing I will add is that since I nexted her the first time, I was pretty much checking out emotionally. This was my best relationship yet

The day after the breakup, I had already plans to go back to my hometown to visit my family for a week. This has been good for my recovery. I spent the time with my family, old friends and going to the gym again. My diet is becoming better, and I'm slowly losing body fat after I gained weight and got a more protruded belly. Also on a nofap streak for 7 days, and it's getting harder for every day (pun intended). I miss my ex, sure. However, I think I have developed some/more abundance mentality by being with her, and I'm not taking the brekaup as harshly as I was afraid of.

This has also been a great time for introspection of course

- For an LTR, I have further narrowed down what I want in a partner. And I know to vet for a longer time. If I had done this, I might have caught her low self-esteem issues before falling too hard for her and committing

- Where to meet girls now - the most important thing. I have tried the conventionel ways - social circle, online and night game - and got laid from the former two. I also tried day game, but this was too hard when I tried back then. Most of the time I couldn't get pass the opener or even open (approach anxiety). However, I'm not satisifed with my current results. My friends usually tell me when they hear about the girls I'm with that the girls are lucky to be with a catch like me. And for some reason, I tend to attract girls in relationships. I want to change that.

As things are right now, I lean towards day game this time around. I have for a long time kicked myself for not talking to girls that I was really attracted to, and I almost never met them elsewhere. So why not???

I even went to the grocery tonight, got eye contact with a girl some distance away and she had a hint of a smile. Then she walked all the way over close to me to look around the same place I was looking, to where she was in my peripheral. If that wasn't a huge approach invitation, I don't know what it was. Didn't talk to her, but I know in hindsight I could have opened situationally, even just to chat

For now:

1. go out on days I'm not busy, and create a habit of going out more
2. work on fundamentals once more

I totally relate. I have been in a situation like that thousands of times, where I got huge IOIs and still didn't approach.

Try doing the "Newbie Assignment"... it helped me out a lot! At least I can now say Hi to pretty much any girl I see, and sometimes get a conversation going