When waiters, vendors or staff give your girl all the attention and semi ignore you?

[DoWhatWorks]

This is wild how different people’s personalities are lol.

I’m solidly in the wouldn’t care camp. Hell I’d probably get an ego boost If you have good taste wouldn’t it be weirder to not have guys losing composure around your girl?

Shii may even get the girl to flirt with the waiter & see if we can get free drinks…

Think people take things way too seriously (but that’s a personal opinion/preference)

 

[Chase]

I keep seeing guys saying, “Something wrong here.” But @Karea Ricardus D. is not a newb. He’s not sitting around in scarcity going, “Oh no, someone talked to my girl! I’m doomed!” Instead he is getting annoyed at garrulous waiters ignoring him while sucking up attention from his girl when he prefers to be the one doing the ordering, in charge at the table, etc.

I have another friend I hang out with sometimes who likes to be the guy in charge at the table. He does most of the ordering, pays for things, it is just his personality. He is a charismatic guy and enjoys that feeling of being in the lead of social activities. Classic alpha male of the group role.

Karea I can tell you that friend if a waiter is ever ignoring him, he will treat the guy like a dog (friend has a pet dog and uses the same tactics on her). He will call him over (“Waiter!”), or whistle at him and beckon him over, then have the guy lean in close while he gives his order, usually pointing at different people’s places on the table as he tells the waiter what dishes to bring for which people. He will be smiling the whole time and you can tell he gets off on dominating this guy who did not want to pay him the proper attention on his own.

If a guy is especially distracted, he will clap his hands loudly like he’s calling a dog back and hold his hand up higher as he waves the guy over.

He only has to do this once. Waiters all understand they need to go to him first after that.

Chase

 

[Skills]

I keep seeing guys saying, “Something wrong here.” But @Karea Ricardus D. is not a newb. He’s not sitting around in scarcity going, “Oh no, someone talked to my girl! I’m doomed!” Instead he is getting annoyed at garrulous waiters ignoring him while sucking up attention from his girl when he prefers to be the one doing the ordering, in charge at the table, etc.

Chase

yeah exactly! people forgetting that... is more of annoyance and feeling disrespected vs seduction i said this multiple times..

 

[Warped Mindless]

I’m of the school of thought that I only have so many “fucks” to give and if I waste my time, energy, attention, whatever on little stuff then I wont have anything left in the tank to deal with what matters.

I personally couldn’t care less if men give my woman attention. Dont care if they stare, strike up a conversation, message her, whatever. Don’t care as I have much bigger things in life to worry about. All that said, I have a general rule…

I will, as a default, respect a person that I meet until they show me they are unworthy of such respect.

While I dont care if a waiter gives my GF attention, if I personally like hes going out of his way to be disrespectful about all of it, I will become a lot less pleasant.

 

[Regal Tiger]

I've only had something similar to this happen to me once, we (girl and I) just made a game out of it. She clearly wasn't interested and was just being polite but he still wanted to try. I just sat there with an amused look on my face and would sometimes pretend to write something on my palm, like I was keeping score. It made the guy pretty uncomfortable but I don't think he understood why exactly (I was not low-key about doing this)

I found it fun


Having read through this thread I think I like Chase's take on it and will try to keep that stuff in mind in the future. Especially the dog part which was hilarious to me

But purely theory-crafting part here: I'd probably immediately look to the girl's reaction:

1) Is she being polite but distant? Cool, she passed this test and now let's make fun of this dumbass if I feel like having fun at his expense, or go with the treating him like a dog if I don't. She's making my woman uncomfortable and is being disrespectful to me

2) Is she flirting back? --> I would find this disrespectful and if I've been with her a while then I would have to find a way to let her know it's not cool. I'm not going to pretend that I know how to do this properly, so I'd probably default to what Chase mentioned and just do the stern look and see if it works in the moment. But then I'd have to have a serious think about the relationship

Did I fuck up somewhere and need to course correct? Or did I pick incorrectly in the first place? Is it time to downgrade her? Is she acting up because I haven't fucked her in a while? I dunno, would have to think about it and the relationship up to that point

If I haven't been with her a while then I'll just chalk it up to my fuck-up in giving too much time to a low value woman. I don't remember who said it up above but just strictly dickly from now on and then move on with my life. She's obviously not worth that much time

 

[Karea Ricardus D.]

Lots to reply to here... I don't have time for all of it today but I'll take it in chunks as I have time for it...

First of all, this is all pretty much off topic. I asked how would you handle a guy who tries to pick up on your girl right in front of you, when he has a socially acceptable reason for interacting with her... be it as a waiter, vendor, staff. And I think on topic, the best response came from Teevster - AMOG the guy. That's the main thing I'm taking away from this thread... I gotta review some good AMOG material.

Instead, the thread went off topic to "is mate guarding a good idea or a bad idea." So I'll address that real quick. I first learned about the game in 1997 and all I learned said it's a bad idea. That's the general consensus in the community. There was even a famous saying, I think coined by Stephane, that "other guys are like rubber... you push girls onto them and the girls bounce off them back onto you".

It was after about 10 years of gaming girls that I changed my stance on this. I started hooking up with more and more girls who had boy-friends that displayed this attitude. "I'm not jealous"... this fake alpha macho posturing, letting a girl do whatever, just to prove a point that he's not jealous. And next thing you know, she feels like she has his permission to do whatever. Including having sex with me.

If you think about it from the other perspective, this may become more clear. If your girl-friend repeatedly makes a point of letting you know that she's not jealous, you'll probably feel like something's wrong here. She's not actually pair bonded, or not actually that much into me. Pair bonds come with jealousy by default. It's why MM has a whole thing called hijacked my brain campaign. No good for SNL, essential for LTR.

I've never done much night game so my work with group sets have been limited but do you have any idea how many lay reports there were on Mystery's Lounge with that kind of dynamic? A PUA goes in, and steals the girl right in front of the guy, by disarming obstacles, disqualification, plausible deniability, time bridge.

Aren’t you talking about a waiter though? Wouldn’t consider that a High Value Guy to worry about

What. That's some kind of manosphere world view. In the seduction community we've never believed that you need some kind of money or high paying job to be high sexual value. In fact I used to work as a waiter in my early twenties and I was with some of the hottest girls of my life during that time.

The man has desires and you cannot control that or his attraction but let’s see here…

I think Teevster had the only correct response here: AMOG the guy. Or Chase's most recent post, which is also basically an AMOG technique.

1. Wouldn’t care

You are being tooled.

2. Still wouldn’t care

You are being tooled harder.

3. Still wouldn’t care. But if he’s taking too long I would interrupt him so I can place my order then let them get back to it

You are being tooled in a major way at this point.

Hell even in a pickup you wouldn't let some other guy game your girl in front of you. If that happens, we have three contingencies: 1. have a wing run interference, 2. take the girl away by moving her, 3. AMOG the guy. What we do NOT do is stand there and watch him work our target. So if you don't let it happen with a girl you just met, why in the world would you let it happen with your girl-friend?

Second, as skills said... if it's disrespectful even with another guy, how much more disrespectful is it with your girl?

If a waiter could take her from me then she was never with me in the first place. Would see it as a blessing and would wonder how I got with a woman that’s so daft

I didn't say he can take her. I said he's disrespecting me, and there's gotta be a way to address this without being reactive. Again, I think Teevster and Chase nailed it, AMOG techniques are called for in this situation.

Because let’s say he does use a time bridge and they exchange numbers. I would realize I have been treating a booty call like a Queen so it was my mistake

If he's smooth he can do it with plausible deniability. Btw this never happened to me, I was asking this as a hypothetical because some of you guys are saying you would just let it go on... so my question was, how far would you let it go?

I can see that you TomInHoe would let it go so far until you need to break up with her cause the other guy got her. Brilliant strategy.

Thinking in fantasy land now but you also have to ask yourself… why would your woman entertain this in the first place?

I'm not talking about her. The girl in question has been loyal to a fault best I can tell. I'm talking about how I handle the guy. Another thing that somehow went off topic in that whole thread.

If it’s such disrespect why is this woman you are fucking and taking out flirting with a waiter and exchanging numbers in front of you

What are you on about? I didn't say she's flirting, and I didn't say he took her number. I said he's hitting on her and I want to nip it in the bud, how do I do that? Instead I get responses like "you shouldn't do anything about it, just let him work her, what are you insecure?"

Why are you tipping waiters and treating them “well” if they hit on your girl lol

You're just being contrarian at this point. I was obviously talking about the way I treat waiters in general, as someone said they worked as a waiter once and didn't like to be treated as a servant... I don't do that.

More later.

 

[Train]

I agree with Karea, the thread shifted away from the original point.

I saw the original question as how to handle a waiter disrespecting your boundaries, seduction aside. Whether the waiter is distracted by a girl, a furry, or Elvis himself.

Seduction aside, the way I see it is you have three options:

Don't enforce your boundaries. Let the guy ignore you, not take your order, and provide half-ass service. Be Zen. Just sit there and wait for him to take your order. Maybe tip him anyway because you feel obligated to. This is passive.

Enforce your boundaries. Ping the guy to take your order. This isn't saying to bark at him, but get his attention like a normal, well-adjusted human being. If the bad service keeps up anyway, leave or don't tip. No need to make a scene. But you also didn't come to a restaurant to watch a guy drool. This is assertive.

Intrude into boundaries. Berate the guy. Throw a tantrum. Get physical. Make a scene for everyone to hear and feel uncomfortable. This is aggressive.

Just seems like the advice in this thread is equating enforcing your boundaries into being some reactive child stomping his feet. "Stop looking at my GF!! Take my order NOW!"

There's such a thing as being too zen. The zen stuff works for the monks up in the remote mountains because they got no amogs there lol. In the real world, amogs exist and being so squishy with boundaries is asking for pain.

That aside, I feel like a lot of the debate is because we're all visualizing the scenario a bit differently. But my guess is we'd all behave similarly and we're just talking across each other.

 

[DarkKnight]

In the real world, amogs exist and being so squishy with boundaries is asking for pain.

Yep it is a bit like the old Mike Tyson saying, everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face.

 

[Karea Ricardus D.]

Seduction aside, the way I see it is you have three options:

Exactly... it's all on a spectrum.

On the one extreme, there's overreacting to anything. The waiter just asks her what she wants to drink, and the guy says "don't talk to my girl, talk to me." This is over mate guarding.

On the other extreme, there's being totally nonreactive. Just letting guys tool you, hit on your girl right in front of your face while you sit back and just take it. This is under mate guarding.

There's a golden middle path where you make boundaries clear, control the frame, handle the guy and the situation, and earn the respect of your girl, all without ever coming across as reactive.

That aside, I feel like a lot of the debate is because we're all visualizing the scenario a bit differently. But my guess is we'd all behave similarly and we're just talking across each other.

Yeah, I've been thinking that too... probably guys imagine a different kind of situation or relationship and hence different reactions.

Again - if you wouldn't let another guy work your target, a girl you just met, why would you sit back and just watch as he works your own GF? Makes no sense. But maybe people are really imagining different subtleties.

-Karea.

 

[topcat]

Exactly... it's all on a spectrum.

On the one extreme, there's overreacting to anything. The waiter just asks her what she wants to drink, and the guy says "don't talk to my girl, talk to me." This is over mate guarding.

On the other extreme, there's being totally nonreactive. Just letting guys tool you, hit on your girl right in front of your face while you sit back and just take it. This is under mate guarding.

There's a golden middle path where you make boundaries clear, control the frame, handle the guy and the situation, and earn the respect of your girl, all without ever coming across as reactive.

Yeah, I've been thinking that too... probably guys imagine a different kind of situation or relationship and hence different reactions.

Again - if you wouldn't let another guy work your target, a girl you just met, why would you sit back and just watch as he works your own GF? Makes no sense. But maybe people are really imagining different subtleties.

-Karea.

I just wonder why mate guard in the first place? What purpose does it serve? Why is any one girl so important? Maybe it’s my avoidance talking (never been mono in my life, does that disqualify me?) but many of us experienced guys have fucked chicks in relationships/with boyfriends..is that an accomplishment? I really don’t get why it’s so important to protect your honour over some broad flirting with another dude. She knows what she’s doing, if she crosses a line it was SHE that was disrespecting. Set her free. Or don’t. Why does it matter??

There’s pussy everywhere, we know this. Love isn’t in short supply either. Why raise your hackles over one?

Jealousy = pair bonding is another interesting take, i’m still trying to wrap my head around.

Interesting convo.

 

[Will_V]

I asked how would you handle a guy who tries to pick up on your girl right in front of you, when he has a socially acceptable reason for interacting with her... be it as a waiter, vendor, staff.

Wait what, I thought this was about waiters deferring attention to your girl while describing the menu?

There's a huge difference between a guy who can't help getting distracted while still doing his job, and a guy who is actively trying to get in her pants. It's like if you have a ferrari, you can't equate people staring at it as they walk past on the footpath to someone going up and trying the door handles.

I can understand the feeling of disrespect if a guy is addressing answers to your questions to your girl because that's just where his subconscious attention keeps going, and I think it's a good idea to move to direct attention back toward yourself, but I wouldn't feel threatened by this.

If a guy is trying to pick her up I would absolutely stop it, by intervening and shutting down or redirecting the interaction. Because that's how guys need to be treated when they are crossing lines. But until he's doing that he's just a guy getting distracted by a hot girl as guys do.

 

[Skills]

If some waiter does that, i will ask him if he wants to fuck my girl and if so, that he can join us for a threesome but only if he shows us his dick. He will freak out and leave you the fuck alone. If he says yes, report him to his manager.

Field tested although in other contexts. They usually freak out and leave you alone.

The key to amoging is to make the other man uncomfortable.

-Teevster

this is exactly what i do... they get uncomfortable and they leave ( @Karea Ricardus D. isn't this the same as the sample i showed you in the lr quote)...

P.s. Anyways guys there is a problem in this post at the different types of males(sigmas vs alphas) and attitudes, both can handle the situation different ways no right or wrong(Friday I will make a post on this to not derail) different types of males talking to each other in this post, the reason why it seems people talking pass each other).... I have been the different types through my journey so i can see it a mile away....

 

[MuST0BtA1NSkR1Lla]

How do you guys deal with this? You're out with a girl (not during a pickup, but when you're already going out together) and males you interact with get so sucked into her presence that they can't stop staring at her while talking to the both of you.

This happens with vendors, waiters, dealers, you name it, and it even happens when I grab threads. Like I'll take over the conversation, direct questions and commands to the waiter... he'll acknowledge me with a quick glance and then directs the answer to my question at my girl.

It doesn't happen with every beautiful girl, only with the kind where at first glance guys go "wow! who the fuck is that?".

A few things are weird about this...

1. With some guys it doesn't even seem to be intentional. It's like they get hypnotized and can't stop staring at her. Not deliberate disrespect. They sometimes glance my way but get sucked back into her presence. (other guys however seem to just try flirt and not give a shit she's with a guy).
2. It's not about an intimidation factor... I'm tall and quite big guy, but this even happens with small guys. Like they just can't help it, and their etiquette goes out the window.
3. It's very subtle, it's just eye contact... I feel like you can't well verbally call out eye contact. That would seem like a bigger social violation than what the guys are doing... seems reactive.
4. Half the time it doesn't feel like a threat. Like... if the guy is so thrown off his center by her presence, she's obviously way out of his league. But the disrespect of hardly being talked to or looked at still bothers me.

I've been in this situation a number of times again recently and was wondering how you guys handle it. I even talked to her about it, cause it was so blatant a couple of times. She said if it was the other way round (a girl ignoring her and talking only to me) she'd get pissy and get in the girl's face in some way lol.

Once I told a waiter "yo, there's 2 people here" after he ignore me for a couple of minutes (even when I directed questions at him, he'd answer, but look at her). It seemed to really jolt him, but it still felt too reactive.

If you've had this happen, how do you deal with it?

Depends many options for this,

Take a leave Is pretty fantastic. Go for a smoke, go to the washroom etc…etc….

If it’s super annoying can do a casual, “What would you recommend off the menu?” And that’ll get repoire going in your favour.

Could wear casual clothing that has something interesting to talk about. Perhaps a snap back jay from a popular tv show etc…etc…

Or even better don’t tip if you feel like you’ve gotten lousy service.

I use to have this happen all the time when I was younger and now that I’m getting closer to my thirties I’m treated a lot better.

BUT note I have a lot of experience dealing with this sort of shit because nearly every bar in my area is required to be a sit down restaurant.