163 girls fucked and still think of your 3 months relationship ?

[nolimits]

Hey Guys,

update here.

i just saw this 40 year old chick last night, and she took me out to dinner after we banged, she flattered me the whole evening with huge compliments and told me twice that she wanted to introduce me to her friends.

Then she said if I can block a Sunday out of my schedule so she can sleep with me etc


when she asked me ‘ if you want you can meet my best friend and we can have dinner with her ‘ I replied ‘ yeah .. why not ( with a somewhat bored tonality ) the implication being that how come she wants me to play the boyfriend if she still wants other dicks ?

Of course while I was fucking her and she was orgasming I tried the ol trick ‘ tell me that your pussy is mine ‘

but it did not work.

I also slapped her and she said ‘ don’t slap me too much - which I ignored ‘ implying other men might bang her.

feels like she wants me to play sexy boyfriend while experimenting on the side.

i think I will slowly decrease investment , disappear from her life now and IF she contacts me again In a couple weeks and proposes me that dinner, I’m wondering.. shall I go ?

Or tell her, look I can come this time but in general this is only something I do with girlfriends ? In a very lighthearted tone, almost bored.


also.. for the exit phase : would you rather disappear with an ultimatum where you say ‘ look I like you but this ain’t for me, I’d rather set you free to pursue your dreams of being wild and free. ‘

consider as well that she sees me as this playboy who might leave her just because she is older, so I don’t know.. if that’s a really issue or classic female bullshit, but if it was an issue maybe addressing it in the ultimatum ?

the alternative is simply disappearing and telling her this by text if she asks me out.

 

[Karea Ricardus D.]

All of the veterans opinion here would be cool to have especially the masters like

@Ka Ricardus D.

Hey man... I agree with everything DWW wrote, first off.

I was in a very similar situation 16 years ago now. I had fallen for a party girl and she was attached to me but not as much as me to her so we kept fucking 3-4 times a week with no commitment.

I knew that she has to ask for commitment first, and one day she popped the question: "So... tell me... what are we? do you see this going somewhere more serious?" I thought she was asking for commitment and kinda said yes and then she pulled the rug. Ha! Clever girl.

Like yours she had just come out of a very long relationship and didn't want another one yet. Like yours, she wasn't even the hottest girl I was dating, at the time I had her at an 8 and another one of my FBs at a solid 10 but, love is blind yes?

I was in a tug of war for about 6 months with this girl cause I already had a lot of community knowledge and she was a natural... we both knew all the games people play and we played them on each other hardcore.

I was still talking to my first mentor then and he described it as a "sweet pain"... I think that hits the nail on the head. The ultimate in samsara duality, a lot of pleasure like you're high on a hard drug, then some days hard come downs / hangovers...

It was very interesting and educational and taught me everything to do and not to do. I lost her in the end but that was the last time it happened, after that I had it in check, and I have fixed it for many clients when I was still coaching for (and for friends). There's a method.

Here's the deal, you are in a passion trap and you need to flip it. It's not easy but it can be done. Quick recap of the passion trap... the feeling of being in love (attached) is biochemically linked to the feeling of being "out of control". The same part of the brain processes both feelings.

That means when you first meet a girl, you both don't know where you stand with each other, so you both feel a bit out of control of the situation. At some point it flips. One person communicates more interest, the other person then feels more secure.

This feeling of security makes them feel "in control"... and since being in love is literally linked to feeling "out of control" on a physiological level, they now feel a little bit less in love. The other person notices this, feels even less in control, and hence more in love.

This kind of imbalance is very difficult to fix, but not impossible. The book by the way doesn't have any workable solutions. It's all pop psychology gibberish about "communicate more", which sounds nice but doesn't actually work.

We know the cause now, she's feeling too much in control of the situation. She's obviously attached to you on some level because she keeps coming back. Just she's less attached than you and that very fact keeps the passion trap LOCKED in place.

So to move the see-saw the other way, you have to make her feel a bit less in control of the situation. And you know what I've found? One of the old community classics from 20 years ago is the best solution for this. The David DeAngelo "wuss cure".

It goes something like... take the needle out of your arm... and just pull back a little. Call her once for every 3 times she calls you. Text her once for every 3 times she texts you. Doesn't mean ignore her texts, just initiate 3 times less than she does, etc.

It's very important to do this in a way that's totally casual. Never should come across like you're doing it to punish her, or because you're upset or hurt. The frame is, you just got a lot going on (which you do), but when she does initiate, you treat her like a friend (with benefits). Never pouting.

Something else you can do to increase her attraction for you is introducing some jealousy, but this is a very dangerous tool in your arsenal right now because two can play this game. And if she plays that card, it will affect you more than it'll affect her.

That said, she seems to already be talking about other guys, so I wouldn't feel bad about reciprocating. It just again has to come across nonchalant, not like you're trying to get a reaction out of her, not as a tit for tat.

So as DWW said, you don't give her the ultimatum, because that's basically telling her that you really need her and absolutely can't stand not having her. That gives her more control, not less. Makes the passion trap worse.

You also don't disappear, cause it also communicates that you are hurt, and hence more in love than her, i.e. she has more control and you have less, hence again locking the passion trap in further.

The solution is to dial your investment back to one third of the investment she is giving you, but all in a very casual way like you got distracted by life, never like you are hurt, upset or pouting.

I'll say this won't be easy cause your emotions will keep pulling you to break all these rules and text her more than this 1:3 ratio but fortunately we are men and can put our left brain hemisphere in charge of this kind of thing and just play it by the book and by the numbers.

If you haven't messed it up beyond repair yet to where she thinks you're insecure and needy, this should flip the dynamic in your favor. Most importantly it will cure your one-itis as you will, little by little, regain control... and hence, fall out of love little by little.

Keep spinning plates and creating abundance while you do this, it will make it easier, and I would also stop doing 20 approaches a day (unless for warmups) and rather zone in on girls you really like as much or more as the one-itis, as discussed before...

Hope that helps, curious to see where it goes from here...

 

[nolimits]

Hey man... I agree with everything DWW wrote, first off.

I was in a very similar situation 16 years ago now. I had fallen for a party girl and she was attached to me but not as much as me to her so we kept fucking 3-4 times a week with no commitment.

I knew that she has to ask for commitment first, and one day she popped the question: "So... tell me... what are we? do you see this going somewhere more serious?" I thought she was asking for commitment and kinda said yes and then she pulled the rug. Ha! Clever girl.

Like yours she had just come out of a very long relationship and didn't want another one yet. Like yours, she wasn't even the hottest girl I was dating, at the time I had her at an 8 and another one of my FBs at a solid 10 but, love is blind yes?

I was in a tug of war for about 6 months with this girl cause I already had a lot of community knowledge and she was a natural... we both knew all the games people play and we played them on each other hardcore.

I was still talking to my first mentor then and he described it as a "sweet pain"... I think that hits the nail on the head. The ultimate in samsara duality, a lot of pleasure like you're high on a hard drug, then some days hard come downs / hangovers...

It was very interesting and educational and taught me everything to do and not to do. I lost her in the end but that was the last time it happened, after that I had it in check, and I have fixed it for many clients when I was still coaching for (and for friends). There's a method.

Here's the deal, you are in a passion trap and you need to flip it. It's not easy but it can be done. Quick recap of the passion trap... the feeling of being in love (attached) is biochemically linked to the feeling of being "out of control". The same part of the brain processes both feelings.

That means when you first meet a girl, you both don't know where you stand with each other, so you both feel a bit out of control of the situation. At some point it flips. One person communicates more interest, the other person then feels more secure.

This feeling of security makes them feel "in control"... and since being in love is literally linked to feeling "out of control" on a physiological level, they now feel a little bit less in love. The other person notices this, feels even less in control, and hence more in love.

This kind of imbalance is very difficult to fix, but not impossible. The book by the way doesn't have any workable solutions. It's all pop psychology gibberish about "communicate more", which sounds nice but doesn't actually work.

We know the cause now, she's feeling too much in control of the situation. She's obviously attached to you on some level because she keeps coming back. Just she's less attached than you and that very fact keeps the passion trap LOCKED in place.

So to move the see-saw the other way, you have to make her feel a bit less in control of the situation. And you know what I've found? One of the old community classics from 20 years ago is the best solution for this. The David DeAngelo "wuss cure".

It goes something like... take the needle out of your arm... and just pull back a little. Call her once for every 3 times she calls you. Text her once for every 3 times she texts you. Doesn't mean ignore her texts, just initiate 3 times less than she does, etc.

It's very important to do this in a way that's totally casual. Never should come across like you're doing it to punish her, or because you're upset or hurt. The frame is, you just got a lot going on (which you do), but when she does initiate, you treat her like a friend (with benefits). Never pouting.

Something else you can do to increase her attraction for you is introducing some jealousy, but this is a very dangerous tool in your arsenal right now because two can play this game. And if she plays that card, it will affect you more than it'll affect her.

That said, she seems to already be talking about other guys, so I wouldn't feel bad about reciprocating. It just again has to come across nonchalant, not like you're trying to get a reaction out of her, not as a tit for tat.

So as DWW said, you don't give her the ultimatum, because that's basically telling her that you really need her and absolutely can't stand not having her. That gives her more control, not less. Makes the passion trap worse.

You also don't disappear, cause it also communicates that you are hurt, and hence more in love than her, i.e. she has more control and you have less, hence again locking the passion trap in further.

The solution is to dial your investment back to one third of the investment she is giving you, but all in a very casual way like you got distracted by life, never like you are hurt, upset or pouting.

I'll say this won't be easy cause your emotions will keep pulling you to break all these rules and text her more than this 1:3 ratio but fortunately we are men and can put our left brain hemisphere in charge of this kind of thing and just play it by the book and by the numbers.

If you haven't messed it up beyond repair yet to where she thinks you're insecure and needy, this should flip the dynamic in your favor. Most importantly it will cure your one-itis as you will, little by little, regain control... and hence, fall out of love little by little.

Keep spinning plates and creating abundance while you do this, it will make it easier, and I would also stop doing 20 approaches a day (unless for warmups) and rather zone in on girls you really like as much or more as the one-itis, as discussed before...

Hope that helps, curious to see where it goes from here...

Thanks man !

Phenomenal post, it gives me hope and I agree with you that it can make you better at controlling yourself which is a phenomenal life skill.

I have one question, would you go meet her friend if she asks again or not ?

Of course not in a happy puppy dog way but with the logic that maybe her friend sells me.

i think I played it pretty well in terms of how I answered the idea proposition ( a yes but not so enthousiastic )

but would you go meet her friends ?

also, concerning the 1:3 rule, for instance, the first 3 times it was me who initiated contact.

According to your rule now I should wait for her to asks me out ?

So if you see her less often because of this rule, it doesn’t matter. Better not to see her and let her screw other guys (which she still will for you don’t see her daily) and focus on something else/other chicks and work on reversing the investment ratio ?

So you don’t just reduce your investment but work to have her maximize hers. Which is probably going to be gradual.

I will follow your advice on approaches and maybe do 2-4 a day but more qualitative.

will also try to keep seeing a fashion model I ve banged which is high body count but hot and I like her.

Love your posts as always.

 

[DoWhatWorks]

@nolimits chiming in on whether you should meet the friend. I’d say no. Maybe after she’s asked 2-3 times but definitely not the first time.

It’s a form of BF investment and best believe there are guys fucking her without doing much.

Some dark (but effective) game is to say yes then cancel on her last minute. That will make her feel out of control & that she “almost” had you which is even more powerful then you saying no upfront…

Ask me how I know

Make her work for it… It’s how she’ll fall for you and how you’ll feel more in control.

Above all else - get new girls who you like as much if not more

 

[TomInHo]

Okay let me chime in again... and of course @DoWhatWorks has already given you solid advice

Hey Guys,

update here.

i just saw this 40 year old chick last night, and she took me out to dinner after we banged, she flattered me the whole evening with huge compliments and told me twice that she wanted to introduce me to her friends.

Then she said if I can block a Sunday out of my schedule so she can sleep with me etc

when she asked me ‘ if you want you can meet my best friend and we can have dinner with her ‘ I replied ‘ yeah .. why not ( with a somewhat bored tonality ) the implication being that how come she wants me to play the boyfriend if she still wants other dicks ?

Lol... She want you to play the BF role because it's cuffing season. This is the time of year when women feel a lot of social pressure to have a MAIN man in their life.

I hate to break it to you, but it doesn't mean you are her first choice either. Women get desperate during this time and are willing to boyfriend up almost any dude

Of course while I was fucking her and she was orgasming I tried the ol trick ‘ tell me that your pussy is mine ‘

but it did not work.

I also slapped her and she said ‘ don’t slap me too much - which I ignored ‘ implying other men might bang her.

You have good intuition.

She is probably doing this same spiel with the other guys too. Looking to see who is going to make the best BF and because you have been so judge-mental in the past, she will not tell you about the other guys because she feels like doing so would ruin her campaign with you

feels like she wants me to play sexy boyfriend while experimenting on the side.

Most likely. But why do you care so much?

i think I will slowly decrease investment , disappear from her life now and IF she contacts me again In a couple weeks and proposes me that dinner, I’m wondering.. shall I go ?

You're thinking way too much G

I know it's hard when you really like a girl but you got to slow down. Let her come to you at her own pace. Accept the compliments, accept the dates and sex. And forget about locking her down

Let her chase the relationship for a change

Or tell her, look I can come this time but in general this is only something I do with girlfriends ? In a very lighthearted tone, almost bored.

Stop it!

Stop these silly ultimatums. They make you look weak and pathetic in her eyes and if you keep doing them she just going to keep lying to you and never take you seriously as a man to fully submit to

also.. for the exit phase : would you rather disappear with an ultimatum where you say ‘ look I like you but this ain’t for me, I’d rather set you free to pursue your dreams of being wild and free. ‘

A better way would be to flip the script

"Look babe! I really like you and want you to be happy. But I need to be free and have fun with other women. You can stay if you want and you can see other men too, but this is just the way I am. And I only want to be with someone that can fully accept me for me"

This will mindfuck the shit out of her.... because guys never do this

Most guys when they get a whiff of consistent pussy are always looking for ways to lock her down. But when you do the opposite, it sets you apart from the flock

She will wonder.... "I can tell he cares about me a lot. But why doesn't he want only me. Why isn't he scared if another man would steal me away from him. Who the fuck is this man and how can I capture him"

consider as well that she sees me as this playboy who might leave her just because she is older, so I don’t know.. if that’s a really issue or classic female bullshit, but if it was an issue maybe addressing it in the ultimatum ?

You need to take the word ultimatum out of your vocabulary for real. I admit that this is not an easy situation to be in but in this case the least needy and most dominant male always wins

I've been in these situations a lot, and in the end it's usually the woman begging to be with me. Because in these situations the girl sees you as her pimp and those other guys as her tricks

And I'm sorry to say but you are the trick in this situation but you can turn the situation around with patience and solid frame control

Good Luck


MASSIVE EDIT
Okay so I just read @Karea Ricardus D. response and agree with the passion trap. So let me give you some actionable things you can do to correct this imbalance of power. Warning this is some dark stuff so don't say I didn't warn you

1) Encourage her to date other guys
Yup! I said it

You don't need her to tell you all the details, but let her know you want her to find Prince Charming, while she can use you for sex and fun. Ironically over time she will start to see you as Prince Charming lol

2) Be More Mysterious
Don't tell her your whereabouts all the time. Block parts of your life away from her and only hint at their existence. Tell lots of half truths and make her work hard to get more information out of you. This will make you seem like more of a challenge and make her work

3) Say The Most Erotic Word To The Female Brain
Start saying NO more

Dodge more of her compliance asks. Make her see you on your schedule more than hers. Make her work harder to get investment from you. This doesn't mean you will never say yes, but you need to give her the feeling like you won't just do what she says so easily

4) Get More Investment
This woman is obviously seeing other men. So if you want to keep her around you need to take advantage of the sunk cost fallacy. Because usually, other men over-invest when it comes to women. So to appear more dominant you need to invest less

Make her pay for dates, make her cook for you, make her do things to make your life easier. And then you invest just enough to keep her going. Which is just a little less than her...

Also, invest intermittently to keep her motivated to chase. Because the more she invests in you, the less likely she will dump you for the other guys. It's very counterintuitive but it works

5) Master the Art of Mixed Signals
You should know exactly how to do this by now because she has been doing this to you... lol

- Show her lots affection one day and then disappear.
- Tell her how you can't live without her and then ignore her texts for hours or days
- Tell her you can't get her out of your mind and then go ahead and post a picture of another girl on your social media
- Make her feel like she's about to win you over then do something to put all her investment in jeopardy only to recover and get her investing again

I'm being extreme here, but you get the point

You don't need to go this far but she has to feel like she never has full control over your heart, but is close. This one is a balancing act and if you master this you can keep women very excited for long periods and send their attractions into the stratosphere

But be careful to not do this too much unless you might get crazies showing up on your doorstep or get your tires slashed

TLDR.... Give her the impression that she doesn't completely own your hear but is slowly winning you over. Which is something your relationship dynamic has been missing.

 

[nolimits]

@DoWhatWorks
@TomInHo

Spectacular analysis. And thanks guys.

Investment is definetely a Sticking point but this girl has had the merit of making me discover this.

Now, I want to master this shit.

I will slowly try to reverse the dynamic and definetly try the go date other guys bit.

There are a few questions i have left :

Your main advice is simply to stop caring wether women are faithful or not, and simply working on maximizing their investment in you. Meanwhile you make sure you invest in her enough to keep her chasing while making sure you invest less than the other guys she bangs.

Am I getting this right ?

And this maximizes chances that she’ll ask to be sexually faithful..


Also, is there a risk she auto reject or stop investing if I start decreasing investment and changing style too fast, or not really ?

 

[nolimits]

I've been in these situations a lot, and in the end it's usually the woman begging to be with me. Because in these situations the girl sees you as her pimp and those other guys as her tricks

So I’m curious in general. what you’re saying is that whenever you want a girl to be sexually exclusive to you, you should never ask for it ?

IOW what do you consider the best way to have a girl being faithful to you apart from target selection which is what we too often ignore ?

The logic behind it being that women will offer to be exclusive to you FIRST, in the hope that you will give them some investment other than fucking them and talking to them ?

that’s interesting because the times I’ve had girl being monogamous to me it was either them asking me to be faithful, which I turned down and managed to turn into one sided monogamy (at least I believe the girl was very honest in that case ) or it was because I asked for nothing and was legitimately less into the chick than she was into me.

In general though I feel like if you go beyond fucking and talking with the girl, her not being sexually exclusive can cause ego problem. Meaning you know that there’s a guy out there who just bangs her while you are there putting all this effort in.

That’s why I am a fan of sexual fidelity (in a girlfriend)

 

[Skills]

So I’m curious in general. what you’re saying is that whenever you want a girl to be sexually exclusive to you, you should never ask for it ?

IOW what do you consider the best way to have a girl being faithful to you apart from target selection which is what we too often ignore ?

The logic behind it being that women will offer to be exclusive to you FIRST, in the hope that you will give them some investment other than fucking them and talking to them ?

that’s interesting because the times I’ve had girl being monogamous to me it was either them asking me to be faithful, which I turned down and managed to turn into one sided monogamy (at least I believe the girl was very honest in that case ) or it was because I asked for nothing and was legitimately less into the chick than she was into me.

In general though I feel like if you go beyond fucking and talking with the girl, her not being sexually exclusive can cause ego problem. Meaning you know that there’s a guy out there who just bangs her while you are there putting all this effort in.

That’s why I am a fan of sexual fidelity (in a girlfriend)

This is exactly your problem assuming you get a laid a lot, you still lack the simple fundamentals on how to properly we go into relationship if we choose monogamy, or even if multiple women the main one...... I would take time and examine this:

Long-Term - Relationships fundamentals 101- Part 1 How to enter into a serious relationship properly

So guys every other month you see variations of post like this, or like this, or like this I personally have tried different relationships set up with what you guys consider wife material ( 20s, 8s plus, low lay count, traditional values, eastern european, christians and the rest), to open, to...

www.skilledseducer.com

 

[Karea Ricardus D.]

I will slowly try to reverse the dynamic and definetly try the go date other guys bit.

The core issue here is the passion trap, meaning you're more into her than she is into you. So the core solution is flipping that dynamic, where she's more into you than you are into her. So anything you do to fix this relationship should move in that direction.

So think about the relationships where you were the one up, where the girls were more into you than you were into them. Would you tell them to go date other guys? Probably not. Why would you do that? It's not one-up behavior. So, I wouldn't do it.

Your main advice is simply to stop caring wether women are faithful or not, and simply working on maximizing their investment in you.

The problem is that this is pretty much impossible to fake. You do care... so all you can do is two things 1. flip the passion trap as described above (with the "wuss cure"), and/or 2. find another girl you like as much as her or more.

Making a conscious decision to not care is okay but the attachment is emotional and physiological / biochemical, so "stop caring" is about as helpful as the advice to newbie PUAs "just be confident". It's not really that simple...

Meanwhile you make sure you invest in her enough to keep her chasing while making sure you invest less than the other guys she bangs.

I also don't think you can really invest less than the other guys. Some other guy may have sex with her in a club, maybe he invested 20 minutes of his time and a 20 dollar tip for the bathroom attendant... so I wouldn't worry about this aspect of it either.

And this maximizes chances that she’ll ask to be sexually faithful..

I think she will only ask to be sexually faithful if she is one down. Women who are one-up sometimes get into monogamous situations, but she will be very tempted to cheat then. Remember when you were the one up in your relationships, your eyes were still straying yes?

Also, is there a risk she auto reject or stop investing if I start decreasing investment and changing style too fast, or not really ?

Could happen, yeah. It all has to come across totally natural and casual. If it seems like you're playing games or like you're hurt or pouting, it will make things worse.

I guess you have all your answers as far as what to do, it's just difficult to do but the "wuss cure" and/or finding another girl you really like are really the only 2 solutions.

I'll add one more important piece here. If you ever do get serious with a girl (this one or any other girl), don't use these kinds of techniques too much because you don't want to be at war with your own girl-friend.

At that point it's better to disarm all power struggles, frame against all game playing, and set up a proper team-frame for the relationship. I wrote about it in the relationship series in my signature... but, that's for later. First you have to get out of the hole you're in.

 

[Chase]

Just having skimmed this thread, this chick is:

• 10 years older (aged 40; you are 30)
• Loves getting lots of cocks
• Expressly rejected going exclusive
• Expressly stated she only wants cock

But the goal is to turn this gal into a mono girlfriend?

Bit like fitting a square peg into a round hole, no?

@nolimits, if you were expert at taking girlfriends, you could probably do it. But as @Skills points out, you are making some total rookie mistakes here. The woman has to always be the one chasing for higher forms of commitment once sex is achieved. Men chase sex, women chase relationships.

Sometimes guys chase women for relationship commitment and get it. From what I have seen, the ONLY guys this works for though are super providers. You have to just be EVERYTHING the girl wants in a provider: great job, excellent money, high social standing, extremely responsible, she trusts you'll be faithful / not be running around going after other girls, romantic, puts her on a pedestal, but as much as he is crazy for her, he is respected by everybody else, etc. Then you can chase the girl down and she will eventually relent.

Note that she may not be entirely faithful... super providers are great for provision, but they aren't the sexiest... and a nympho's gotta eat, after all...

The way you get women to chase you for sexual & romantic exclusivity is you:

• Fuck them well
• Showcase a moderate amount of provider potential, so they can reason going exclusive with you
• NEVER act more into the relationship than they are
• But at the same time be open to it when they suggest relationship-y stuff ("Yeah, we could, might be fine")
• Do some of that stuff and act like a good boyfriend but THEN GO RIGHT BACK TO keeping it casual & cool unless & until they start getting clingier & pushing for more

It is basically this process of gradually showing that you COULD be an actual serious boyfriend, but that for now you still are not that.

That is how you make the shift from "fling" to "committed romantic partner."

It can never be your idea though... it has to be hers.

If it was me, I would meet the friends, act like a great boyfriend, then go right back to being her casual fuck buddy and act like nothing has changed. She gets the little thrill of excitement when you meet the friend and the friend is impressed... then gets the deflation that comes after when she realizes you aren't actually her boyfriend and the two of you are still just FWB.

Lovers who chase for commitment are just poor misguided sops to women. "He doesn't realize he's my good dick... but that is ALL he is to me!"

She needs to gradually come to see you in a different light, without you losing the things that attracted her to you and kept her coming back again and again in the first place.

If you can get her to the point where she is realizing, "Wow... you know, I thought nolimits was just a good, stiff cock, but actually I really like having him around in a boyfriend capacity too. But he is not asking for that and only does it when I ask... kind of sad. Wait... do I want no limits to be my boyfriend? Now I don't even know how to act around him! Oh my gosh, am I feeling needy and jealous toward noilmits? I think I would feel quite bad if he suddenly got a girlfriend..." that is the point where she will start to press for it herself.

Chase

 

[TomInHo]

Just having skimmed this thread, this chick is:

• 10 years older (aged 40; you are 30)
• Loves getting lots of cocks
• Expressly rejected going exclusive
• Expressly stated she only wants cock

But the goal is to turn this gal into a mono girlfriend?

Bit like fitting a square peg into a round hole, no?

@nolimits, if you were expert at taking girlfriends, you could probably do it. But as @Skills points out, you are making some total rookie mistakes here. The woman has to always be the one chasing for higher forms of commitment once sex is achieved. Men chase sex, women chase relationships.

Sometimes guys chase women for relationship commitment and get it. From what I have seen, the ONLY guys this works for though are super providers. You have to just be EVERYTHING the girl wants in a provider: great job, excellent money, high social standing, extremely responsible, she trusts you'll be faithful / not be running around going after other girls, romantic, puts her on a pedestal, but as much as he is crazy for her, he is respected by everybody else, etc. Then you can chase the girl down and she will eventually relent.

Note that she may not be entirely faithful... super providers are great for provision, but they aren't the sexiest... and a nympho's gotta eat, after all...

The way you get women to chase you for sexual & romantic exclusivity is you:

• Fuck them well
• Showcase a moderate amount of provider potential, so they can reason going exclusive with you
• NEVER act more into the relationship than they are
• But at the same time be open to it when they suggest relationship-y stuff ("Yeah, we could, might be fine")
• Do some of that stuff and act like a good boyfriend but THEN GO RIGHT BACK TO keeping it casual & cool unless & until they start getting clingier & pushing for more

It is basically this process of gradually showing that you COULD be an actual serious boyfriend, but that for now you still are not that.

That is how you make the shift from "fling" to "committed romantic partner."

It can never be your idea though... it has to be hers.

If it was me, I would meet the friends, act like a great boyfriend, then go right back to being her casual fuck buddy and act like nothing has changed. She gets the little thrill of excitement when you meet the friend and the friend is impressed... then gets the deflation that comes after when she realizes you aren't actually her boyfriend and the two of you are still just FWB.

Lovers who chase for commitment are just poor misguided sops to women. "He doesn't realize he's my good dick... but that is ALL he is to me!"

She needs to gradually come to see you in a different light, without you losing the things that attracted her to you and kept her coming back again and again in the first place.

If you can get her to the point where she is realizing, "Wow... you know, I thought nolimits was just a good, stiff cock, but actually I really like having him around in a boyfriend capacity too. But he is not asking for that and only does it when I ask... kind of sad. Wait... do I want no limits to be my boyfriend? Now I don't even know how to act around him! Oh my gosh, am I feeling needy and jealous toward noilmits? I think I would feel quite bad if he suddenly got a girlfriend..." that is the point where she will start to press for it herself.

Chase

@Chase again with excellent points

You just have to be patient @nolimits. Also think for a second....

Why do you actually want her as a GF? Would she make your life more fulfilling or are you looking to capture her to get validation? My gut feeling says its the latter

Do this... Get out a piece of paper and right down all the pros and cons of having this particular woman in your life. Try your best to be as objective as possible and give yourself time to compile the list

After you are done take a step back and look at what you wrote and you may be surprised with what she's offering that a another woman can't

Look G! you are suffering from something called Frustration Attraction.... This is the kind of attraction that builds when we can't get what we want easily. For example look at this patten

- You connect with your lover
- You're filled with pleasurable emotions and your brain gets dumped with chemicals like dopamine and serotonin that make you feel euphoria
- You start to yearn for more of those feel good chemicals and make pushes to possess your lover
- Your lover then rejects your advances of more closeness
- Then your brain gets dumped with chemicals like norepinephrine and cortisol to handle the stressful situation
- And just when you are about to give up, your lover comes back and gives you positive emotions, with even higher levels of euphoria
- This process of Good and Bad emotions gets you hooked on your lover like a drug
- And keeps you chasing hoping to get those elusive highs once again

This my friend is how women put men under something I call the....

Pum Pum Trance
I've seen this happen so many times to men it's almost comical. Over time the woman doses the man with positive and negative emotions to get him under mental control.

Because if they only give the man positive emotions, he will get bored and move on to another woman to impregnate. And if she only doses negative, the man will see no point in sticking around in a relationship with no pleasure

It's this constant back and forth that get you obsessed, because it's the dark times that make the good times feel so damn amazig

But there are 2 main ways to exit the Pum Pum Trance

1) Flip The Script
Now that you aware of the mechanism that women use to get you under their control, you can give them a dose of their own medicine. Instead of receiving these doses you dish them out to get them DICK-MATIZED

At first it may seem very disingenuous to do this, but with practice it will become a part of your personality. Because there are many ways to do this and this is one to the reasons why everyone here is telling you to let her chase the relationship

Because it gives you leverage to properly dose the positive and negative emotions and keep women chasing for your exclusivity, hence raising long term compliance


2) Get On Your Purpose
I'm not a fan of the RedPill but this is one concept they got right. As a masculine man you are wired to seek challenge. Without anything challenging to overcome in your life you become less of a man and start to wither away

When you don't have anything that challenges your boundaries, you create this vacuum in your heart that a toxic woman can easily swoop in and become the center of. She becomes your purpose and consumes all your thought, hence making it hard to build your empire, think logically and flip the script on her to make her obsessed with you

So I'm guessing since this woman came into your life, you don't have anything super exciting going on outside of her. And this could be the reason why your judgement is so clouded

So get some goals that scare the shit out of you and pursue them with vigor. And never stop trying to conquer the world if you don't want your woman to conquer you

PS: You are not the only one to experience this. And I think every man needs to go through this at least once, or twice or thrice before they finally get it

 

[Karea Ricardus D.]

Btw and just in case it wasn't clear, I obviously concur that this woman is not wife or GF material. I think that goes without saying, but I'll say it just in case. There are ways to tame this wild horse in your stable but... yeah. Don't marry the horse.

 

[nolimits]

Do some of that stuff and act like a good boyfriend but THEN GO RIGHT BACK TO keeping it casual & cool unless & until they start getting clingier & pu

Thanks for the answer brother.

But how do you make the switch ? Meaning why would she give up other dicks for one single guy ? She can simply wait forever and go out with different guys simultaneously.

I was thinking that maybe turning down her invitationsa couple times in a row in a very light hearted way ‘ can’t this week but we’ll stay in touch’, can either make her disappear thinking ‘ I will not chase this guy ‘ or make her chase for a relationship harder.

As ricardus said, this is all done in a light hearted way, not a bitter or sad one. But if she cares about you in theory she should chase.

Keep in mind this vacuum would be created after I spent abou 5 nights with her in a month, giving her good feelings and making her invest. In theory if I refuse to see her she might give chase and if she doesn’t she is simply bluffing every time she says she adores me etc..

 

[nolimits]

My gut feeling says its the latter

Yeah - Absolutely the latter. Plus, it’s a question of skill building meaning this year I sucked at retention and I want to improve from that standpoint.

 

[Chase]

@nolimits,

But how do you make the switch ? Meaning why would she give up other dicks for one single guy ? She can simply wait forever and go out with different guys simultaneously.

I have met very few chicks who stay single forever.

She told YOU she isn't looking for a boyfriend.

Sooner or later she is going to meet a guy she WANTS as a boyfriend... and she is NOT going to tell him the same thing she told you.

The issue you have here is that this girl is more experienced than you, at least in terms of relationships, and has already ruled you out for that. She likes you... just as a lover, not as a boyfriend. She has been pacing your expectations the entire time.

You're trying to think about it in terms of "What tactics can I try?" but she's not operating at the tactical level -- she is using strategy. You can't beat strategy with tactics; you can only slow it down.

If you want to rope in a woman who is more experienced than you and has already made her mind up about you, you need to turn aside from tactics and start thinking strategy.

Tactics:

• "What should I do if she Xes?"
• "What Y can I do to make her want me?"
• "Can I do Z to make her miss me?"

Strategy:

• "What do I need to do to get her to reconsider me as the kind of boyfriend material she wants?"
• "Once I've established myself as valuable boyfriend material for her, how do I create some urgency to make her enter a proper relationship?"
• "Once in that relationship, how do I maintain my position as valuable boyfriend material and avoid sliding back into being just an overly successful lover?"

If you can answer those latter questions, you will be on your way to actually getting what you want with her.

Chase

 

[nolimits]

Yeah I agree with you on strategy vs tactics.

Is there a way to know wether you’re still in time to change how she perceives you tho ?

It could simply be that by doing what you told me and wait a bit things will work just fine, else she wouldn’t propose me to meet her friends etc…


Also, would romantic gestures or romantic words done with the right timing completely ruin your chances or might they help to be seen as more of a boyfriend candidate if they’re done in a very laidback way ?



curious how I’d never thought this lover to boyfriend conversion could be a sticking point for me

 

[Chase]

@nolimits,

Is there a way to know wether you’re still in time to change how she perceives you tho ?

If she's still sleeping you, you still have time.

When she stops doing that, time's up.

Also, would romantic gestures or romantic words done with the right timing completely ruin your chances or might they help to be seen as more of a boyfriend candidate if they’re done in a very laidback way ?

You're still thinking tactical.

That could shore up some support for you maybe if she's started seeing you as a boyfriend candidate.

If she doesn't see you that way then it just looks like you're chasing for something you're unqualified for.

If the best you can do for now is put together a list of tactics, then I guess that is better than nothing. If you're going to do that, then just list out all the tactical things you can do to present yourself as a better boyfriend option and work your way through them.

Really though you want to be looking at the kinds of guys a girl like her commits to and saying to yourself, "What are the core differences between these guys and me, and how do I exhibit the qualities they have that make them attractive to her as a guy she'd commit to?"

Chase

 

[Will_V]

@nolimits,



I have met very few chicks who stay single forever.

She told YOU she isn't looking for a boyfriend.

Sooner or later she is going to meet a guy she WANTS as a boyfriend... and she is NOT going to tell him the same thing she told you.

The issue you have here is that this girl is more experienced than you, at least in terms of relationships, and has already ruled you out for that. She likes you... just as a lover, not as a boyfriend. She has been pacing your expectations the entire time.

You're trying to think about it in terms of "What tactics can I try?" but she's not operating at the tactical level -- she is using strategy. You can't beat strategy with tactics; you can only slow it down.

If you want to rope in a woman who is more experienced than you and has already made her mind up about you, you need to turn aside from tactics and start thinking strategy.

Tactics:

• "What should I do if she Xes?"
• "What Y can I do to make her want me?"
• "Can I do Z to make her miss me?"

Strategy:

• "What do I need to do to get her to reconsider me as the kind of boyfriend material she wants?"
• "Once I've established myself as valuable boyfriend material for her, how do I create some urgency to make her enter a proper relationship?"
• "Once in that relationship, how do I maintain my position as valuable boyfriend material and avoid sliding back into being just an overly successful lover?"

If you can answer those latter questions, you will be on your way to actually getting what you want with her.

Chase

100%. The other thing about strategy is that it forces you to make up your mind about what you want and commit to something over a greater span of time, whereas tactics are often a way to postpone having to decide what we want, and just end up wasting time or even making things more difficult later on.

 

[nolimits]

Your tips are always helpful guys and I’m sticking to the strategy of pushing less for the relationship than the chick does.

Of course sometimes I make mistake : last time I officially discovered that she is an attachment avoidant, so after spending the evening with her we slept together and the day after she was really cold. That was due to the amount of emotional intimacy that was generated.

Her husband was an attachment avoidant guy - not a coincidence.

So now I plan on giving her space, whereas with a secure attachment girl I would have sent a text ‘ beautiful sharing the weekend with you’.

All this goes to say that this attachment avoidant stuff adds another layer of difficulty to the dynamic. Tons to learn for me here since I’m secure, but love bonding on an emotional level which makes me look a bit clingy compared to an avoidant. So I’ll have to force myself to be a bit more distant if i’ll ever see her again. And who knows - opposite to what I feel and think- we might be still in the game.

 

[nolimits]

Update for the passionate veterans who want to see how a playboy handles a tough situation:

I disappointed you guys. But we might not be over. Tough situation to be in as my man @TomInHo and my guy @Karea Ricardus D. Mentioned.


i met her friend and did not play to the best of my abilities. I implied (after her friend asked several times ) that I might get bored in time if the 40 year old girl banged other guys and simply leave.

this was a huge mistake and thought I was over with her but then I made her come all night long and saw her the night after to discuss.

She had texted me that she felt she could not met my expectations and that she wanted to be free, that she did not care about men and she wanted freedom.

But I had played my cards well overall during the dinner so think I am still in the game.

Keep in mind in my whole life I always had girls beg me for relationships, and had never stumble onto such an extreme case of chick. I have fucked more women than most guys will ever dream of and am VERY good with words. I have many alternatives in my life and am considered very good looking.

it’s just a tough situation to be in.

So I saw her yesterday and listened to her talking for 30 minutes applying the olive branch tactic.

Then I told her ‘ you are free to leave anytime with me and I want no gf - my goal s to keep it casual even though you and I care about each other.

Did this to lower her guard.

Ended up walking her home, and she said ‘ you mean a lot to me’.

Bullshit aside, I plan on not contacting her anymore and then if she contacts me stick to the 1:3 rule where I ask her out once every 3 times she asks me.

If she ever contacts me again, I will NEVER ever joke on her banging other guys or anything similar. I will never imply she is not 100% free

Maybe, this will work to have her ask me for fidelity in a Few months. Of course i am focused on other girls now but maybe she will come back to me texting me and want more from my time.

If she had a secure attachment style she would already be mine but since she is very avoidant and got out of a 15 years old marriage my question to the veterans is always the same.

If I do my thing and keep banging here while putting no pressure on her, will she ever come
To me and ask me for sexual exclusivity - even though she is avoidant ?

Is this doable ? I think she is as attached as she is to me but she does need to feel like she has complete freedom. As if she always had an exit door.

My doubt is , is our let her come to you
strategy going to work as well as if she had a secure attachment style to get her to chase you to become your girlfriend ? Can this strategy work with an attachment avoidant ?

I am already focused on other chicks and plan on taking the risk of leaving her space to suck other dicks, but wondering wether this has a high chance of working.