Is game harder than it was 10 years ago?

[Karea Ricardus D.]

I've been reading my archive of lay-reports and I realized something... there was already something just like WhatsApp around back then: MSN!

Many girls were using MSN almost as much as they use WhatsApp now.

So... is this really something that has changed?

If I was able to skip MSN and just text to meet 10 years ago, shouldn't we be able to skip WhatsApp too? Text straight to meet.

The only exception being if the set was very short, then run enough game via WhatsApp to make up for what you couldn't do in person.

That's how I used MSN back then.

 

[pancakemouse]

So... is this really something that has changed?

Yes, it's changed. Gen Z girls in particular treat messaging as an extension of real conversation. Girls are carrying on entire relationships just online, and this is way more prevalent than it was in 2010.

 

[Karea Ricardus D.]

girls in particular treat messaging as an extension of real conversation. Girls are carrying on entire relationships just online, and this is way more prevalent than it was

Meh. This entire bit could be straight out of some posts I made back in the day.

For example, I posted the following September 27th, 2009:

I ask her for her MSN. If she gives me her MSN, I talk to her for 2 minutes and then ask her to meet up pretty much straight away. I don't want to waste time on "online game" and composing interesting messages or running the M3 via cyberspace or any such bullshit. Mostly because women don't read romance novels anymore in 2009, they now have fantasy romance on the internet.

There were a lot of girls back then who would spend hours a day chatting away on MSN.

 

[ulrich]

Yes, it's changed. Gen Z girls in particular treat messaging as an extension of real conversation. Girls are carrying on entire relationships just online, and this is way more prevalent than it was in 2010.

Maybe some girls are doing that, but does it do you any good if you play ball?

 

[pancakemouse]

Meh. This entire bit could be straight out of some posts I made back in the day.

For example, I posted the following September 27th, 2009:

There were a lot of girls back then who would spend hours a day chatting away on MSN.

Right. It's been an evolution. It gets worse every year.

 

[Teevster]

Did msn messenger exist on mobile? I only had the dekstop version. But these days women have no ones message apps but at least 3... tinder (she probably turmed off notifications like most hot girls do), facebook messenger, whatsapp, instagram messenger, snapchat etc....

So they are more distracted. However it has never been an issue because in nightgame she may take a few pics for ig or snaochat once in a while but aside from that she usually dont look at her phone. Usually when they are out socializing they don't really use their phones. I face many wildcards in field but her phone ain't one. And this is not because my hooks are the best... it is hust that irl attentiom trumps online attention.

Ever pulled a girl from nightgame just for her to check her phone post sex... realaizing she has plenty of unread messages? That is a sign that the phobe is not her priority when out.

At best the digitalization of the social has resultet in inflating womens ego. I can accept this fact. However logistically and practicallt her phone has never been an issue in field. Nor I have read reports by pros and beginners alike claiming that "their boght webt south because of her phone".

 

[Karea Ricardus D.]

No, MSN didn't exist on mobile back then. I'm not sure when smart phones became ubiquitous but I bought mine after quitting the game. And you say girls aren't looking at their phones when in field... then it shouldn't be much of an issue.

From what little I've been out I would agree. I had a girl spellbound for a couple of hours from a daygame pickup but failed to escalate the vibe and then she started looking at her phone more. I wasn't sexualizing the sarge properly and didn't have logistics right either. I'm guessing she wouldn't have checked her phone at all if I had done those right.

Also I heard Mystery say this week that he uses instagram, whatsapp and video calls now but he still doesn't text back and forth a lot. Still just uses it for logistics. He said "I'm not a girl I don't have chat relationships on the apps".

 

[Marcellus]

What a great read this was, again! newer guys please check this thread out, so many different topics touched on, so much to learn

 

[app13]

pick up is 100% more difficult now compared to before social media/tinder

before the internet, chicks had 0 validation. they never knew how hot they were because male attention was scarce. her dating candidates were basically people within her social circle cause girls can't approach. so when a random day gamer comes up to her, the actual approach is valued much much more compared to now. nowadays, chicks have instagram and tinder. they don't need random dudes coming up to approach them. they can just hop on an app and get showered with attention

the apps definitely fucked things up

i will say though that thanks to the internet and the technology of today, it's a lot easier to make money online, start a business, and achieve financial freedom. at this point you can use your resources to travel the world and do game in countries that give you the most advantages

so it's a bit of a trade off i'd say

 

[Beck Bass]

Miller is one of the top evolutionary psychologists in the world, focused on studying human mating scientifically. But this sexy PERSONALITY he talks about takes TIME to convey. About 20-25 minutes. A direct street stop, or a few pictures on tinder, both short circuit her entire evaluation loop. In both cases you’re asking her to make a decision without enough data. That works fine if you’re this guy:

Yep, guys are just going all in in the first 3 minutes of the game and wonder why they are losing most of them... Like they are not even playing that much to being with.
I think you can open direct and still have plenty of options later on, it's just not going all in, like most newbies will do. I myself gotta learn some more indirect game though, many girls in the past seemed to be into me, but then I pushed a bit too hard, they were skeptical at first, and slowed me down. Then months after I meet those girls again (maybe they kept contact through Instagram, or saw me having fun and pulling other girls in other places), and their attitude completely changed, now they want me. Like I lost on the short term for going too hard, but won on the long term, for showing interest, at least (and then, later on, showing enough value).

Also you saying/implying you like/wanna fuck a girl on a moment doesn't mean she's still got you later on, it's just it takes more times to create that bit of uncertainty, and to be able to capitilize on it is it's on game. Guys need to learn not to corner themselves early on in game, so they can pull back if needed. I could make a bunch of strategy games analogies here, but it's like seduction is a bit of a war, and it takes time to "rally your troops", aka show your value, and unless the girl is "letting you win", which some will, for sure, but most won't, you gotta take more of your time to show those traits she might be looking for, that you can be the man of her fantasies.

I think GirlsChase and those "direct game" guys of the past pushed guys to be more aggressive in a sense, not like violent, but pushing for a close too hard, because back in the day most guys were too passive (and that's the nice guy stereotype anyway), and that works for a while, in learning I say, because you need to have the guts to tell a girl you wanna do her to do her, by the end of the day, but just doing that doesn't acomplish anything, most of the time (unless the girl is 100% into you, even then, how you put it might change her opinion lol). There's more game to be played, things aren't so simple, so black and white as "green red yellow" and all this stupid stuff you see thrown around like it's a new cult/religion or something.

1. Smart phones messed with the SMP, since girls get far more sausage thrown in their face now. Especially the dating apps are definitely rigged against most guys. I do believe tinder is harder than it was when it first came out, and it’s harder than even other forms of online dating. But, I’ve seen stats that most girls aren’t using tinder actively. And more importantly, I think online attention is about as fulfilling to girls as porn is to guys. Yeah it’s fun... but it just doesn’t really cut it. It’s empty.

Yeah, guys also have porn, girls have been complaining about that for decades, now they have this social media bs (the cute ones, at least, though what cute is depends on the person, like even an ugly girl that puts some makeup can get some chumps to chase her).

It's that Brazilian Portuguese I see? haha
I used that for quite a while, I remember chatting up that Asian girl I was trying to bone from middle school and this, only bombarding her with stupid shit about video games lmao (bad game is always bad game, it doesn't matter the media, after all).

 

[Warped Mindless]

pick up is 100% more difficult now compared to before social media/tinder

before the internet, chicks had 0 validation. they never knew how hot they were because male attention was scarce. her dating candidates were basically people within her social circle cause girls can't approach. so when a random day gamer comes up to her, the actual approach is valued much much more compared to now. nowadays, chicks have instagram and tinder. they don't need random dudes coming up to approach them. they can just hop on an app and get showered with attention

the apps definitely fucked things up

i will say though that thanks to the internet and the technology of today, it's a lot easier to make money online, start a business, and achieve financial freedom. at this point you can use your resources to travel the world and do game in countries that give you the most advantages

so it's a bit of a trade off i'd say

Nope. Did you approach women before dating apps?

Ive been doing it since 2006. I still dont get where guys think its “harder.” Its different but not harder if you adapt.

 

[ulrich]

I

Nope. Did you approach women before dating apps?

Ive been doing it since 2006. I still dont get where guys think its “harder.” Its different but not harder if you adapt.

If anything, in my opinion now is easier.

A lot of guys now have terrible social skills because now you can get dates through an app.
It’s so easy to stand out with a little charisma.

 

[Baron]

What a great read this was, again! newer guys please check this thread out, so many different topics touched on, so much to learn

I think the whole thing can be summarised in terms of advantages and disadvantages. The net effect may be that it's no harder or easier than before, but decide for yourself ...

It may be easier now because:
1) less IRL competition -- with all the digital distractions we have nowadays, including online dating, more reasons for other men not to go out and approach women
2) more IRL value -- that fact that so many ppl are doing online dating makes being approached in real life (especially during the day) more interesting for women, shows you have balls, etc
3) online dating -- if you're 6'3" with the physique of a Greek god, you'll probably find it 1000x easier nowadays to set up dates with attractive girls than in the pre online dating age (if we're counting online dating as "game")
4) your age and experience -- if you've been out approaching and trying to seduce women consistently over 10 years, trying out different methods and approaches, you'll have a better idea what works for you and what doesn't
5) more free time -- changes in work trends and technology mean that fewer people are confined to an office 8 hours a day and it's easier to earn passive income, which frees up your leisure time
6) more single women -- According to numerous statistics, there are more single women than ever. For example, the UK's Office for National Statistics shows that women not living in a couple, who have never married, is rising in every age range under 70. In the decade-and-a-half between 2002 and 2018, the percentage of never- married singletons in their 40s doubled. (The Guardian).
7) counter pick-up/seduction culture -- red pill, MGTOW, incels etc -- is more prevalent now than 10 years ago, which may have a favourable impact on competition, depending on your location

It may be harder now because ...
1) competition from dating apps -- if a woman is determined to find a partner, short or long term, she can find hundreds of potential suitors online almost in an instant, she doesn't need to go out to a bar
2) competition within the online dating marketplace -- if you're NOT 6'3" with the body of a Greek god, you might find it increasingly difficult to match with attractive women online, depending on your geolocation (and whether we're counting online dating as "game")
3) more technologically distracted women -- with so many women (especially younger women) constantly checking their phones, snapping pics for Instagram, walking around with stupid devices stuck to their ears, it may be more of a challenge to get their attention
4) more competent IRL competition (in theory) -- pick up/dating advice is all over the internet now, especially on YouTube; any determined horny young guy can learn some basic skills (whether this translates into more guys actually approaching and competently picking up girls is another story)
5) your age -- if, for example. you were in your 30s ten years ago and now you're in your 40s, it may be more challenging to get the same girls you were going for back in the day (but see Point 4 in the first list)
6) wildcards - e.g. regional/political/demographic changes and upheavals, e.g. if you're a western ex-pat living in some more economically backward region of the world, a steady influx of westerners in that region over time will diminish your default value

 

[Skills]

I think the whole thing can be summarised in terms of advantages and disadvantages. The net effect may be that it's no harder or easier than before, but decide for yourself ...

It may be easier now because:
1) less IRL competition -- with all the digital distractions we have nowadays, including online dating, more reasons for other men not to go out and approach women
2) more IRL value -- that fact that so many ppl are doing online dating makes being approached in real life (especially during the day) more interesting for women, shows you have balls, etc
3) online dating -- if you're 6'3" with the physique of a Greek god, you'll probably find it 1000x easier nowadays to set up dates with attractive girls than in the pre online dating age (if we're counting online dating as "game")
4) your age and experience -- if you've been out approaching and trying to seduce women consistently over 10 years, trying out different methods and approaches, you'll have a better idea what works for you and what doesn't
5) more free time -- changes in work trends and technology mean that fewer people are confined to an office 8 hours a day and it's easier to earn passive income, which frees up your leisure time
6) more single women -- According to numerous statistics, there are more single women than ever. For example, the UK's Office for National Statistics shows that women not living in a couple, who have never married, is rising in every age range under 70. In the decade-and-a-half between 2002 and 2018, the percentage of never- married singletons in their 40s doubled. (The Guardian).
7) counter pick-up/seduction culture -- red pill, MGTOW, incels etc -- is more prevalent now than 10 years ago, which may have a favourable impact on competition, depending on your location

It may be harder now because ...
1) competition from dating apps -- if a woman is determined to find a partner, short or long term, she can find hundreds of potential suitors online almost in an instant, she doesn't need to go out to a bar
2) competition within the online dating marketplace -- if you're NOT 6'3" with the body of a Greek god, you might find it increasingly difficult to match with attractive women online, depending on your geolocation (and whether we're counting online dating as "game")
3) more technologically distracted women -- with so many women (especially younger women) constantly checking their phones, snapping pics for Instagram, walking around with stupid devices stuck to their ears, it may be more of a challenge to get their attention
4) more competent IRL competition (in theory) -- pick up/dating advice is all over the internet now, especially on YouTube; any determined horny young guy can learn some basic skills (whether this translates into more guys actually approaching and competently picking up girls is another story)
5) your age -- if, for example. you were in your 30s ten years ago and now you're in your 40s, it may be more challenging to get the same girls you were going for back in the day (but see Point 4 in the first list)
6) wildcards - e.g. regional/political/demographic changes and upheavals, e.g. if you're a western ex-pat living in some more economically backward region of the world, a steady influx of westerners in that region over time will diminish your default value

Good points ,#1, #2, is not really like it seems, it is more of a male projection https://www.skilledseducer.com/thre...you-meet-my-basic-view-on-women-part-1.25008/ #4 it is also a none factor, brah you can watch all youtube and all books. Most mot taking action or most advice awful.#5 as you get older your demo changes your range will change but it should not affect you like that as long as look age in your 30s... There are other factors again there are some societal factors, womem are not comming out as consis6antly, after corona it really affected clubs. But raise in rents and housing in usa i suspect is what is contributing to this factor, i explaoned already some of your points.. . Irl gaming is easier. The women not comming out on consistany basis main problem, if they come out and you game them is easier if you know what u are doing... new gen is not getting much expereince and reps vs older gens (you brought up that point)...

The idea that women supply the samre as 10 years ago is not factual, game harder is a misleading argument, cause gaming it is easier but you need women to game....very simple compare fr section, lr section of any forum of pick up... even in private groups no comparison...

Guys in forums can not have an honest discussion cause of the constant posturing.... data>feelings of grandiose

The guys getting laid a lot are doing what i suggest:

- day game constantly (hustlying none stop)you can do the same with night game (minimum 2, ideal 3 times a week)
- combines with online and again supplement, not crutch and again online is not tinder, tinder is the worst imho
- some travel to favorable sexual market places at times.
-good at texting
- combine all game types day, night, again online supplement

^ this is not including social circle guys good in their niche, stricktly gaming strangers....

Good sample @Skjöldr

Night game had in usa the worst hit post corona in some areas..online has the second worst hit due to oversatutation, day game had the least impact but follow ups do to distractons are harder if texting no tight... again data>feelings>posturing. @Skjöldr is a good sample is harder but you can get laid like a rockstar if you put the work.

 

[Baron]

#4 it is also a none factor, brah you can watch all youtube and all books. Most mot taking action or most advice awful.

I wouldn't necessarily say that most advice is "awful" compared to before. I mean, I remember doing magic tricks in clubs back in the day and trying to engage in silly, over-the-top cock funny banter, pretending I had no sexual interest in the girl. Now I look at that stuff as cringey as fk, even though in terms of results it was better than "pre-game" days. Also, you have to consider the mainstream growth in other related areas like fashion, health and fitness, sexual performance, which you'd think would help more guys become attractive to women.

Which is why it blows my mind when I see modern men behaving like total simps both online and offline, completely ignoring simple rules like "don't be needy" which is common to most dating advice (both "good" and "bad"). Maybe you're right, they watch/listen/read but don't take action. Maybe it requires a specific mindset that most people don't possess.

Or maybe there's an overload of information, good, mediocre and bad, a lot of it contradictory. I sometimes see posts on this forum too from guys who say they can't get laid because there's TOO MUCH information to process. Maybe it's what the late David X said at a direct dating conference back in 2010 (I believe): "find one coach that resonates with you, and stick with him".

 

[DonGately]

I do think most guys need to find their one, best angle/niche, stick to that: but of course develop a dozen different 'plays' from that base. Direct/indirect/online/day game but all operating on the same plane.

It's almost impossible to hop around from being a 'gym bro' to the cocky-funny guy at a nightclub, to being a successful, fashionably dressed man to an emo guitar player.

 

[trashKENNUT]

It's almost impossible to hop around from being a 'gym bro' to the cocky-funny guy at a nightclub, to being a successful, fashionably dressed man to an emo guitar player.

I kinda agree but disagree. I agree with what is said though.

Is game harder than it was?

Sincerely, if @Chase has Girlschase on complete autopilot, he is the most OP in pickup.

Who's the most overpowered characters in pickup?

- Chase
- Hector
- Skills
- Teev

If we takin seriously based on skill, nuance, adaptability, this 4 and some of the guys (DWW and Flux, maybe and a few) is literally 'God' if they really understand themselves a little more, if that makes sense.

I'm not sure if the sentence above, is the right word.

The market (society) today just makes it way more easier because the battlefield is as obvious as ever, and if you have looks, power, status, money, it is a walk in the park.

z@c+

 

[Skills]

I wouldn't necessarily say that most advice is "awful" compared to before. I mean, I remember doing magic tricks in clubs back in the day and trying to engage in silly, over-the-top cock funny banter, pretending I had no sexual interest in the girl. Now I look at that stuff as cringey as fk, even though in terms of results it was better than "pre-game" days. Also, you have to consider the mainstream growth in other related areas like fashion, health and fitness, sexual performance, which you'd think would help more guys become attractive to women.

Which is why it blows my mind when I see modern men behaving like total simps both online and offline, completely ignoring simple rules like "don't be needy" which is common to most dating advice (both "good" and "bad"). Maybe you're right, they watch/listen/read but don't take action. Maybe it requires a specific mindset that most people don't possess.

Or maybe there's an overload of information, good, mediocre and bad, a lot of it contradictory. I sometimes see posts on this forum too from guys who say they can't get laid because there's TOO MUCH information to process. Maybe it's what the late David X said at a direct dating conference back in 2010 (I believe): "find one coach that resonates with you, and stick with him".

Most advice is water down or bad, and even the good one, most people don't take action, this is you projecting.... When i go out other men are a none factors, i have even gone out with pua with all the knowledge, again none factor.... The advice that you look at "cringe" is because people don't understand mystery and style were really really good seducers, mystery was a magician, people make a caricature of him with the magic tricks and stuff but that was he way of getting the attention i do similar with dance..... I was last night pretty much throwing's women at dudes at a club they have no idea what to do.. Again this is a projection of you..... Pick up is a micro small niche is pretty much back to how it was back in the day.... How many guys in this forum with all the info will be competent in the field???? less than what you think, trust me... Lol i remember i made an argument like this when clubs died when tinder came out and i made this exact silly point to teevester haha! weird...He gave me similar answer to what i am telling you, but he was saying most dudes have approach anxiety, which yeah another good point.

 

[Baron]

The advice that you look at "cringe" is because people don't understand mystery and style were really really good seducers

It's "cringe" because it's not authentic for me ... for Mystery, however, it's congruent with his persona, as you pointed out he was a magician.

YOU say they were good seducers ... in direct game circles they are not considered great seducers. In any case, all the advice is still on the internet, you can buy mystery's and style's books, you can watch old seminars, so it's not like the stuff you consider "good" has disappeared.

A more interesting question is what you consider "good advice"? Advice that gets you laid by any means necessary or advice that helps you get laid on your terms, in alignment with your goals, ethics etc. For me, I don't like drama, I don't like misleading a woman if I just want to get laid ... I'm not gonna spend time over several dates "getting to know her", future projecting some relationship etc. if I just want to b@ng. Any "comfort building talk" is just there to lead into sexual topics. I don't want to feel compelled to lie, put on a fake persona, have my time wasted, etc. So any advice that helps me achieve that goal I'd consider "good advice".

How many guys in this forum with all the info will be competent in the field???? less than what you think, trust me...

I don't deny that for a second.

 

[Skills]

It's "cringe" because it's not authentic for me ... for Mystery, however, it's congruent with his persona, as you pointed out he was a magician.

YOU say they were good seducers ... in direct game circles they are not considered great seducers. In any case, all the advice is still on the internet, you can buy mystery's and style's books, you can watch old seminars, so it's not like the stuff you consider "good" has disappeared.

A more interesting question is what you consider "good advice"? Advice that gets you laid by any means necessary or advice that helps you get laid on your terms, in alignment with your goals, ethics etc. For me, I don't like drama, I don't like misleading a woman if I just want to get laid ... I'm not gonna spend time over several dates "getting to know her", future projecting some relationship etc. if I just want to b@ng. Any "comfort building talk" is just there to lead into sexual topics. I don't want to feel compelled to lie, put on a fake persona, have my time wasted, etc. So any advice that helps me achieve that goal I'd consider "good advice".



I don't deny that for a second.

i don't want to derail the post but you can check this out:

Socializing - Guys in general are shit in game and uncalibrated, my honest observations....

Guys as you know i have been trying to experiment in pulling a 3 some from cold approach, as i go out a lot of the girls get a bit intimidated when i know i have a girl with me, so i told the main go dance and flirt with other dudes, so they don't Autor eject.... I have also seen form women...

www.skilledseducer.com

Mystery Method - Revisited

Dislcaimer By Teevster: I moved these posts from Karea's thread "Is game harder than it was 10 years ago?". I moved these posts because they covered a whole different subject and those great posts by Karea shouldn't be lost in the sea of posts (was a very active thread). I also felt this is a...

www.skilledseducer.com

The problem with a few naturals and anti-gamers that join the community----

Some of This happened to me when i joined the community in fairness i was not as bad as what i am seeing today, so i know what i am talking about (the thing is I would not be as retarded as guys that are rightfully ban from the forum and i was actually open and looking for answers all along...

www.skilledseducer.com

please check them out quick reads, and the way i write is to the point, no kj, and of course to the point no boring, but do me a favor check those out...