En's log

[AspiringStoic]

These kind of things used to bug me a lot since I was a teenager. Why did she say that or do that? Did she think about it later, did she think I was a loser or thought this of me etc.

Last year when I started approaching, I cannot remember where but in some old PUA archived blog I came across a great frame/mindset that I wrote down. Some experienced guy had posted it. It was something like this:

"Cold approach/pickup is like a video game. Nothing that happens while playing this game is serious. It is just a game. If a girl says or does something I only look at it as an obstacle or a new situation in the game that I need to circumvent. So I experiment and try something, note the result and carrying on playing the game. I take nothing personally. Its just a game. "

I thought it was a great mindset not to take all this seriously. I try to follow it and remind myself of it whenever I get bad reactions.

 

[Higher]

@AspiringStoic 100%. Was more an intellectual curiosity than anything else. This is a fascinating journey!

 

[Higher]

Seize the opportunity and be flexible

Met a smoking hot girl abroad last week. Went for coffee and had a good chat about romance, sex and other great topics.

I was gonna stay in the country only a couple days more. I wanted to be back to my country soon as i had half-plans to see again the girl i talked about here (first one).

(This girl actually ghosted my softclose>hardclose some time ago, then i went radio-silent on her. After two weeks she pinged me and hard closed me for a 2nd meet as soon as i was back. She seemed impatient, so i thought she was game.)

So i seed a second meet with this other girl for the following day. She says, ok lets do it. We keep in touch via text. She invests a bit by asking me questions and the vibe seems really good.

Next day she actually proposes a drink at 5pm. I tell her, id love to see u, but how much time do u have? Shes like, mmm only until 630pm. In my head im like, fuck, theres no way anything goods gonna happen with only 1h30 time, at least not at the level im now. So i ask her, do u have stuff planned tonight that u absolutely cant move? Shes like, yes, ive got dinner at dads, but how long are u staying here?

The right move here woulda been to flake the girl in my country and stay a few more days in order to have a proper whirlwind romance with this other girl.

Unfortunately i tell her, i gotta go back tomorrow, but i might be back soon. Shes like, ok then lets keep in touch, im barely going anywhere this summer.

So i go back to my country, and the other girl ends up flaking due to "a family emergency" - maybe true, maybe not.

Now im left with a girl abroad whose pussy has probably dried up already, and another girl here that ill have to game again from square one. Ill ping again the girl abroad in the next 1-2 weeks, tho i dont think anything good will happen.

Lesson for me here is: seize the opportunity as soon as it shows up and make things happen now.

Doesnt matter if u have overlapping plans with other girls.

If the girl ure currently talking to is hot for u right now, if theres good momentum and a high chance to make things happen with her, flake the other girls.

Be flexible, reassess the situation on the go and move priorities around.

 

[Higher]

Keep things in perspective

We all know this journey is made of highs and lows, and so is any other journey in personal development.

Some highs are higher than others, some lows are lower.

Some are even higher and they represent the peak of ur current game. U pull it off with that amazing gal that ure super-enthusiastic about - u feel like a king. Ur life is under control. Ure unstoppable.

Some lows are the lowest u can get. They are the pits in ur journey, and they beat u down. U mess it up with that top-tier girl who likes u a lot - u feel back to square one. U feel stuck there, as u watch the rest of the world move on.

But u gotta keep things in perspective. Ure not really back to square one. Those pits and peaks are not fixed limits. They change as u level up.

Both ur previous pits and previous peaks were lower than ur current ones.

The mind is not stationary. It gets used to progress, but when u suddenly look back u see all those lower pits and peaks, and u think to urself, man, im still going up after all.

Yes, ull have sacrificed quite a bit to get here. All those girls that might have been great girlfriends, maybe the mothers of ur kids - theyre gone now.

We all know it sucks. But without those sacrifices u would really be stuck at square one. An immovable piece in a motionless world.

So keep climbing. Pause and reflect when needed, then move on up higher.

 

[Higher]

Always find a way to win​

Im still a bit in the afterglow of the recent FU - had caught a bit of oneitis for that girl.

Still went out today, but felt like a beggar. Like i was chasing hard for any half-decent chance.

Its hard to feel like ure the prize when ure in the loser effect.

Gotta snap out of it first.

The best way would be to win in some areas other than game, but right now i cant think of any decent challenges outside of seduction. My life is otherwise pretty much in order and at the place where i want it to be.

Therefore, for now, as small and as mental-masturbatory as it might be, ill celebrate todays wins:

• first of all, i went out, so thats good already
• then i faced day game in the worst possible mood...
• ...and on probably the worst day of the week (monday)...
• ...and still approached 4 girls in 1h30
• i also practiced being "calmly daring", and this, altho i missed one good chance with a hot girl seated on a bench, helped a lot with:
  • tone of voice
  • eye contact
  • walk and posture

However i need to switch gears somehow and find a good challenge.

Until i do, i might take a small break and go for a short trip, or do more sport.

 

[gameboy]

Still went out today, but felt like a beggar.

I know the feeling. Kudos for still doing 4 approaches anyway!

Did you get any positive reactions? Once I get a girl smiling at me and responding in a friendly way, that usually lifts my mood and motivates me to do more.

 

[Jan]

@Higher Well done for appreciating yourself and bringing these small wins into your consiousness. Situation is never black and white. If you feel like you are losing it's good to remind yourself of the recent and not recent wins. Even if they are tiny.

I also recommend you go back in memory to all previous wins! All previous lays, or previous good memories. Remind yourself what you felt at that time. Also, expand your time perspective. Think long term, don't focus on this most recent failure, instead take the broad perspective and think about all the previous wins. Equally important - appreciate the progress you have made since you've started.

All these should help you shift your mindset to more realistic one! When you are feeling down because of some single, it's not realistic! It's narrow vision.

 

[Higher]

Thanks gents, yeah i got good reactions from a couple taken girls.

Every small win counts when u feel like nothing is working!

 

[Higher]

Much better session today.

Had some easy "wins" earlier: did some sport, had a bunch of water and high-quality food. Took a shower and cleaned my place.

I stored my laptop away - i spent too much time on that thing lately. My desk is now basically empty.

When out, i practiced my posture/walk and being "calmly daring" again.

Approached 4 girls and got 1 number from a really cute Czech girl.

Didnt feel at all like a beggar today - felt way higher-value than a couple days ago.

More unfazed.

Got a ton of glances - first time in a while that i notice them. I guess i was so obsessed with chasing hard after chances that i didnt pay attention. The posture/walk thing and my general good mood due to the small earlier "wins" must have contributed for sure.

I let some chances go. One was a pretty hot girl that looked at me twice - kinda regret that. But its fine, ill soon get my killer instinct back.

 

[Mr.SocialAcceptableHarem]

Always stand ur ground

Approached the most entitled girl so far.

I complimented her and she seemed nice, really liked her calm energy. Then i invited her for coffee. She said, u know, im going for lunch now, if u wanna buy me lunch...

For a split second i couldnt believe what i heard, but i almost immediately smiled and told her, well we dont know each other enough yet, maybe later; plus, i had food already, and staring at u while ure eating would be weird.

Shes like, why? And im like, look, i like ur energy, u seem cool, id love to get a coffee or a drink with u sometime; doesnt have to be today. Shes like, i made u an offer already, have lunch with me now.

It didnt take long from that point for the whole set to go in flames, but its clear that this girl is used to submissive/supplicant men.

It was easy to resist this cause it was just too blatant, but i still have to work on my assertiveness when girls start "gaming" in more subtle ways.

Still thinking about whether i coulda played this better.

it's not complicated

you just say "no"

no extra niceness or frills or reasons

she's testing your frame

she'll stay in set if you were doing a good job up until then

if not, well you weren't going to go anywhere without buying for her, and if you buy for her, she probably was trying to use you anyways

"fuck no" - would probably be better, more dramatic - but that's only if she's invested some

but it didn't look like you were getting anywhere with her if she thinks your free lunch money

look back to earlier in the approach, that's probably where your mistake was

Mr. Socially Acceptable Harem

 

[Higher]

Focus on investment, not reactions.​

(And learn to walk away from her before having her walk away from u.)​

Understanding the difference between being persistent and chasing is still a work in progress for me. I suspect it all boils down to being able to correctly assess whos investing more in the interaction - me or the girl.

Approached a cute Brazilian girl today. Great shapes and energy. She was here only today, leaving early tomorrow. She teaches engineering in uni and (unsurprisingly) is a planner.

Everything seemed to be going well: vibe was good, convo was good, touch was good (altho i could have done more). Compliance was also good. She seemed to invest a fair amount.

I seeded a meeting later in my city for wine and sunset, and she said, nooo i have to leave early tomorrow and i wanna visit this city today.

Bad sign. She was withdrawing her investment already. Nothing was probably going to happen with this girl, but i persisted a bit in a cool way and i got her number.

I pinged her later, she replied after 20 min and told me she went back to her hostel a little. To me this is always a good sign, since she might have taken a shower and relaxed a bit before meeting up.

She then asked what i was up to. After a few mins i sent her a video of my city. She replied after another 20 mins saying its beautiful. Five mins later i told her, yeah and id love to show u around and this city is small, everything is 5-10 mins by foot from the station.

(Btw, that emoji was a mistake.)

She took another 20 mins to reply with, sounds good, but i have to wake up early tomorrow, u dont wanna come here?

At this point i should have just dropped it without even replying.

But i called her. She didnt pick up. I texted her, lets have a 1 minute call, its easier than writing. No reply from her until like 1h later ("hey sorry, didnt see ur msg").

Now, i wouldnt have done this had i not gotten that promising "i went back to my hostel a little" line.

However, that shows that once again i focused on reactions instead of investment.

A truly attracted girl will not take 20 mins to reply to u, just to decline to invest in the end.

This girl was not really feeling it, maybe due to her personality/circumstances or due to some mistakes i made (for example, i could have set a better sexual/adventurous frame and i could have rewarded her more when she complied to my requests).

In any case, whenever i feel like im investing more than her, it means that im chasing. Either i gotta rebalance, or i better walk away on her before having her walk away on me.

If anything, err on the side of aloofness than on the side of eagerness.

Persistence CAN work if shes clearly investing. But whenever i feel like im betting against all odds - almost gasping for air - i gotta learn to let go.

Losing control will make u start thinking that shes the prize. Just remind urself that shes not.

 

[AspiringStoic]

better walk away on her before having her walk away on me.

Just genuinely curious because I have heard this at many other places as well. What is gained by us walking away before she walks away? Ultimately the result is the same right? Nothing happened.

So all we get is a spike of pride or I don't know something that I walked away from her.

The reason I ask is I would rather have the I tried my best but it still did not work feeling rather than I walked away feeling. At least with the former I know I tried everything.

Maybe because I look at it from a game perspective. Meaning the whole thing is a game. So I would rather play the game till the end and lose rather than forfeit in the middle of the match.

So I was wondering how you look at it and why you would rather walk away? Maybe its a different perspective. But would be great to discuss.

 

[Higher]

I would rather have the I tried my best but it still did not work feeling rather than I walked away feeling. At least with the former I know I tried everything.

Maybe because I look at it from a game perspective. Meaning the whole thing is a game.

So I was wondering how you look at it and why you would rather walk away?

Good points.

Yeah, probably i take this thing too seriously and i put too much pride into it. Not good.

And i agree that its better to give it all instead of regretting having been too aloof later - but only if shes also investing.

What i was trying to say with my post was this: theres a line where persistence becomes chasing. I need to learn where that line is and stop at it, cause if i cross it ill drive her away even more.

In this case she was clearly not investing much after my invite. (I think she needed a better set. I should have stayed with her longer, rewarded her compliance with more touch, lead more strongly, moved us around a few additional locations and set better sexual/"carpe-diem" frames. That would have been good persistence. And indeed when i ejected i felt unsatisfied, a feeling of "ive been lazy and i could have done much more". Its a recurring issue im working on.)

I clearly felt like i was running after her with my texts, as i was trying to get her out again quickly (it was getting late) and she was taking a long time to reply.

I was not willing to walk away until she took 1h to text me back. I was begging.

Thats what i wanna avoid next time.

 

[AspiringStoic]

Good points.

Yeah, probably i take this thing too seriously and i put too much pride into it. Not good.

And i agree that its better to give it all instead of regretting having been too aloof later, but only if shes also investing.

What i was trying to say with my post was this: theres a line where persistence becomes chasing. I need to learn where that line is and stop at it, cause if i cross it ill drive her away even more.

In this case she was clearly not investing much after my invite. (I think she needed a better set. I should have stayed with her longer, rewarded her compliance with more touch, lead more strongly, moved us around a few additional locations and set better sexual/"carpe-diem" frames. That would have been good persistence. And indeed when i ejected i felt unsatisfied, a feeling of "ive been lazy and i could have done much more". Its a recurring issue im working on.)

I clearly felt like i was running after her with my texts, as i was trying to get her out again quickly (it was getting late) and she was taking a long time to reply.

I was not willing to walk away until she took 1h to text me back. I was begging.

Thats what i wanna avoid next time.

Got it. Makes sense. Then if we put it in the game analogy I mentioned, your quest is to actually improve how you played in the match.

The reason I brought this up was, I was having a argument with a friend of mine over an exact similar scenario. He had matched with a girl who was travelling and they had had some good back and forth. He had then asked her some mundane question which she had not yet replied to.

But it was the last evening where he could get her out. I was urging him to just send the date invite text and he was adamant that he would not, till she replied. He was even ready to "let this go" rather than send the text and then her not responding.

That was a bit crazy to me and I felt better to send it, if she does not reply its okay at least you have no what ifs now.

 

[Higher]

60yoc's Fearless Relentless Escalation is a game-changer for me.

Cant wait to put its contents into practice.

 

[AspiringStoic]

60yoc's Fearless Relentless Escalation is a game-changer for me.

Cant wait to put its contents into practice.

Especially his bit on opening helped me a ton. Great mindsets to reduce AA.

His escalation stuff is also great. I have put it to use in many many online dates and had amazing results. Looking forward to now getting to a stage where I can use his escalation stuff on girls I get on dates from cold approach!

 

[Higher]

Went out gaming later than usual today, with the goal of practicing some fast escalation stuff.

--

So im walking around in the old city when i spot this cute brunette. Slim figure, full sexy lips, long dress. Simple but classy.

I approach and compliment her. Shes quite receptive, but shes a bit uncomfortable due to "not being ready to meet ppl, i just arrived in the city and i have no make up and my hair is a mess". This gal is legit a natural beauty with incredible eyes, so im like, dont worry, u look great. Then i invite her to a walk and a chat.

We walk a bit, i have us stop at a place near the river and i start with some fast escalation stuff - ofc not the full thing as i dont wanna freak her out, but i slowly ramp up the tension with eye contact, proximity and touch. Shes always the one to pull back slightly - understandably not at ease - so i pull back as well and its no big deal.

I build a bit of rapport by talking a bit about myself, but i let her do most of the talking. Shes 36, eastern european, an artist and we connect on a number of things. Shes here only a few days.

I suggest we walk a bit and sit at the river. We sit down near the water - its a pretty nice env to create a conversational bubble. I get her to open up a bit about some things that are important to her while keeping my reactions and my overall energy level to a minimum - something im def not used to. I just look at her, qualify her and occasionally smile.

She does not ask many questions - by her own admission shes not used to meet strangers. A couple of times i gently go for the mutual hand caressing, but she pulls back slowly. Shes not ready, so i dont insist. I also touch her a few times on her neck, leg and arm.

At one point i compliment her in a way she finds a bit cheesy, and she sorta makes fun of it a bit. I think shes trying to defuse the tension. I just keep quiet and look at her smiling, building up more tension instead. She laughs nervously, and i just turn my head away slowly. First time she laughs, so i take it as a good sign.

I eject more or less at this point, "but id love to see u again for a glass of wine". Shes like, sure. So we exchange whatsapps and hug goodbye.

--

All in all interesting experience.

First of all, i went out in the evening (around 6pm) and i loved it for a number of reasons - its a bit cooler and there are way many more girls around. Will do it more often.

Then, i had a lotta fun with this fast escalation stuff. I kept my energy way lower but more intense than usual. Not easy to bear the tension sometimes (i broke the silence a few times), but i felt way more in control. I barely felt any pressure at all - the pressure was all on her.

Did it work as intended? Dunno, but well find out. She stayed and followed me around, so at least it was not uncalibrated.

Ill ping this girl tomorrow and propose a meet. Ideally in my city, but shes probably not ready. I guess the best course of action is to go to her city with an excuse ("i have to meet some friends during the day, if you want we catch up tonight") to have a short meet, 1h or so, with some wine. Then ill seed another meet in my city.

Looking forward to experiment more!

 

[Higher]

Once again i gave up too quickly. Same lesson.

--

So this is still the girl from the previous post. I wanted to arrange a wine with her either thu (yesterday) or fri, cause tomorrow im traveling and shes leaving the country on mon.

This is the text exchange between number-closing her and the soft-close:

Spoiler: texts

[7/24, 19:26] Ciao X, cool to meet a fellow thinker/artist. Higher
[7/24, 19:31] Hi Higher, mutually.
[7/25, 12:20] Ciao
[7/25, 12:23] Ciao
[7/25, 12:27] Hows the city been treating u so far?
[7/25, 12:28] Going to the waterfall - curious to see…
[7/25, 12:32] The one near X i suppose
[7/25, 12:35] Nice, love that place
[7/25, 12:36] I haven’t arrived yet; but could see from the distance and yes-not bad at all
[7/25, 12:45] Enjoy, hope its not too crowded (she reacts with )

I ping her again after a few hours, and this is where i fuck up the close:

Spoiler: texts

[7/25, 16:05] So how is this waterfall? Impressive enough?
[7/25, 16:10] From 1 to 10 least at 6
[7/25, 16:10] Let’s * say
[7/25, 16:15] Sounds unexciting (ideally i would have sent this line only and waited for her response before soft-closing)
Would love to hear about what u liked and didnt, maybe with some wine (soft-close, good; best woulda been sth like, would love to hear about it, wanna catch up for some wine?)
[7/25, 17:19] Ha ha, no, it’s because not that much things can impress me (she completely ignored the soft-close; i took it as a low interest sign and didnt wanna chase)
[7/26, 10:10] Dont tell the locals
Look, i feel ure not too thrilled about meeting up, so im letting u be
[7/26, 10:13] As you wish

So basically i ejected cause i was scared of rejection / was lazy / didnt wanna chase / wanted her to be enthusiastic and to see that im cool and can walk away.

I removed all the pressure from her to give a definite answer. Silently she thanked me for that. She probably also felt that i was not that interested, or maybe that something else came up on my side and i used an excuse to ditch her.

Pretty weak.

I should have cornered her instead with, so u wanna meet?

--

I still havent nailed the right balance between persistence and willingness to walk away.

And, once again, i payed too much attention to her reactions instead of her investment. She replied very quickly to my texts after all.

Something in 60yocs material really hit me. He says:

If you’re flirting with a woman that doesn’t turn you on but looks cute and stirs up your
need for female affection of course you are going to take every setback personally. You
will view making a move as a way to see if she really likes you instead of just a tool for
getting laid.

The reason guys can’t ignore the resistance and be persistent is because of the way
they view escalation. Escalation is a tool for getting laid, not a tool to see how much
you are liked. When a guy associates her reactions as a judgment on how much she
likes him, of course he is going to be timid. Of course he is going to pout. In other
words, all the things that repulse women and make them NOT want to suck your cock.
When you want a woman for sex you escalate and are persistent. These are the most
important ingredients to getting you laid.

Pathetic, but this is my real problem. I take this shit too personally, like a judgment on myself. Thats why i give up quickly if i dont get any "strong signs of interest".

And this seeps into and contaminates everything i do with women - from opening, to number-closing, to moving us around, to escalating physically, to inviting them to do stuff, to inviting them to my place.

And potentially other areas in my life.

Fuck that.

Gotta get stronger and more resilient, otherwise ill only get the super-greens (which we all know are rare) and lose all these yellows.

Also because im putting a lotta work into this thing. Cant afford to waste time and energy walking around, approaching like a madman and extracting all these great leads, only to burn them at the first "signs of disinterests". (Which, by the way, do not exist. Only "no" is the real sign of disinterest.)

 

[gameboy]

I should have cornered her instead with, so u wanna meet?

I wouldn't even have cornered her. Just banter a bit more, and a couple of messages down the road, ask her "Hey would you like to meet up for drinks one of these days?"

I think you already diagnosed it yourself, but the way you repsonded came across really butthurt.

 

[AspiringStoic]

@Higher

I really don't think you can sway girls too much over text. At least not at my (beginner) stage. Maybe you are more advanced with Game, if so then maybe you can just ignore this. A lot of whether she comes out or not depends on the initial interaction and on other factors that are outside our control.

I think a better strategy would be look at the interactions and solidify our in person game to where the girl is eager to meet us (I know easier said than done). If the good work is done in the initial cold approach, then its better to keep texting very simple.

And from what I have seen most people including me come into this pickup thing because "we don't put ourselves out there enough and go for it."

The problem is not that we are not walking away from women. The problem is that we are not going for it with enough women.


I say why the soft close? If you had told her, you want to take her out because she was pretty and you had fun in the initial interaction, then why not just say the same thing? Go for the honest/direct close.

"Hey it was fun chatting with you. I would love to take you out for a drink and continue our conversation. When is good for you?"

Now the ball is in her court. And most importantly you have spoken your truth. You have put it out there honestly. That is the real victory.

As long as we learn to do that and be comfortable with ourselves, our desires and communicating them, the successes will come. And most importantly our self esteem will grow.